Tolkien Gateway

Forum:Canonicity

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# Non-canon
 
# Non-canon
 
Instead of a large box we could have a simple image that floats in the top right hand of the page. Perhaps just a small fancy image denoting unknown canonicity and non-canon (Canon articles needn't have an image)? --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 15:49, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
 
Instead of a large box we could have a simple image that floats in the top right hand of the page. Perhaps just a small fancy image denoting unknown canonicity and non-canon (Canon articles needn't have an image)? --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 15:49, 14 September 2010 (UTC)
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:I (mainly) agree with KingAragorn, I don’t think large boxes are needed - except probably for completely non-canon subjects: not from Tolkien’s writings at all. I like the idea of icons, and Mith’s trick is perfectly workable, certainly when implemented as template(s), that can also e.g. put the article in the relevant canonicity category.
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:As to scale, I prefer Narsil Palùrfalas’ [[Forum:Canon scale|0-5 scale]] to KingAragorn’s three options, because it fits my overview of the diversity of the Legendarium materials much better. There is much in Arda that is neither quite canon nor completely non-canon, yet very disparate in importance and acceptability. In KingAragorns scale of three, most if not all of that will end up in the middle ground of ‘Unknown canonicity’, and that term neither fits the nature and relations of sources in the Legendarium particularly well nor is it particularly helpful to the reader. In particular, there are many ‘facts’ or data that fit a ‘reasonably coherent structure’ of Eä, yet are not absolute, undoubtable, or incontestable canon. That is quite something else than saying they are of ‘unknown canonicity’.
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:In my view icons should be reasonably unobtrusive, yet reasonably informative. I picture, just as a suggestion, taking Narsil Palùrfalas scale as a basis, a circle with a number, surrounded with above ‘canon level’ and below a suitable desciptive term, e.g. 5 – ‘indisputable’, 4 – ‘acceptable’, 3 – ‘contradictable’ (or: ‘disputable’), 2 – ‘doubtful’ (or: ‘contradicted’), 1 – ‘deprecated’, 0 – ‘from adaptations’ (the zero level icon may not be needed as it might be better to retain the existing box for that), and probably differently coloured backgrounds, on a scale e.g. from green to red. They may be ‘pimped’ a bit more, but not to much, as they must remain rather small, yet readily readable at the same time.
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:With Mith’s imaginary survey of our opinions on Celeborn we should be careful to distinguish two different issues. On the one hand, we may have different opinions as to whether Celeborn is a grandson of Elmo, a grandson of Olwë, or merely a Sinda of Doriath of unknown parentage. On the other hand, we may not differ nearly so greatly on the possible canonicity range of these options. We should also not forget that articles, while they might adopt one possibility as most appropriate or coherent, other versions must nevertheless be mentioned, as Hyarion [[Forum:Canonicity and Canon|stated]].
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:And in the case of longer (and even not so long) articles, different sections may be of different canonicity. Maybe in those cases sections should be individually marked with the appropriate icon. Should we then have an icon ~ - ‘variable’ for the top of such articles (and place the article in every occuring canonicity category)? Or should we label the article with the canonicity of its basic subject (and place it in that category), only marking those sections that have different canonicity with an icon (without category)? Probably the latter course makes for less clutter and would be more helpful as a guide. — [[User:Mithrennaith|Mithrennaith]] 23:44, 14 September 2010 (UTC)

Revision as of 23:44, 14 September 2010

Tolkien Gateway > Council > Canonicity


I know that this issue has been debated and discussed before (mainly here and here), but it seems that it never really came to a conclusion - or at least what was decided wasn't wholly enforced. At the moment we have a few different ways by which we highlight articles to show that they're not canon: some are simple 'This is not considered canon', on other pages it's the canon scale. I personally liked the Canon scale discussion and the idea to put a scale on each article. I'd like to see a better set of images to use for the canon scale, and with the

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