User talk:Jools: Difference between revisions
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==Welcome!== | ==Welcome!== | ||
Hello and [[Tolkien Gateway:Welcome|welcome]] to '''[[Tolkien Gateway:About|Tolkien Gateway]]'''. I hope you like the place and choose to join our work. Here are a few good links for newcomers: | Hello and [[Tolkien Gateway:Welcome|welcome]] to '''[[Tolkien Gateway:About|Tolkien Gateway]]'''. I hope you like the place and choose to join our work. Here are a few good links for newcomers: | ||
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I hope you enjoy editing here and we look forward to your future edits. By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~<nowiki>~~</nowiki>. Four tildes (~~<nowiki>~~</nowiki>) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the [[Help:Contents|help pages]], add a question to the [[Forum:Council|Council forums]] or ask me on [[User talk:Hyarion|my talk page]]. Keep up the great work! | I hope you enjoy editing here and we look forward to your future edits. By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~<nowiki>~~</nowiki>. Four tildes (~~<nowiki>~~</nowiki>) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the [[Help:Contents|help pages]], add a question to the [[Forum:Council|Council forums]] or ask me on [[User talk:Hyarion|my talk page]]. Keep up the great work! | ||
==Languages used in the album '''In Elven Lands'''== | |||
The Elvish languages used in the album [[In Elven Lands]] are several different dialects of [[Quenya]] and [[Sindarin]], including [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]'s [[Proto Quenya]] (the so-called "Elf-Latin") and [[Neo-Quenya]]. These have all been sometimes misidentified as Neo-Elvish, however, most of the composition of the lyrics happened before [[Helge Kåre Fauskanger]] codified [[Neo-Quenya]]. Most were written before even before the collected Etymologies were published, and most of the vocabulary and grammar was taken from [[The Book of Lost Tales]] (Volumes 1 and 2) and [[Unfinished Tales|The Book of Unfinished Tales]]. | |||
The thing that many people have found confusing is that the entire work (according to the album notes) was intended to represent a corrupt later text, such as Tolkien described in the Introduction and Appendices to [[The Lord of the Rings]]. In order to create the illusion of a corrupt text (or in this case, a series of corrupt texts), the authors intentionally mutated words to account for the shifting palate, used loan-words from [[Anglo-Saxon]] and [[Sindarin]] and in one case simply mangled the pronunciation and re-transcribed the results to show the effects of the "folk music process" that often occurs over time.{{Unsigned|Jools}} | |||
:Hi and welcome to TG, Jools — and thanks for your recent contributions! From what you wrote here I understand that you're referring to [http://www.tolkiengateway.net/w/index.php?title=In_Elven_Lands&action=historysubmit&diff=227484&oldid=227483 this edit] of the page ''In Elven Lands'', and that you are critical of the change of "dialects of Quenya and Sindarin" to "Neo-Elvish (Quenya, Sindarin)". According to how you describe the linguistic process behind the lyrics, I would personally say it seems fair to describe it as "Neo-Elvish" (a term not limited to Fauskanger's version of Quenya). My suggestion, in order to make it clear to a reader that the album doesn't merely reproduce Elvish texts from Tolkien's corpus, would perhaps be to change the text back to "The songs on the album are [[Neo-Elvish|written in dialects]] of [[Quenya]], [[Sindarin]], [...]". Any thoughts? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 18:56, 11 March 2013 (UTC) | |||
Revision as of 18:56, 11 March 2013
Welcome!
Hello and welcome to Tolkien Gateway. I hope you like the place and choose to join our work. Here are a few good links for newcomers:
- Internal pages:
- External Wikipedia pages:
I hope you enjoy editing here and we look forward to your future edits. By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the Council forums or ask me on my talk page. Keep up the great work!
Languages used in the album In Elven Lands
The Elvish languages used in the album In Elven Lands are several different dialects of Quenya and Sindarin, including J.R.R. Tolkien's Proto Quenya (the so-called "Elf-Latin") and Neo-Quenya. These have all been sometimes misidentified as Neo-Elvish, however, most of the composition of the lyrics happened before Helge Kåre Fauskanger codified Neo-Quenya. Most were written before even before the collected Etymologies were published, and most of the vocabulary and grammar was taken from The Book of Lost Tales (Volumes 1 and 2) and The Book of Unfinished Tales.
The thing that many people have found confusing is that the entire work (according to the album notes) was intended to represent a corrupt later text, such as Tolkien described in the Introduction and Appendices to The Lord of the Rings. In order to create the illusion of a corrupt text (or in this case, a series of corrupt texts), the authors intentionally mutated words to account for the shifting palate, used loan-words from Anglo-Saxon and Sindarin and in one case simply mangled the pronunciation and re-transcribed the results to show the effects of the "folk music process" that often occurs over time.—Unsigned comment by Jools (talk • contribs).
- Hi and welcome to TG, Jools — and thanks for your recent contributions! From what you wrote here I understand that you're referring to this edit of the page In Elven Lands, and that you are critical of the change of "dialects of Quenya and Sindarin" to "Neo-Elvish (Quenya, Sindarin)". According to how you describe the linguistic process behind the lyrics, I would personally say it seems fair to describe it as "Neo-Elvish" (a term not limited to Fauskanger's version of Quenya). My suggestion, in order to make it clear to a reader that the album doesn't merely reproduce Elvish texts from Tolkien's corpus, would perhaps be to change the text back to "The songs on the album are written in dialects of Quenya, Sindarin, [...]". Any thoughts? --Morgan 18:56, 11 March 2013 (UTC)
