Tolkien Gateway

Talk:First Age

Maybe I'm mistaken, but I always thought that the First Age started with the rising of the Sun and the Awakening of Men. This is supported by the articles Timeline and Timeline/First Age. --Earendilyon 10:02, 15 December 2014 (UTC)

The Timeline (and its sub-pages) are undergoing revision by me; currently the article is incorrect as it only shows Years of the Sun and not Years of the Trees. In terms of this article, it's a bit a mess but fundamentally the First Age started at least in YT 1050 at the awakening of Elves. --Mith (Talk/Contribs/Edits) 10:20, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
The Silmarillion or the LOTR Appendicies don't specifically mention when the FA started. If you look at the Foster's Guide, he suggests that the FA started perhaps with the creation of Arda OR the creation of the Trees OR the Awakening of the Elves.
The conventional date F.A. 1 is used only in Tolkienology or fandom, not by Tolkien himself. It doesn't mean "first year of the First Age" (as happens with S.A. 1 and T.A. 1 which are the first years of their respective Ages) but rather "first solar year". Sage 12:51, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
Just to clarify, the terminology "F.A. 1" is used by Tolkien but does not mean the start of the First Age (as you rightly point out). The first line of the Foreword to The Silmarillion states "The Silmarillion, now published four years after the death of its author, is an account of the Elder Days, or the First Age of the World." Morgoth's Ring states (p. 51) that the First Age began with the wakening of the Elves, but other texts imply that it began with the foundation of Arda (usually under the description of the "Elder Days"). --Mith (Talk/Contribs/Edits) 13:24, 15 December 2014 (UTC)
Guess I was mistaken, all that time :-p In my mind, the timeline was Years of the Lamps, Years of the Trees, Years of the Sun, subdivided in FA, SA, TA and FoA. Remains the problem of counting years before the Sun was created... Without the Sun, you have no days, let alone years! The light of the Trees waxed and waned twice "per day", if I'm correct, but how to count the hours of a day? --Earendilyon 07:19, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
It is a common misconception, I don't know where I first saw it, perhaps David Day's works. The "hours" of the Trees are described in the chapter Of the Beginning of Days, which is laid down more comprehensively in the article Years of the Trees. Sage 10:36, 18 December 2014 (UTC)
On Michael Martinez's site Tolkien Gateway is accused of portraying a false interpretation of the several ages. Perhaps one of our admins could send him a message? --Earendilyon 12:54, 22 December 2014 (UTC)
Indeed, for some reason Martinez claims that the counting of the Ages as Ages of the Children of Iluvatar was an abandoned concept. For this reason I suggested to remove the title from the timeline template and use the more neutral/vague term "Ages". Sage 20:52, 27 December 2014 (UTC)