Tolkien Gateway - User contributions [en]

User talk:BalrogTrainer

2016-02-17T20:00:53Z

85.72.212.188: /* Wrong Photo */

{{Template:Welcome|realName=A.D. Josephson|name=BalrogTrainer}}

-- [[User:Mith|'''Mith''']] ([[User talk:Mith|'''Talk''']]/[[Special:Contributions/Mith|Contribs]]/[[Special:Editcount/Mith/Edits|Edits]]) 02:02, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

== Images ==
We have rules about images, both in naming and tagging. See [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Dwalin.jpg|here]] for an example. Also, make sure the images are at least 300px wide. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:24, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

:OK, gotcha. I'm still trying to feel my way through this whole image posting thing. Obviously I need more practice. Feel free to delete any files I uploaded that won't work. Thanks.{{unsigned|BalrogTrainer}}

::Could I also add that all images should be categorised and have a licence template attached. When you upload an image there is a "Licensing" dropdown menu to select which copyright template to attach to the file (in this case Warner Bros.); all images '''must''' have a licensing template for copyright reasons. As for categories, we have standard naming conventions:

::*'''Characters/locations/events''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images of XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the character/location/event;
::*'''Adaptations''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images from XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the adaptation ''in the same format as the article''. For example, the 1978 film of The Lord of the Rings is "[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]" so the category is "[[:Category:Images from The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]".

::Ideally, you should endeavour to include the adaptation it is from and as many characters/locations/events as depicted in the image. Take a look at [http://tolkiengateway.net/w/index.php?title=File%3AThe_Hobbit_%281977_film%29_-_Nori.png&action=historysubmit&diff=238197&oldid=238191 the change I just made] to [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Nori.png|the image of Nori you uploaded]] to see an example of how this works in practice. If you have any other questions, do let me know! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 00:23, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. However, I forgot to do the licencing step for the image of Fíli (and perhaps a couple others) that I just uploaded. : / If you could amend this, it would be much appreciated.

== Stubbing scenes ==
If you create a scene article, can you at least include more info on it than just "it's a scene"? Preferably, a page should look like [[Prologue: A Ring's Tale|this]], with info on length and stuff. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:21, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
:How were whomever started the articles for all the individual scenes from the LOTR films able to get away with it then? : / At any rate, I'll stop for now, since, frankly, I've done enough rehashing of AUJ's storyline for a while between completing the 'Plot' and 'Deviations from the source material' sections of its main article. : P

== Signing Comments ==

I've noticed that on talk pages you often don't sign your comments. To sign a comment just write "<nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>" at the end, or click the signature button in the toolbox (it looks like a pencil signing). If you're interested in setting up a custom signature (like [[User:Mith/sig|mine]], [[User:Ederchil/sig|Ederchil's]] or [[User:KingAragorn/sig|KingAragorn's]]) see [[Help:Signatures]]. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 11:36, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
:Thanks. I've been wondering how to do that. Here goes!--[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 14:28, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

== Creating categories ==

It's great that you're uploading lots of new images, but don't forget that if a category doesn't exist - [[:File:The Lord of the Rings - The Return of the King - Great Beasts.jpg|like on this file]] - you will need to create the category yourself (when any link is red it means the target page doesn't doesn't exist). To create it, simply click on the link, add the text, and click save. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:11, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

:I'd like to reiterate the above message with respect to [[:File:The Hobbit - The Desolation of Smaug - Lethuin.jpg|this image]]. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 17:08, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

::Sorry, I keep forgetting. : / --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:51, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

==Tauriel==
Hello! As you seem to have good knowledge about PJ's films: do you know if the recently added text about [[Tauriel]] being inspired by the "captain of the Elvenking's guard" was the filmmakers' intention or if it's pure speculation?--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 13:42, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not entirely sure. It's quite possible Tauriel was based on the mention of that character, but I think it was more about just getting a female character into the story. Since it's still just speculation, it should probably be removed. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 13:50, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

::Thanks. I wondered if the issue was discussed in any of the audio commentaries (or similar official sources), but since this doens't appear to be the case, I'll remove it.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 14:01, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

== Fair use ==

Fair use does not mean using an image fairly - copyrighted images are still copyrighted. I checked both those websites with the source of the Antony Sher picture and neither gave us permission to use them. Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:04, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

:SIGH. The image you uploaded said "All Rights Reserved." i.e. we have no right to use it. I specifically said "Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images." --{{User:Mith/sig}} 15:34, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

==Ogres==

Is the name ''Ogre'' officially used for the troll-like monsters (the one appearing in the [[:File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Ogre.jpg|file]] you uploaded) in BoFA? I can't recall if they are ever named in the film, but perhaps they are described in film-related books? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 16:52, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
:It's what I've seen other sites label them citing movie books, so I'm assuming it's legitimate. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:26, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

::Nonetheless, it needs a primary source. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 09:57, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

:::Page 221 of ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: Art & Design]]'' says they used the mentioning of an "ogre" in "[[Riddles in the Dark]]" ("''Poor Bilbo sat in the dark thinking of all the horrible names of all the giants and ogres he had ever heard told of in tales, but not one of them had done all these things.''") as an opportunity to create a new creature larger than an orc and smaller than a troll. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:39, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

==Bolg==
If you check the Internet you will see that Conan Stevens does not porteay Bolg but an orc called Unnamed Orc Brute . For more Information see the site http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Unnamed_Orc_Brute on the lord of the rings wiki and wikipedia.

:But, like it or not, Conan Stevens' character '''is''' credited as 'Bolg' in AUJ, regardless of how the character's appearance was changed for the subsequent 2 films. This source you've offered is clearly one that's been amended for the sake of continuity. Because Bolg is never identified as actually being Bolg in AUJ, one can generally get away with it... but we're trying to keep our info here as accurate as possible. Please do not make any further attempts to edit this part of Bolg's page once your ban is lifted. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 07:34, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

== Lack of photo ==

I have seen that there is only one image-poster for [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] in Tolkien Gateway. I also saw that you uploaded this image-poster of [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] that there is in Tolkien Gateway.There are many images posters of the third Hobbit film on Internet.You can find many of them on Google.I also saw that for the previous two Hobbit films there are many images-posters. 21 images-files of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]], which are posters, are upoladed on Tolkien Gateway, while for [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] 9 images-files, which are posters too, are also upoladed on Tolkien Gateway. So Why don't you upload two more images-posters in Tolkien Gateway; I dont have the ability to upload inages in Tolkien Gateway, but you do have the ability.

== Wrong Photo ==

There is a mistake in a photo.Although Azog appears in Barell scene in Mirkwood in the trailer of [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] he is not present in this scene in Mirkwood on the film [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]].This image exists only in trailer.It soesnt exist even as an official poster.I believe an image with Azog in which he eventually appears, independently if this scene exists only in The Theatrical Edition or only in the Extended Edition or both of them, should be uploaded on Tolkien Gataway.You can uplpad more than just a single image in Tolkien Gateway.You can upload two or three or four, if you want, images with Azog from The Hobbit film trilogy (as he appeared there).

*Picture Example1: It can be uploaded an image in which Azog dies in Thorins arms.This scene exists both in Theatrical and Extended Edition.
*Picture Example2: It can be uploaded an image-poster with Azog from the film [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]].

Did you understand what I am saying; If you dont understand what I am saying or have any question, you can talk to me on my talk page.This is my talk page:[[User talk:85.72.212.188|talk page]]. I have nothing else to said.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 21:31, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:BalrogTrainer

2016-02-17T19:47:59Z

85.72.212.188: /* Wrong Photo */

{{Template:Welcome|realName=A.D. Josephson|name=BalrogTrainer}}

-- [[User:Mith|'''Mith''']] ([[User talk:Mith|'''Talk''']]/[[Special:Contributions/Mith|Contribs]]/[[Special:Editcount/Mith/Edits|Edits]]) 02:02, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

== Images ==
We have rules about images, both in naming and tagging. See [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Dwalin.jpg|here]] for an example. Also, make sure the images are at least 300px wide. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:24, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

:OK, gotcha. I'm still trying to feel my way through this whole image posting thing. Obviously I need more practice. Feel free to delete any files I uploaded that won't work. Thanks.{{unsigned|BalrogTrainer}}

::Could I also add that all images should be categorised and have a licence template attached. When you upload an image there is a "Licensing" dropdown menu to select which copyright template to attach to the file (in this case Warner Bros.); all images '''must''' have a licensing template for copyright reasons. As for categories, we have standard naming conventions:

::*'''Characters/locations/events''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images of XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the character/location/event;
::*'''Adaptations''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images from XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the adaptation ''in the same format as the article''. For example, the 1978 film of The Lord of the Rings is "[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]" so the category is "[[:Category:Images from The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]".

::Ideally, you should endeavour to include the adaptation it is from and as many characters/locations/events as depicted in the image. Take a look at [http://tolkiengateway.net/w/index.php?title=File%3AThe_Hobbit_%281977_film%29_-_Nori.png&action=historysubmit&diff=238197&oldid=238191 the change I just made] to [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Nori.png|the image of Nori you uploaded]] to see an example of how this works in practice. If you have any other questions, do let me know! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 00:23, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. However, I forgot to do the licencing step for the image of Fíli (and perhaps a couple others) that I just uploaded. : / If you could amend this, it would be much appreciated.

== Stubbing scenes ==
If you create a scene article, can you at least include more info on it than just "it's a scene"? Preferably, a page should look like [[Prologue: A Ring's Tale|this]], with info on length and stuff. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:21, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
:How were whomever started the articles for all the individual scenes from the LOTR films able to get away with it then? : / At any rate, I'll stop for now, since, frankly, I've done enough rehashing of AUJ's storyline for a while between completing the 'Plot' and 'Deviations from the source material' sections of its main article. : P

== Signing Comments ==

I've noticed that on talk pages you often don't sign your comments. To sign a comment just write "<nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>" at the end, or click the signature button in the toolbox (it looks like a pencil signing). If you're interested in setting up a custom signature (like [[User:Mith/sig|mine]], [[User:Ederchil/sig|Ederchil's]] or [[User:KingAragorn/sig|KingAragorn's]]) see [[Help:Signatures]]. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 11:36, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
:Thanks. I've been wondering how to do that. Here goes!--[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 14:28, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

== Creating categories ==

It's great that you're uploading lots of new images, but don't forget that if a category doesn't exist - [[:File:The Lord of the Rings - The Return of the King - Great Beasts.jpg|like on this file]] - you will need to create the category yourself (when any link is red it means the target page doesn't doesn't exist). To create it, simply click on the link, add the text, and click save. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:11, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

:I'd like to reiterate the above message with respect to [[:File:The Hobbit - The Desolation of Smaug - Lethuin.jpg|this image]]. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 17:08, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

::Sorry, I keep forgetting. : / --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:51, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

==Tauriel==
Hello! As you seem to have good knowledge about PJ's films: do you know if the recently added text about [[Tauriel]] being inspired by the "captain of the Elvenking's guard" was the filmmakers' intention or if it's pure speculation?--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 13:42, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not entirely sure. It's quite possible Tauriel was based on the mention of that character, but I think it was more about just getting a female character into the story. Since it's still just speculation, it should probably be removed. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 13:50, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

::Thanks. I wondered if the issue was discussed in any of the audio commentaries (or similar official sources), but since this doens't appear to be the case, I'll remove it.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 14:01, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

== Fair use ==

Fair use does not mean using an image fairly - copyrighted images are still copyrighted. I checked both those websites with the source of the Antony Sher picture and neither gave us permission to use them. Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:04, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

:SIGH. The image you uploaded said "All Rights Reserved." i.e. we have no right to use it. I specifically said "Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images." --{{User:Mith/sig}} 15:34, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

==Ogres==

Is the name ''Ogre'' officially used for the troll-like monsters (the one appearing in the [[:File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Ogre.jpg|file]] you uploaded) in BoFA? I can't recall if they are ever named in the film, but perhaps they are described in film-related books? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 16:52, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
:It's what I've seen other sites label them citing movie books, so I'm assuming it's legitimate. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:26, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

::Nonetheless, it needs a primary source. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 09:57, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

:::Page 221 of ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: Art & Design]]'' says they used the mentioning of an "ogre" in "[[Riddles in the Dark]]" ("''Poor Bilbo sat in the dark thinking of all the horrible names of all the giants and ogres he had ever heard told of in tales, but not one of them had done all these things.''") as an opportunity to create a new creature larger than an orc and smaller than a troll. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:39, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

==Bolg==
If you check the Internet you will see that Conan Stevens does not porteay Bolg but an orc called Unnamed Orc Brute . For more Information see the site http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Unnamed_Orc_Brute on the lord of the rings wiki and wikipedia.

:But, like it or not, Conan Stevens' character '''is''' credited as 'Bolg' in AUJ, regardless of how the character's appearance was changed for the subsequent 2 films. This source you've offered is clearly one that's been amended for the sake of continuity. Because Bolg is never identified as actually being Bolg in AUJ, one can generally get away with it... but we're trying to keep our info here as accurate as possible. Please do not make any further attempts to edit this part of Bolg's page once your ban is lifted. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 07:34, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

== Lack of photo ==

I have seen that there is only one image-poster for [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] in Tolkien Gateway. I also saw that you uploaded this image-poster of [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] that there is in Tolkien Gateway.There are many images posters of the third Hobbit film on Internet.You can find many of them on Google.I also saw that for the previous two Hobbit films there are many images-posters. 21 images-files of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]], which are posters, are upoladed on Tolkien Gateway, while for [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] 9 images-files, which are posters too, are also upoladed on Tolkien Gateway. So Why don't you upload two more images-posters in Tolkien Gateway; I dont have the ability to upload inages in Tolkien Gateway, but you do have the ability.

== Wrong Photo ==

There is a mistake in a photo.Although Azog appears in Barell scene in Mirkwood in the trailer of [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] he is not present in this scene in Mirkwood on the film [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]].This image exists only in trailer.It soesnt exist even as an official poster.I believe an image with Azog in which he eventually appears, independently if this scene exists only in The Theatrical Edition or only in the Extended Edition or both of them, should be uploaded on Tolkien Gataway.You can uplpad more than just a single image in Tolkien Gateway.You can upload two or three or four, if you want, images with Azog from The Hobbit film trilogy (as he appeared there).

Picture Example1: It can be uploaded an image in which Azog dies in Thorins arms.This scene exists both in Theatrical and Extended Edition.
Picture Example2: It can be uploaded an image-poster with Azog from the film [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]].

Did you understand what I am saying; If you dont understand what I am saying or have any question, you can talk to me on my talk page.This is my talk page:[[User talk:85.72.212.188|talk page]]. I have nothing else to said.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 21:31, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:BalrogTrainer

2016-02-17T19:47:27Z

85.72.212.188: /* Wrong Photo */

{{Template:Welcome|realName=A.D. Josephson|name=BalrogTrainer}}

-- [[User:Mith|'''Mith''']] ([[User talk:Mith|'''Talk''']]/[[Special:Contributions/Mith|Contribs]]/[[Special:Editcount/Mith/Edits|Edits]]) 02:02, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

== Images ==
We have rules about images, both in naming and tagging. See [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Dwalin.jpg|here]] for an example. Also, make sure the images are at least 300px wide. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:24, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

:OK, gotcha. I'm still trying to feel my way through this whole image posting thing. Obviously I need more practice. Feel free to delete any files I uploaded that won't work. Thanks.{{unsigned|BalrogTrainer}}

::Could I also add that all images should be categorised and have a licence template attached. When you upload an image there is a "Licensing" dropdown menu to select which copyright template to attach to the file (in this case Warner Bros.); all images '''must''' have a licensing template for copyright reasons. As for categories, we have standard naming conventions:

::*'''Characters/locations/events''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images of XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the character/location/event;
::*'''Adaptations''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images from XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the adaptation ''in the same format as the article''. For example, the 1978 film of The Lord of the Rings is "[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]" so the category is "[[:Category:Images from The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]".

::Ideally, you should endeavour to include the adaptation it is from and as many characters/locations/events as depicted in the image. Take a look at [http://tolkiengateway.net/w/index.php?title=File%3AThe_Hobbit_%281977_film%29_-_Nori.png&action=historysubmit&diff=238197&oldid=238191 the change I just made] to [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Nori.png|the image of Nori you uploaded]] to see an example of how this works in practice. If you have any other questions, do let me know! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 00:23, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. However, I forgot to do the licencing step for the image of Fíli (and perhaps a couple others) that I just uploaded. : / If you could amend this, it would be much appreciated.

== Stubbing scenes ==
If you create a scene article, can you at least include more info on it than just "it's a scene"? Preferably, a page should look like [[Prologue: A Ring's Tale|this]], with info on length and stuff. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:21, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
:How were whomever started the articles for all the individual scenes from the LOTR films able to get away with it then? : / At any rate, I'll stop for now, since, frankly, I've done enough rehashing of AUJ's storyline for a while between completing the 'Plot' and 'Deviations from the source material' sections of its main article. : P

== Signing Comments ==

I've noticed that on talk pages you often don't sign your comments. To sign a comment just write "<nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>" at the end, or click the signature button in the toolbox (it looks like a pencil signing). If you're interested in setting up a custom signature (like [[User:Mith/sig|mine]], [[User:Ederchil/sig|Ederchil's]] or [[User:KingAragorn/sig|KingAragorn's]]) see [[Help:Signatures]]. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 11:36, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
:Thanks. I've been wondering how to do that. Here goes!--[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 14:28, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

== Creating categories ==

It's great that you're uploading lots of new images, but don't forget that if a category doesn't exist - [[:File:The Lord of the Rings - The Return of the King - Great Beasts.jpg|like on this file]] - you will need to create the category yourself (when any link is red it means the target page doesn't doesn't exist). To create it, simply click on the link, add the text, and click save. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:11, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

:I'd like to reiterate the above message with respect to [[:File:The Hobbit - The Desolation of Smaug - Lethuin.jpg|this image]]. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 17:08, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

::Sorry, I keep forgetting. : / --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:51, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

==Tauriel==
Hello! As you seem to have good knowledge about PJ's films: do you know if the recently added text about [[Tauriel]] being inspired by the "captain of the Elvenking's guard" was the filmmakers' intention or if it's pure speculation?--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 13:42, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not entirely sure. It's quite possible Tauriel was based on the mention of that character, but I think it was more about just getting a female character into the story. Since it's still just speculation, it should probably be removed. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 13:50, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

::Thanks. I wondered if the issue was discussed in any of the audio commentaries (or similar official sources), but since this doens't appear to be the case, I'll remove it.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 14:01, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

== Fair use ==

Fair use does not mean using an image fairly - copyrighted images are still copyrighted. I checked both those websites with the source of the Antony Sher picture and neither gave us permission to use them. Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:04, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

:SIGH. The image you uploaded said "All Rights Reserved." i.e. we have no right to use it. I specifically said "Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images." --{{User:Mith/sig}} 15:34, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

==Ogres==

Is the name ''Ogre'' officially used for the troll-like monsters (the one appearing in the [[:File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Ogre.jpg|file]] you uploaded) in BoFA? I can't recall if they are ever named in the film, but perhaps they are described in film-related books? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 16:52, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
:It's what I've seen other sites label them citing movie books, so I'm assuming it's legitimate. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:26, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

::Nonetheless, it needs a primary source. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 09:57, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

:::Page 221 of ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: Art & Design]]'' says they used the mentioning of an "ogre" in "[[Riddles in the Dark]]" ("''Poor Bilbo sat in the dark thinking of all the horrible names of all the giants and ogres he had ever heard told of in tales, but not one of them had done all these things.''") as an opportunity to create a new creature larger than an orc and smaller than a troll. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:39, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

==Bolg==
If you check the Internet you will see that Conan Stevens does not porteay Bolg but an orc called Unnamed Orc Brute . For more Information see the site http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Unnamed_Orc_Brute on the lord of the rings wiki and wikipedia.

:But, like it or not, Conan Stevens' character '''is''' credited as 'Bolg' in AUJ, regardless of how the character's appearance was changed for the subsequent 2 films. This source you've offered is clearly one that's been amended for the sake of continuity. Because Bolg is never identified as actually being Bolg in AUJ, one can generally get away with it... but we're trying to keep our info here as accurate as possible. Please do not make any further attempts to edit this part of Bolg's page once your ban is lifted. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 07:34, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

== Lack of photo ==

I have seen that there is only one image-poster for [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] in Tolkien Gateway. I also saw that you uploaded this image-poster of [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] that there is in Tolkien Gateway.There are many images posters of the third Hobbit film on Internet.You can find many of them on Google.I also saw that for the previous two Hobbit films there are many images-posters. 21 images-files of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]], which are posters, are upoladed on Tolkien Gateway, while for [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] 9 images-files, which are posters too, are also upoladed on Tolkien Gateway. So Why don't you upload two more images-posters in Tolkien Gateway; I dont have the ability to upload inages in Tolkien Gateway, but you do have the ability.

== Wrong Photo ==

There is a mistake in a photo.Although Azog appears in Barell scene in Mirkwood in the trailer of [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] he is not present in this scene in Mirkwood on the film [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]].This image exists only in trailer.It soesnt exist even as an official poster.I believe an image with Azog in which he eventually appears, independently if this scene exists only in The Theatrical Edition or only in the Extended Edition or both of them, should be uploaded on Tolkien Gataway.You can uplpad more than just a single image in Tolkien Gateway.You can upload two or three or four, if you want, images with Azog from The Hobbit film trilogy (as he appeared there).

Picture Example1: It can be uploaded an image in which Azog dies in Thorins arms.This scene exists both in Theatrical and Extended Edition.
Picture Example2: It can be uploaded an image-poster with Azog from the film [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]].

Did you understand what I am saying; If you dont understand what I am saying or have any question, you can talk to me on my talk page.This is my talk page:[[User talk:85.72.212.188|talk page]]. I have nothing more to said.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 21:31, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:BalrogTrainer

2016-02-17T19:40:14Z

85.72.212.188: /* Wrong Photo */ new section

{{Template:Welcome|realName=A.D. Josephson|name=BalrogTrainer}}

-- [[User:Mith|'''Mith''']] ([[User talk:Mith|'''Talk''']]/[[Special:Contributions/Mith|Contribs]]/[[Special:Editcount/Mith/Edits|Edits]]) 02:02, 13 April 2013 (UTC)

== Images ==
We have rules about images, both in naming and tagging. See [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Dwalin.jpg|here]] for an example. Also, make sure the images are at least 300px wide. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:24, 28 December 2013 (UTC)

:OK, gotcha. I'm still trying to feel my way through this whole image posting thing. Obviously I need more practice. Feel free to delete any files I uploaded that won't work. Thanks.{{unsigned|BalrogTrainer}}

::Could I also add that all images should be categorised and have a licence template attached. When you upload an image there is a "Licensing" dropdown menu to select which copyright template to attach to the file (in this case Warner Bros.); all images '''must''' have a licensing template for copyright reasons. As for categories, we have standard naming conventions:

::*'''Characters/locations/events''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images of XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the character/location/event;
::*'''Adaptations''' - these always take the form of <nowiki>[[Category:Images from XXX]]</nowiki> where "XXX" is the name of the adaptation ''in the same format as the article''. For example, the 1978 film of The Lord of the Rings is "[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]" so the category is "[[:Category:Images from The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)]]".

::Ideally, you should endeavour to include the adaptation it is from and as many characters/locations/events as depicted in the image. Take a look at [http://tolkiengateway.net/w/index.php?title=File%3AThe_Hobbit_%281977_film%29_-_Nori.png&action=historysubmit&diff=238197&oldid=238191 the change I just made] to [[:File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Nori.png|the image of Nori you uploaded]] to see an example of how this works in practice. If you have any other questions, do let me know! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 00:23, 30 December 2013 (UTC)

Thanks for the tip. However, I forgot to do the licencing step for the image of Fíli (and perhaps a couple others) that I just uploaded. : / If you could amend this, it would be much appreciated.

== Stubbing scenes ==
If you create a scene article, can you at least include more info on it than just "it's a scene"? Preferably, a page should look like [[Prologue: A Ring's Tale|this]], with info on length and stuff. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:21, 4 July 2014 (UTC)
:How were whomever started the articles for all the individual scenes from the LOTR films able to get away with it then? : / At any rate, I'll stop for now, since, frankly, I've done enough rehashing of AUJ's storyline for a while between completing the 'Plot' and 'Deviations from the source material' sections of its main article. : P

== Signing Comments ==

I've noticed that on talk pages you often don't sign your comments. To sign a comment just write "<nowiki>--~~~~</nowiki>" at the end, or click the signature button in the toolbox (it looks like a pencil signing). If you're interested in setting up a custom signature (like [[User:Mith/sig|mine]], [[User:Ederchil/sig|Ederchil's]] or [[User:KingAragorn/sig|KingAragorn's]]) see [[Help:Signatures]]. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 11:36, 18 August 2014 (UTC)
:Thanks. I've been wondering how to do that. Here goes!--[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 14:28, 18 August 2014 (UTC)

== Creating categories ==

It's great that you're uploading lots of new images, but don't forget that if a category doesn't exist - [[:File:The Lord of the Rings - The Return of the King - Great Beasts.jpg|like on this file]] - you will need to create the category yourself (when any link is red it means the target page doesn't doesn't exist). To create it, simply click on the link, add the text, and click save. I hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:11, 25 August 2014 (UTC)

:I'd like to reiterate the above message with respect to [[:File:The Hobbit - The Desolation of Smaug - Lethuin.jpg|this image]]. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 17:08, 4 December 2014 (UTC)

::Sorry, I keep forgetting. : / --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:51, 5 December 2014 (UTC)

==Tauriel==
Hello! As you seem to have good knowledge about PJ's films: do you know if the recently added text about [[Tauriel]] being inspired by the "captain of the Elvenking's guard" was the filmmakers' intention or if it's pure speculation?--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 13:42, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not entirely sure. It's quite possible Tauriel was based on the mention of that character, but I think it was more about just getting a female character into the story. Since it's still just speculation, it should probably be removed. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 13:50, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

::Thanks. I wondered if the issue was discussed in any of the audio commentaries (or similar official sources), but since this doens't appear to be the case, I'll remove it.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 14:01, 5 January 2015 (UTC)

== Fair use ==

Fair use does not mean using an image fairly - copyrighted images are still copyrighted. I checked both those websites with the source of the Antony Sher picture and neither gave us permission to use them. Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:04, 13 January 2015 (UTC)

:SIGH. The image you uploaded said "All Rights Reserved." i.e. we have no right to use it. I specifically said "Flickr is a very good source of Creative Commons-licenced images." --{{User:Mith/sig}} 15:34, 15 January 2015 (UTC)

==Ogres==

Is the name ''Ogre'' officially used for the troll-like monsters (the one appearing in the [[:File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Ogre.jpg|file]] you uploaded) in BoFA? I can't recall if they are ever named in the film, but perhaps they are described in film-related books? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 16:52, 25 March 2015 (UTC)
:It's what I've seen other sites label them citing movie books, so I'm assuming it's legitimate. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 01:26, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

::Nonetheless, it needs a primary source. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 09:57, 26 March 2015 (UTC)

:::Page 221 of ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: Art & Design]]'' says they used the mentioning of an "ogre" in "[[Riddles in the Dark]]" ("''Poor Bilbo sat in the dark thinking of all the horrible names of all the giants and ogres he had ever heard told of in tales, but not one of them had done all these things.''") as an opportunity to create a new creature larger than an orc and smaller than a troll. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:39, 1 April 2015 (UTC)

==Bolg==
If you check the Internet you will see that Conan Stevens does not porteay Bolg but an orc called Unnamed Orc Brute . For more Information see the site http://lotr.wikia.com/wiki/Unnamed_Orc_Brute on the lord of the rings wiki and wikipedia.

:But, like it or not, Conan Stevens' character '''is''' credited as 'Bolg' in AUJ, regardless of how the character's appearance was changed for the subsequent 2 films. This source you've offered is clearly one that's been amended for the sake of continuity. Because Bolg is never identified as actually being Bolg in AUJ, one can generally get away with it... but we're trying to keep our info here as accurate as possible. Please do not make any further attempts to edit this part of Bolg's page once your ban is lifted. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 07:34, 20 November 2015 (UTC)

== Lack of photo ==

I have seen that there is only one image-poster for [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] in Tolkien Gateway. I also saw that you uploaded this image-poster of [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] that there is in Tolkien Gateway.There are many images posters of the third Hobbit film on Internet.You can find many of them on Google.I also saw that for the previous two Hobbit films there are many images-posters. 21 images-files of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]], which are posters, are upoladed on Tolkien Gateway, while for [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] 9 images-files, which are posters too, are also upoladed on Tolkien Gateway. So Why don't you upload two more images-posters in Tolkien Gateway; I dont have the ability to upload inages in Tolkien Gateway, but you do have the ability.

== Wrong Photo ==

There is a mistake in a photo.Although Azog appears in Barell scene in Mirkwood in the trailer of [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] he is not present in this scene in Mirkwood on the film [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]].I believe an image with Azog in which he eventually appears, independently this scene exists in The Theatrical Edition or in the Extended Edition or both of them, should be uploaded on Tolkien Gataway.You can uplpad more than just a single image in Tolkien Gateway.You can upload two or three or four, if you want, images with Azog from The Hobbit film trilogy (as he appeared there).

Picture Example: It can be uploaded a picture in which Azog dies in Thorins arms.This scene exists both in Theatrical and Extended Edition.

Did you understand what I am saying; If you dont understand what I am saying or have any question, you can talk to me on my talk page.This is my talk page:[[User talk:85.72.212.188|talk page]]. I have nothing more to said.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 21:31, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-17T01:10:49Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
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<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

= 2016 =
== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why doesn't exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;
:SIGN. YOUR. POSTS.
:I asked a very similar question. Not why does it exist, but why should it exist? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 01:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

i have a question. Then why does the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' exist;For the same reason this category exist, this new categories that I suggested should be added.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 16:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:It exists because it was created, but never filled, and then abandoned. I asked a counter-question - why should that old category exist? If we were to have this for LotR and the Hobbit, we should have this for every last adaptation - and that is overkill. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:09, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:Then you have to delete this category(the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' ), but I dont think this is a bad idea.The opposite one.It's a good idea.For this reason I suggest to be created s similar category, but for the hobbit film series this time.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 17:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:My point is: if we have one for the Hobbit movies (and LotR), we need one for EVERY adaptation, otherwise it's random. And we're not having that. So yeah, I'll probably get rid of that cat soon. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I didn't say for every adaption of Middle Earth.I talked about only film adaptions.It doesnt matter the kind of adaptions (if these adaptions are animated or live action or if these adaptions are for television-tv movies or tv series-or for cinema).Did you understand what I am saying; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}
::Did you understand what I was saying? Apparently not. a) SIGN YOUR POSTS. b) I didn't say you suggested that - having counterpart categories is an essential part of categorizing wikis. Having just a category for Hobbit or LotR actors is like just having a category for English or American people. You'll have to categorize EVERYONE, or none. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I disagree.I would like to explain some things. First, I have signed my last posts.Second what you added right now in pages [[Christopher Lee]] , [[Orlando Bloom]] and [[Elijah Wood]] I didnt think about it.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 19:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

::You were repeatedly told to sign your posts. Not just today. Also, what I did (and also what you did) to those articles is irrelevant to the discussion. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:03, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I didn't want to disturb you.Whatever question you want to ask me about that matter, just do it.Ask me whatever you want about the point.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 01:21, 15 February 2016 (UTC)

==Complaint and Explanations ==
Fool.Why did you do that? After all I have done? After all the editings that I have done in Tolkien Gateway;This is the way you thank me:By blogging me; If you want to complain about my behaviour youcan discuss about it either on my talk page or on your talk page.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 01:10, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-16T23:13:28Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

= 2016 =
== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why doesn't exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;
:SIGN. YOUR. POSTS.
:I asked a very similar question. Not why does it exist, but why should it exist? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 01:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

i have a question. Then why does the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' exist;For the same reason this category exist, this new categories that I suggested should be added.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 16:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:It exists because it was created, but never filled, and then abandoned. I asked a counter-question - why should that old category exist? If we were to have this for LotR and the Hobbit, we should have this for every last adaptation - and that is overkill. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:09, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:Then you have to delete this category(the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' ), but I dont think this is a bad idea.The opposite one.It's a good idea.For this reason I suggest to be created s similar category, but for the hobbit film series this time.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 17:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:My point is: if we have one for the Hobbit movies (and LotR), we need one for EVERY adaptation, otherwise it's random. And we're not having that. So yeah, I'll probably get rid of that cat soon. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I didn't say for every adaption of Middle Earth.I talked about only film adaptions.It doesnt matter the kind of adaptions (if these adaptions are animated or live action or if these adaptions are for television-tv movies or tv series-or for cinema).Did you understand what I am saying; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}
::Did you understand what I was saying? Apparently not. a) SIGN YOUR POSTS. b) I didn't say you suggested that - having counterpart categories is an essential part of categorizing wikis. Having just a category for Hobbit or LotR actors is like just having a category for English or American people. You'll have to categorize EVERYONE, or none. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I disagree.I would like to explain some things. First, I have signed my last posts.Second what you added right now in pages [[Christopher Lee]] , [[Orlando Bloom]] and [[Elijah Wood]] I didnt think about it.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 19:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

::You were repeatedly told to sign your posts. Not just today. Also, what I did (and also what you did) to those articles is irrelevant to the discussion. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:03, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I didn't want to disturb you.Whatever question you want to ask me about that matter, just do it.Ask me whatever you want about the point.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 01:21, 15 February 2016 (UTC)

Fool.Why did you do that? After all I have done? After all the editings that I have done in Tolkien Gateway;This is the way you thank me:By blogging me; If you want to complain about my behaviour youcan discuss about it either on my talk page or on your talk page.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 01:10, 17 February 2016 (UTC)

The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

2016-02-15T20:38:33Z

85.72.212.188: Undo revision 285964 by Mith (talk)

{{disambig-more|Battle of Five Armies|[[Battle of Five Armies (disambiguation)]]}}
{{film infobox
| image=[[File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Poster2.jpg|250px]]
| name=''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''
| director=[[Peter Jackson]]<ref name="HBTitles">{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.thehobbitblog.com/?p=2563|articlename=Titles and Release Dates Announced|dated=31-May-2011|website=[http://www.thehobbitblog.com/ The Hobbit Blog]|accessed=21-Dec-2011}}</ref> [[Andy Serkis]] (Second Unit Director)<ref name="HBAndy">
{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.thehobbitblog.com/?p=2234|articlename=Andy Serkis to serve as Second Unit Director|dated=8-April-2011|website=[http://www.thehobbitblog.com/ The Hobbit Blog]|accessed=21-Dec-2011}}</ref>
| producer=Peter Jackson [[Fran Walsh]] [[Carolynne Cunningham]] [[Philippa Boyens]] (Co-Producer) [[Ken Kamins]] (Executive Producer) [[Zane Weiner]] (Executive Producer)<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| writer=[[Guillermo del Toro]] Peter Jackson Fran Walsh Philippa Boyens<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| narrator=
| starring=[[Martin Freeman]] [[Ian McKellen]] [[Richard Armitage]]<ref name="PJCasting1">{{webcite|author=[[Peter Jackson]]|articleurl=http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150168211921558|articlename=Production begins in New Zealand on The Hobbit|dated=20-March-2011|website=FB|accessed=21-Dec-2011}}</ref> ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies#Cast|See cast section below for more]]''
| music=[[Howard Shore]]<ref name="PJCasting1"/>
| cinematography=[[Andrew Lesnie]]<ref name="PJCasting1"/>
| editing=
| studio=[[New Line Cinema]] [[MGM]] [[WingNut Films]]<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| distributor=[[Warner Bros.|Warner Bros. Pictures]]<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| released=[[17 December]] [[2014]]
| runtime='''Theatrical:''' 144 minutes '''Extended Edition:''' 164 minutes
| country=[[New Zealand]] [[United Kingdom]] [[United States]]
| language=English
| budget=
| website=[http://www.thehobbit.com/ TheHobbit.com]
| imdb_id=2310332
}}
'''''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''''' is the third of [[Peter Jackson]]'s [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]] based on [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]'s [[1937]] novel ''[[The Hobbit]]''. It premiered in London on [[1 December]] [[2014]], and saw release in most of Europe on [[10 December]] and North America on [[17 December]]. It was preceded by ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|An Unexpected Journey]]'' in [[2012]] and ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug|The Desolation of Smaug]]'' in [[2013]].

==Synopsis==
{{Blockquote|“From Academy Award®-winning filmmaker Peter Jackson comes ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'', the third in a trilogy of films adapting the enduringly popular masterpiece The Hobbit, by J.R.R. Tolkien. ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' brings to an epic conclusion the adventures of Bilbo Baggins, Thorin Oakenshield and the Company of Dwarves. Having reclaimed their homeland from the Dragon Smaug, the Company has unwittingly unleashed a deadly force into the world. Enraged, Smaug rains his fiery wrath down upon the defenseless men, women and children of Lake-town. Obsessed above all else with his reclaimed treasure, Thorin sacrifices friendship and honor to hoard it as Bilbo’s frantic attempts to make him see reason drive the Hobbit towards a desperate and dangerous choice. But there are even greater dangers ahead. Unseen by any but the Wizard Gandalf, the great enemy Sauron has sent forth legions of Orcs in a stealth attack upon the Lonely Mountain. As darkness converges on their escalating conflict, the races of Dwarves, Elves and Men must decide – unite or be destroyed. Bilbo finds himself fighting for his life and the lives of his friends in the epic Battle of the Five Armies, as the future of Middle-earth hangs in the balance.|[[Warner Bros.]] Press Release<ref name="WBPressRelease1">{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2014/06/22/90301-hobbit-3-fact-sheet-what-do-we-actually-know-about-the-hobbit-the-battle-of-the-five-armies/#synopsis|articlename=THE Hobbit 3 fact sheet: everything we know about The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies|website=[http://www.warnerbros.com/ Warner Bros.]|accessed=19-July-2014}}</ref>}}

==Plot==
[[Bilbo Baggins]] and the [[Thorin and Company|Dwarves]] watch from the [[Lonely Mountain]] as the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Smaug]] destroys [[Lake-town]]. [[Bard]] breaks out of prison and kills Smaug with the [[Black Arrow]] (brought to him by his son [[Bain]]), whose falling body crushes the fleeing [[Master of Lake-town]]. Bard - chosen as the new leader - and the people of Lake-town seek refuge in the ruins of [[Dale]]. Upon learning of her banishment from the [[Woodland Realm]], [[Tauriel]] travels to investigate [[Gundabad]] with [[Legolas]] (having previously tracked [[Bolg]] there).

Upon arriving at [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]], [[Fíli]], [[Kíli]], [[Bofur]], and [[Óin]] are informed by Bilbo that [[Thorin]] has been inflicted with Smaug's "dragon sickness" as he searched for the [[Arkenstone]]. It is revealed that Bilbo actually stole the Arkenstone from Smaug, but knows it should be hidden from Thorin, who orders the entrance of the Lonely Mountain be sealed off.

Meanwhile, having become a prisoner in [[Dol Guldur]], [[Gandalf]] is saved by [[Galadriel]]. She carries an unconscious Gandalf into a more open area while being taunted by the [[Sauron#Sauron's Return|Necromancer]]. [[Elrond]], [[Saruman]], and [[Radagast]] arrive to help rescue the Grey [[Wizards|Wizard]]. Gandalf is saved by Galadriel and given to Radagast while Elrond and Saruman hold off the [[Nazgûl]]. [[Sauron]] appears to them with the Nine at his side. Using the power of [[Nenya]] and her [[Phial of Galadriel|Phial]], Galadriel takes on the Dark Lord and the Ringwraiths, banishing them out of the fortress. Galadriel falls back fainting as Elrond supports her, realizing she has used her full strength in order to cast him away. Though Elrond believes they must warn the [[Free peoples]] of the enemy's return, Saruman tells him to take Galadriel to safety while he deals with Sauron.

Radagast provides Gandalf a horse and his staff before riding to Dale. At that time, [[Azog]] the Defiler approaches the Lonely Mountain with his vast [[Orcs|Orc]] army while learning from Bolg that an [[Elves|Elf]] army under the lead of [[Thranduil]] is also approaching. Azog tells Bolg to head to Gundabad and ready their other army. Following Bolg to the fortress of Gundabad, Legolas and Tauriel see Bolg with another army of Orcs and hundreds of war-bred [[bats]]. They decide to return to Lake-town to warn the others.

When Thranduil's army arrives in Dale, he forges an allegiance with Bard to claim a necklace of white gems from Thorin's treasure. Though Bard attempts to reason with Thorin to avoid further bloodshed, the stubborn [[Dwarves|Dwarf]] refuses to listen, much to his Company's dismay. As they prepare for the battle, Thorin gives Bilbo a ''[[mithril]]'' [[Mithril#The Mithril Coat|vest]]. Thorin begins to talk like Smaug, telling Bilbo that he will never share the treasure with Bard and Thranduil, not wanting to part with a single coin.

After Gandalf arrives at Dale, Bilbo sneaks out of the Lonely Mountain to hand the Arkenstone over to Thranduil and Bard. Inside the camp, Thranduil reminds Gandalf that he is the one who started all this and he will finish it. The next day, the Elf army and the armed people of Lake-town gather at the entrance of the Lonely Mountain to confront the Dwarves. Thranduil and Bard ride at the front, where Thorin threatens to kill them if they get any closer. Bard unveils the Arkenstone at the gates of Erebor and Thorin learns of Bilbo's actions and almost kills the [[Hobbits|Hobbit]]. Luckily, Gandalf approaches at the front with Bard and Thranduil, telling Thorin that Bilbo is his to keep. The other Dwarves hold back their leader so Bilbo can escape down the wall to Gandalf. Then, a Dwarf company under [[Dáin Ironfoot]] arrives and is about to attack the Elves, but Azog's Orc army unexpectedly arrives through underground tunnels created by [[were-worms]].

Thus, the Battle of the Five Armies begins as Azog sends one half of his army to attack the Lonely Mountain with Dáin's force defending it. While Thranduil assists Dáin, Azog sends the rest of his forces to attack Dale with Bilbo, Gandalf, Bard, and the other Elves coming to its defense. Gandalf, Thranduil, Bard, and Dain do the best they can to hold off the Orc armies as more and more come, killing more Dwarves, [[Men]], and Elves. Meanwhile, [[Alfrid]] takes a pile of treasure and escapes the battlefield, with Bard permitting him to do so.

Inside the Lonely Mountain, Thorin eventually overcomes his madness after a lengthy hallucination. Thorin and Company burst out of the Mountain and join the battle, much to Dáin's delight. While the others aid what remains of Dáin's forces, Thorin rides toward [[Ravenhill]] with [[Dwalin]], Fíli, and Kíli in order to kill Azog and send the Orc army scattering. At the same time, Legolas and Tauriel set off for Ravenhill with Bilbo following to warn the Dwarves of the second Orc army. Azog captures Fíli and stabs him in the back before throwing him off of a cliff. Bilbo is knocked out, while Bolg stabs Kíli in the chest. After Legolas kills Bolg, the Great [[Eagles]] arrive, led by Radagast and [[Beorn]], to assist in the battle, quickly decimating the Orc army. When Bilbo regains consciousness, he finds that Thorin has killed Azog but was mortally wounded in the process and dies soon after making his peace with the Hobbit. Sometime after, a disillusioned Legolas decides to leave his father's Realm. Thranduil urges him to go North to meet with one of the [[Dúnedain]], a Man who goes by the name of [[Strider (Aragorn)|"Strider"]]. Thranduil, after seeing Tauriel kiss Kíli's dead body, finally accepts Tauriel's love for Kíli and agrees with her plan to bury the Dwarf.

Bilbo bids farewell to the surviving members of Thorin's Company, telling them they are welcome to join him for tea whenever they are in [[the Shire]], to which he returns with Gandalf. As they part on the outskirts of the Shire, Gandalf reveals that he knows of the [[The One Ring|Ring]] that Bilbo found in the Goblin tunnels (though unaware that it was the One Ring) before they part ways on good terms. Bilbo's story ends when he returns to [[Bag End]] and finds the townspeople are auctioning off his belongings and are about to sell his house. The scene transitions to Bilbo on the day of his 111th birthday when he receives a visit from Gandalf, ending where ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' begins.

===Scenes===
# [[Fire and Water (scene)|Fire and Water]]
# [[Bard the Dragon-slayer]]**
# [[Dungeons of the Dark Lord]]
# [[Shores of the Long Lake (scene)|Shores of the Long Lake]]
# [[Not at Home (scene)|Not at Home]]
# [["Others Will Now Look to the Mountain"]]
# [[Legions of the Defiler]]
# [[The Mark of Gundabad]]
# [[Attack on Dol Guldur (scene)|Attack on Dol Guldur]]**
# [["Summon Our Friends"]]**
# [[The King's Jewel]]
# [[The Ruins of Dale (scene)|The Ruins of Dale]]
# [[Erebor Fortified]]
# [[The Elven-king's Aid]]**
# [[The Gathering of the Clouds (scene)|The Gathering of the Clouds]]
# [[A Token of Frienship]]
# [[The Shadow of Gundabad]]
# [["The Last Move in a Master Plan"]]
# [[Bolg of the North]]
# [[The Night Watch]]*
# [[A Thief in the Night (scene)|A Thief in the Night]]
# [[An Honest Burglar]]**
# [[Dáin Ironfoot (scene)|Dáin Ironfoot]]**
# [[The Clouds Burst (scene)|The Clouds Burst]]**
# [[The Battle at Dale]]
# [[The Darkest Hour (scene)|The Darkest Hour]]**
# [[Dragon Sickness (scene)|Dragon Sickness]]
# [[The Return of Thorin Oakenshield]]
# [[Sons of Durin (scene)|Sons of Durin]]
# [["To the King!"]]**
# [[A Call to Arms]]**
# [[Thorin's Plan]]**
# [[The War Chariot]]*
# [[Courage and Cowardice]]**
# [[The Fifth Army]]
# [[Scouting Ravenhill]]
# [[Blood of the Eldar]]
# [[An Unforeseen Remedy]]*
# [[The Fallen (scene)|The Fallen]]
# [[The Battle at Ravenhill]]**
# [[To the Death (scene)|To the Death]]**
# [[Parting in Friendship]]
# [[The Sorrow of Elves]]
# [[Eyes That Fire and Sword Have Seen]]
# [[King Under the Mountain]]*
# [[The Return Journey (scene)|The Return Journey]]
# [[The Last Stage (scene)|The Last Stage]]
# Credits

<nowiki>*</nowiki> denotes a scene only available in the Extended Edition cut of the film. 
<nowiki>**</nowiki> denotes a scene which includes extended content only available in the Extended Edition cut of the film.

==Cast==
:''See also:[[The Hobbit (film series)#Cast|''The Hobbit'' (film series)#Cast]]''
{| class="wikitable"
|- bgcolor="#CCCCCC"
! Actor !! Role
|-
| [[Richard Armitage]] || [[Thorin]]
|-
| [[Dee Bradley Baker]] || Creature Voices
|-
| Erin Banks || [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]]
|-
| [[Timothy Bartlett]] || [[Master Worrywort]]
|-
| [[John Bell]] || [[Bain]]
|-
| [[Manu Bennett]] || [[Azog]]
|-
| Nick Blake || [[Percy]]
|-
| [[Cate Blanchett]] || [[Galadriel]]
|-
| [[Orlando Bloom]] || [[Legolas]]
|-
| [[Jed Brophy]] || [[Nori]]
|-
| [[Adam Brown]] || [[Ori]]
|-
| [[John Callen]] || [[Óin]]
|-
| [[Billy Connolly]] || [[Dáin Ironfoot]]
|-
| [[Benedict Cumberbatch]] || [[Smaug]] The [[Sauron#Sauron's Return|Necromancer]]
|-
| [[Luke Evans]] || [[Bard]]
|-
| [[Martin Freeman]] || [[Bilbo Baggins]]
|-
| [[Stephen Fry]] || The [[Master of Lake-town]]
|-
| [[Ryan Gage]] || [[Alfrid]]
|-
| [[Mark Hadlow]] || [[Dori]]
|-
| [[Peter Hambleton]] || [[Glóin]]
|-
| Miranda Harcourt || [[Olga]]
|-
| [[Ian Holm]] || Older [[Bilbo Baggins]]
|-
| Brian Hotter || [[Otho Sackville-Baggins]]
|-
| [[Stephen Hunter]] || [[Bombur]]
|-
|[[Katie Jackson]] || Girl in Lake-town
|-
| Olof Johnsson || Creature Voices
|-
| [[William Kircher]] || [[Bifur]]
|-
| Kelly Kilgour || [[Soury]]
|-
| Martin Kwok || [[Ragash]] (voice)
|-
| [[Christopher Lee]] || [[Saruman|Saruman the White]]
|-
| [[Evangeline Lilly]] || [[Tauriel]]
|-
| Simon London || [[Feren]]
|-
| [[Sylvester McCoy]] || [[Radagast|Radagast the Brown]]
|-
| [[Ian McKellen]] || [[Gandalf|Gandalf the Grey]]
|-
| Thomasin McKenzie || [[Astrid]]
|-
| [[Graham McTavish]] || [[Dwalin]]
|-
| Mark Mitchinson || [[Braga]]
|-
| [[James Nesbitt]] || [[Bofur]]
|-
| Mary Nesbitt || [[Tilda]]
|-
| Peggy Nesbitt || [[Sigrid]]
|-
| [[Dean O'Gorman]] || [[Fíli]]
|-
| Jon Olson || Creature Voices
|-
| [[Lee Pace]] || [[Thranduil]]
|-
| Sarah Peirse || [[Hilda Bianca]]
|-
| [[Mikael Persbrandt]] || [[Beorn]]
|-
| Otep Shamaya || Creature Voices
|-
| Allan Smith || [[Ragash]]
|-
| Merv Smith || [[Tosser Grubb]]
|-
| [[Conan Stevens]] || Keeper of the Dungeons
|-
| [[Ken Stott]] || [[Balin]]
|-
| John Tui || [[Bolg]]
|-
| Cameron Jones || Thranduil's Lieutenant
|-
| [[Aidan Turner]] || [[Kíli]]
|-
| Hilary Norris || Laketown Woman
|-
| Lise Perishon || Laketowner
|-
| Gabriela Roque López || Laketowner
|-
| Jeff Slaven || Laketowner
|-
| Chris Reilly || Dwarf Lieutenant
|-
| [[Hugo Weaving]] || [[Elrond]]
|-
| Debra Wilson || Creature Voices
|-
|}

==Deviations from the source material==
''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' covers the final seven chapters of ''[[The Hobbit]]'' with a few elements added from the [[The Lord of the Rings Appendices|Appendices]] from ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]''. While it generally follows the story, a number of liberties were still taken:

*There is no thrush telling [[Bard]] of [[Smaug]]'s weak point while trying to kill him (having been replaced by the legend that [[Girion]] had loosened a scale on the [[Dragons|Dragon]]'s breast in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug|previous film]]). Also, his son [[Bain]] assists Bard by getting him the last [[Black Arrow]].
*Smaug directly confronts Bard after several of the Bowman's arrows deflect his hide, whereas the Dragon was unaware of him and was shot down while airborne in the book.
*The [[Master of Lake-town]] dies by Smaug falling on his boat while trying to escape [[Lake-town]] instead of starvation in the desert.
*The storyline concerning [[Legolas]] and [[Tauriel]] (who is an original character) both riding to [[Gundabad]] where they discover a second Orc army - led by [[Bolg]] - is headed to [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]] (along with thousands of [[bats]]) is invented for the film. It's this army that is designated as the fifth army in the film's eponymous battle instead of the [[Wargs|Warg]] army, as in the book.
*Also at Gundabad, Legolas divulges to Tauriel that his mother had been killed there, though there is never any mention of her in [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien's]] writings.
*As all of the members of [[Thorin and Company]] reached the [[Lonely Mountain]] together in the first place, in the books [[Óin]], [[Bofur]], [[Fíli]] and [[Kíli]] are not later coming to the Mountain alone.
*[[Galadriel]] does not free [[Gandalf]] in [[Dol Guldur]] in the books, as he never got captured in them.
*In the books, there is no hint that the [[Nazgûl]] are present at the [[Attack on Dol Guldur]] launched by the [[White Council]]. Furthermore, in ''[[The Fellowship of the Ring]]'', Gandalf points out at the [[Council of Elrond]] that the victory was thanks to the devices of [[Saruman]]. In this film, however, it is chiefly Galadriel who expels [[Sauron]] with her [[Phial of Galadriel|phial]].
*[[Thranduil]] wishes to claim a particular Elven necklace of white gems from the Mountain. It is revealed that they were originally for his wife (a point which is invented for the film).
*Gandalf says that Sauron wants to conquer the Lonely Mountain because of its "strategic position". In the books, Gandalf indeed fears that Sauron could ally with the Dragon, but the [[Dark Lord]] isn't concerned with the [[Battle of Five Armies]] or [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]].
*[[Azog]] isn't present at this point in the books, as he was killed during the [[Battle of Azanulbizar]].
*The huge animals called "[[Were-worms]]," which burrow tunnels to Erebor through which the [[Orcs|Orc]] armies travel, never appear in that capacity in any of Tolkien's writings.
*The Orcs have a watchtower on [[Ravenhill]] - which is overseen by Azog - that gives semaphore signals to the rest of the army.
*Instead of a red axe, [[Dáin Ironfoot]] wields a red war hammer.
*Since [[Bilbo Baggins|Bilbo]] is unconscious for most of the battle in the book and Tolkien offers only a few retrospective details of what happened, most things in the film's battle are invented, such the presence of [[Trolls]], [[Ogres]], war machinery, and battle rams.
*At one point in the battle, the women of Lake-town decide to take up arms and fight alongside the men.
*Instead of dying while defending their mortally wounded uncle, Fíli and Kíli are slain by Azog and Bolg, respectively, on Ravenhill before [[Thorin]] ever receives such injury.
*Legolas returns [[Orcrist]] to Thorin during the battle by throwing it at and stabbing an Orc that Thorin was combating at that moment.
*Instead of [[Beorn]] killing Bolg, it is Legolas who does so.
*Thorin kills Azog after the Pale Orc mortally wounds him.
*Thorin dies on Ravenhill without Beorn ever taking him to safety (though he still makes peace with Bilbo before doing so).
*When Legolas informs his father he will not be returning to [[Mirkwood]], Thranduil urges him to find a [[Men|Man]] known as [[Strider (Aragorn)|"Strider"]]. Thranduil had little to nothing to do with the [[Rangers of the North]] in the books, and, during the events of ''The Hobbit'', Aragorn is a mere 10 years old (he was said to be 87 in the [[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]'').
*As in the 1977 [[Rankin/Bass]] [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|animated film]], most of Bilbo's return journey is omitted, as is Gandalf and [[Balin]]'s subsequent visit to [[Bag End]] years later. The scene of Bilbo's belongings being auctioned off upon his return, however, remains.
*The film ends with a callback to the arrival of Gandalf at Bag End for [[Bilbo's Farewell Party]] at the beginning of ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''.

==Gallery==
{{Seealso|:Category:Images from The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies}}
{{Gallery
|title=Pictures from ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''
|height=200
|width=300
|lines=2
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Bard and Legolas.jpg|[[Bard]] and [[Legolas]]
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Gandalf and Bard.jpg|[[Gandalf]] and Bard
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - The Company.jpg|The [[Thorin and Company|Company]] inside [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]]
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Thranduil.jpg|[[Thranduil]]
}}

==Trailers==
{{VideosHD|ZSzeFFsKEt4|iVAgTiBrrDA}}

==See also==
*[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
**''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|An Unexpected Journey]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug|The Desolation of Smaug]]''
*[[:Category:Images from The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies|Images from ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'']]
*[[:Category:Images of The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies posters|''The Battle of the Five Armies'' posters]]
*''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' soundtrack:
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack - Special Edition]]''
*''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' tie-in books:
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Annual 2015]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: Art & Design]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: The Art of War]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Official Movie Guide]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: The Movie Storybook]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Visual Companion]]''
** ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Activity Book]]''

==External links==
*[http://www.thehobbit.com/ TheHobbit.com] (official website)
*[http://www.thehobbitblog.com/ TheHobbitBlog.com] (official blog)
*[http://www.facebook.com/PeterJacksonNZ Peter Jackson's Facebook page]
===Reviews===
*[http://kalimac.blogspot.com/2014/12/movie-review-battle-of-between-four-and.html movie review: The Battle of Between Four and Seven Armies] by [[David Bratman]]
*[http://wormtalk.blogspot.com/2014/12/the-hobbit-battle-of-five-armies.html ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''] by [[Michael D.C. Drout]]
*[http://sacnoths.blogspot.com/2014/12/the-third-hobbit-movie-battle-of-five.html The Third ''Hobbit'' Movie: ''Battle of the Five Armies''] by [[John D. Rateliff]]

{{references}}
{{Films}}
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[[Category:The Hobbit (film series)| ]]
[[fi:Hobitti – Viiden armeijan taistelu]]

Talk:The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

2016-02-15T19:45:07Z

85.72.212.188: /* Complaint */ new section

== Release date ==
Many countries have it this week. (I just been). Should we have some information on this? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 19:02, 10 December 2014 (UTC)

:Yes. Do you have a reliable list? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 11:08, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

::Just what's on WP, IMDb, things like that. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:10, 12 December 2014 (UTC)

:How, um, 'spoiler-y' should we be getting right now? I've already expanded upon a few minor, non-canon characters if that's OK, but will definitely be holding off on any major canon deviations for a while --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 14:50, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

::It's out in all major markets, so go ahead. Maybe some countries are late, but that's a minority. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:06, 20 December 2014 (UTC)

== Deviations from the source material ==

I want to remove this section (on this and other film articles as well). It's an unstructured and unsourced listed of trivia which is primarily primary research. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 00:01, 23 November 2015 (UTC)

== Complaint ==

Why do you remove my editings on the wikitable of the Cast in page [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]];Because they are unimportant in the plot of the film characters; Here in the wikitable of the Cast in page [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] some actors who portray unimportant characters appear (on wikikitable).The same thing also happens on page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 21:20, 15 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:Mith/2016

2016-02-15T19:19:51Z

85.72.212.188: /* Page */

{{talkarchive|2006|2007|2008|2009|2010|2011|2012|2013|2014|2015}}
<table style="border: 1px solid #c0c090; background-color: #f8eaba; width:80%; margin-left: auto; margin-right:auto;"><tr><td rowspan="2">[[Image:Nuvola apps edu languages.png|none|50px|link=]]</td><td><div id="talk" style="text-align: center; padding: 5px; clear: both;><big>'''''Welcome to [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s talk page.'''''</big></div></td></tr><tr><td><ul><li>Please [{{SERVER}}{{localurl:{{NAMESPACE}}:{{PAGENAME}}|action=edit&section=new}} post your new topic at the ''bottom''] of this page, including a '''<nowiki>==Descriptive heading==</nowiki>'''.</li><li>You should sign and date your posts by inserting "'''<nowiki>~~</nowiki>~~'''" at the end of them.</li><li>Please indent your posts with "''':'''" if replying to an existing topic (or "'''::'''" if replying to a reply, etc.).</li><li>I will generally respond ''here'' to comments that are posted here, rather than replying via your talk page (or the article talk page, if you are writing to me about an article), so you may want to [{{SERVER}}{{localurl:{{NAMESPACE}}:{{PAGENAME}}|action=watch}} watch this page].</li><li>If I have left a message on ''your'' talk page, please continue the discussion there; '''DO NOT''' reply here. This is ensure that discussions do not become fragmented over several talk pages.</li></ul>[{{SERVER}}{{localurl:{{NAMESPACE}}:{{PAGENAME}}|action=edit&section=new}} '''⇒ Start a new talk topic.''']</td></tr></table>


== Question ==

I would like to have your permission in order to say something to you.May I have it? {{unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:Yes. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 17:59, 31 January 2016 (UTC)

::I found the phrase ,of films for the awards in this way and that is why i edited this in this way. For example I immitated the phrase ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King'' and by imitating this phrase I builted the phrase ''Peter Jackson's The Desolation of Smaug''. That is Why I put ''Peter Jackson's The Desolation of Smaug'' ''Peter Jackson's An Unexpected Journey'' and ''Peter Jackson's The Battle of the Five Armies''. Did you understeand what i am saying? {{unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::Thanks for messaging me. I realised what had happened and that you were just copying existing usage on those pages, so I decided to correct the entire page in order to make them correct and consistent. Referring to films as "Peter Jackson's..." is old usage on Tolkien Gateway and should be avoided now - is it not your fault, those pages have not been corrected. Hope this helps! --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:16, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

::::In page [[Cate Blanchett]] I found it in that way, so I immitated by coping it.That is Why i edited it in that way.Did you understeand it? {{unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::::I do, but you should've checked the edit to ensure it looked correct. But, you do not need explain your edits to me. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 16:58, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

::::::I didnt know that there is no page about Mike Mizrahi in Wikipedia until I checked it by searching it on Wikipedia. {{unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::::::You should have checked this before adding the link, but well done on so spotting the mistake. You don't need to tell me about your edits, though, as I can see what you've done in RecentChanges. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 19:09, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

::::::::In case you dont know, Thrain appears only in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.He appears in flasback scene in The Battle of Azanulbizar and in Dol Guldur.All these scenes which include Thrain exist only in the Extended Edition of the second Hobbit film. {{unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::::::::Yes, I do know that. My issue was with the poor sentence construction which you have now fixed. I understand your enthusiasm but you really don't need to keep leaving messages for me here. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 22:24, 1 February 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

You make a mistake.In case you dont know, Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. Moreover, Thrain does not appear in the entire Hobbit film trilogy and to be portrayed at the same time by the same actor.I mean other actor played him in The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey, other actor played him in The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug.And he appears only in the extended edition of The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug.You should either put Antony Sher and Thomas Robins in this wikitable of the Content '''Cast''' which exists in the page The Hobbit (film series) or remove Thrain from that wikitable entirely. {{Unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:I haven't made a mistake. Many other characters that don't appear in the whole trilogy are on that list, include Dáin, the Goblin-king and the Old Took - Thráin should certainly be on the list and that is why I reverted your edit. A better edit would be to add the other actors who portrayed the character (with sources), not remove it altogether. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:55, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

:From what I've heard, Sher also plays Thráin at the Battle of Azanulbizar, which makes it uncertain if Mizrahi actually even appears in these films in the role at all.--[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 04:14, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

::Page 101 of ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey: Chronicles: Creatures & Characters]]'' references Mike Mizrahi as the actor, whilst he's also credited with the role at the end credits of ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:25, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

== Page ==

Can you create the talk page [[Talk:Yazneg]]; That because I want to express my opinion about Yazneg.That he probably comes from the Gundabad. {{Unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:I would encourage you to sign up in order to create talk pages. Do you have any evidence for how Yazneg comes from Gundabad? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 17:59, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

::No.I Dont.Or maybe I do. In the appearence he looks like Azog.Don't you think? {{Unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::My opinion doesn't matter unless there is evidence to support it. We only include verifiable information on Tolkie Gateway. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 18:06, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

::::Then don't delete opinion my opinion about Yazneg.That he probably comes from Gundabad.Agree? {{Unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::::I do not agree. Your opinion on Yazneg - whether right or wrong - is not relevant to Tolkien Gateway. Unless you can present a source the information cannot go on the page. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 19:32, 3 February 2016 (UTC)

::::::I would like to explain something.May I? {{Unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

:::::::I removed these two characters from the wikitable about the Cast of the [[The Hobbit (film series)|hobbit film trilogy]] because there is no point.These two characters (Old Took and Lindir) do not have any role in the plot of the hobbit film trilogy.They do not interfere in the plot of the hobbit fil series generally, if you think about it very carefully.Also,Old Took appears in a single scene in the extended editionm of the Hobbit An Unexpected Journey.And moreover, both these characters appear only in the Hobbit An Unexpected Journey, (although Lindir appears in the theatrical edition of the First Hobbit film).But that is not important.The important thing is that they do not have any role in the plot of the hobbit film trilogy.If you think about it ver carefully, you can see it.For this reason I would like these two characters to be removed from the wikitable. {{Unsignedanon|85.72.212.188}}

::::::::I have to say I agree with this. The "Hobbit" movie trilogy page should probably only include the most significant characters for the whole trilogy... of which Old Took and Lindir certainly are not. I would argue there's no need to include Frodo, either. --[[User:BalrogTrainer|BalrogTrainer]] 03:53, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

::::::::My mistake.About the fact that I didnt sigh it.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 03:52, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

:::::::::I don't care about the Old Took, but I do think Lindir (why I reverted the edit) and Frodo should stay. But thanks for removing them anyway before I had a chance to reply.
:::::::::Frodo is integral to the continuity of this trilogy with the previous one, played by the lead actor of that trilogy - it is his intervention that essentially starts the process of Bilbo telling the story of the trilogy. Lindir is a character from the books (this is Tolkien Gateway not Film Gateway) and his role introruces a significant event in the films in that the Company have left in secret; further, the actor obviously has a significance in terms of fandom and this also needs to be recorded (fandom is something we've always had a view to, hence articles on amateur artists and an websites).
:::::::::A further point on them both. They have more lines than Bifur, Bombur, Girion, Thrór and (in theatrical versions) Thráin. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:47, 5 February 2016 (UTC)

You did well in the wikitable about the Cast of The Hobbit film trilogy in the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]].Don't change it.What do you think?Moreover, can you see the page [[Bree]]? I have done some editings there.Can you see these editings?--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 20:06, 6 February 2016 (UTC)

Good User:Mith.Good.You did well in your editings on the page [[Angmar]].

I have dome some editings on the page [[Aragorn]] today also.

I don't think there is point any mention of the character [[Albert Dreary]] in the page [[Bree]], despite the fact that [[Peter Jackson]] played him in cameo form.Morover connect link about the Gandalf and Thorin exists in the previous content of the same page.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 10:20, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

:I appreciate that you are enthusiastic, but can you please not use my talk page as a means of providing a running commentary on my - or your - edits. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 20:25, 7 February 2016 (UTC)

==Disagreement==
Why do you remove my editings on the wikitable of the Cast in page [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]];Because they are unimportant in the plot of the film characters; Here in the wikitable of the Cast in page [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]] some actors who portray unimportant characters appear (on wikikitable).The same thing also happens on page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 21:20, 15 February 2016 (UTC)

The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

2016-02-15T01:45:38Z

85.72.212.188: /* Cast */

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T23:23:29Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

User talk:85.72.212.188

2016-02-14T18:55:24Z

85.72.212.188: /* 123 */

Welcome to [[Tolkien Gateway]], the ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien]] encyclopedia''! If you have an account, please remember to [[Special:Userlogin|log in]]. If you don't have an account, remember you don't have to log in to read or edit articles on '''Tolkien Gateway''', but creating an account is quick, free and non-intrusive, requires no personal information, and gives you many benefits, including:
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== The Hobbit cast ==
There's no need to give all those pages an extra category. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:40, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:85.72.212.188

2016-02-14T18:55:01Z

85.72.212.188: /* The Hobbit cast */

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T18:35:54Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
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<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

= 2016 =
== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why doesn't exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;
:SIGN. YOUR. POSTS.
:I asked a very similar question. Not why does it exist, but why should it exist? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 01:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

i have a question. Then why does the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' exist;For the same reason this category exist, this new categories that I suggested should be added.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 16:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:It exists because it was created, but never filled, and then abandoned. I asked a counter-question - why should that old category exist? If we were to have this for LotR and the Hobbit, we should have this for every last adaptation - and that is overkill. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:09, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:Then you have to delete this category(the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' ), but I dont think this is a bad idea.The opposite one.It's a good idea.For this reason I suggest to be created s similar category, but for the hobbit film series this time.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 17:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:My point is: if we have one for the Hobbit movies (and LotR), we need one for EVERY adaptation, otherwise it's random. And we're not having that. So yeah, I'll probably get rid of that cat soon. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I didn't say for every adaption of Middle Earth.I talked about only film adaptions.It doesnt matter the kind of adaptions (if these adaptions are animated or live action or if these adaptions are for television-tv movies or tv series-or for cinema).Did you understand what I am saying; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}
::Did you understand what I was saying? Apparently not. a) SIGN YOUR POSTS. b) I didn't say you suggested that - having counterpart categories is an essential part of categorizing wikis. Having just a category for Hobbit or LotR actors is like just having a category for English or American people. You'll have to categorize EVERYONE, or none. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

:I disagree.I would like to explain some things. First, I have signed my last posts.Second what you added right now in pages [[Christopher Lee]] , [[Orlando Bloom]] and [[Elijah Wood]] I didnt think about it.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 19:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

::You were repeatedly told to sign your posts. Not just today. Also, what I did (and also what you did) to those articles is irrelevant to the discussion. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:03, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

I didn't want to disturb you.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 20:32, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T17:35:12Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

Christopher Lee

2016-02-14T17:20:56Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[File:Christopher Lee.jpg|250px]]
| name=Christopher Lee
| lifetime=[[27 May]], [[1922]]-[[7 June]], [[2015]]
| played=[[Saruman]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' film trilogy]] [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000489/ Profile]
}}
'''Sir Christopher Frank Carandini Lee''' [[Order of the British Empire|CBE]] ([[1922]]-[[2015]])<ref>{{webcite|author=Anita Singh|articleurl=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/celebritynews/11666316/christopher-lee-dies-live.html |articlename=Sir Christopher Lee dies at 93 - latest reaction and tributes|dated=11 June 2015|website=telegraph|accessed=14 February 2016}}</ref>was an English actor, who portrayed [[Saruman]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' film trilogy]], [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]], and read the [[The Children of Húrin (audiobook)|''The Children of Húrin'' audiobook]].

==Life==
Lee had a long history with [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s fiction; he read ''[[The Hobbit]]'' after leaving the Royal Air Force in [[1945]], and since ''[[The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' came out, he read all Tolkien's books once a year. Lee also had the experience of actually meeting Tolkien in person (making him the only individual involved in the film trilogy to do so):

{{Blockquote|We were sitting there talking and drinking beer, and someone said, "Oh, look who walked in." It was Professor Tolkien, and I nearly fell off my chair. I didn't even know he was alive. He was a benign looking man, smoking a pipe, walking in, an English countryman with earth under his feet. And he was a genius, a man of incredible intellectual knowledge. He knew somebody in our group. He (the man in the group) said "Oh Professor, Professor..." And he came over. And each one of us, well I knelt of course, each one of us said "how do you do?" And I just said "Ho.. How.. How..."|<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://christopherleeweb.com/forums/front-page-news/interview-christopher-lee-ian-mckellen-and-john-rhys-0|articlename=Interview with Christopher Lee, Ian Mckellen, and John Rhys|dated=|website=[http://christopherleeweb.com/ Christopherleeweb.com]|accessed=12 June 2013}}</ref>}}

Lee always envisioned himself as being [[Gandalf]], so when he read that [[Peter Jackson]] would be adapting his bedside book, he immediately called his agent.

===Jackson===
Although he realized he was too old to play Gandalf, he read the part. He did not get it, but was called back as Saruman instead. He had never been in a movie with the actual Gandalf, [[Ian McKellen|Sir Ian McKellen]], but the two quickly became friends, being the oldest actors on the set (though Lee was 17 years older). When McKellen was cast as Gandalf, Lee was 78 years old and McKellen was 61.

Lee shot most of his scenes in [[Wellington]], in the main studio, but also shot one scene in Wellington's national park. He visited [[New Zealand]] four times, the longest time being ten weeks. He later did some post-synching in London.

While jet-lagged, Lee broke his hand smashing it against a wall. Several shots of him in the finished films show him carefully hiding this bandaged left hand.

===Other projects===
Known for his booming voice, Christopher Lee has sung operas, and performed with the [[Tolkien Ensemble]] on their CDs ''[[At Dawn in Rivendell]]'' and ''[[Leaving Rivendell]]''. He sang the role of [[Treebeard]], as well as reciting numerous other poems.

Lee has recounted his life and his connections with Tolkien's work in the foreword to [[Chris Smith]]'s ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]'', and in chapter 74, titled "Spellbinder", of his autobiography, ''Lord of Misrule''.

Lee agreed to reprise his role as Saruman for [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]] on the condition that he did not have to fly out to New Zealand to be filmed.

==Roles==
* [[2014]] - ''[[LEGO The Hobbit: The Video Game]]'' - Narrator / Saruman
* [[2014]] - ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'' - Saruman
* [[2012]] - ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey ]]'' - Saruman
* [[2007]] - [[The Children of Húrin (audiobook)|''The Children of Húrin'' (audiobook)]] - Narrator
* [[2005]] - ''[[At Dawn in Rivendell]]'' - [[Treebeard]]
* 2004 - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Third Age]]'' - Saruman
* [[2003]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]'' - Saruman (extended edition)
* 2003 - [[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (video game)|''The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King'' (video game)]] - Saruman (archive footage)
* 2003 - ''[[Beyond the Movie: The Return of the King]]'' - Himself
* 2003 - ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien: Origins of Middle-earth]]'' - Himself
* [[2002]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]'' - Saruman
* 2002 - [[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (video game)|''The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers'' (video game)]] - Saruman
* [[2001]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' - Saruman
* 2001 - ''[[Beyond the Movie: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' - Himself
* 2001 - ''[[Quest for the Ring]]'' - Himself
* 2001 - ''[[A Passage to Middle-earth]]'' - Himself

==Quotations==
{{Blockquote|What Professor Tolkien achieved is unique in the literature of my lifetime. Indeed, in my opinion, he had reached the peak of literary invention of all time. Nothing like it has ever existed, and probably never will.|Christopher Lee, foreword to ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]''}}
{{Blockquote|It's just going to be...I'm trying to think of the right word - without making it sound like the usual fashionable superlative. I think it will create film history. I think it's going to have the biggest impact, on screen, of anything of the last 40 or 50 years|Christopher Lee, SFX Magazine June #65}}
{{Blockquote|Saruman is number one. Saruman is, very definitely, the most brilliant, the most powerful, with the greatest intellect and the greatest knowledge. Gandalf...well he's number two. But Saruman's whole character becomes perverted and distorted and he lusts for power and gradually, as it very often does, the old famous quote 'power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely'.|Christopher Lee, Fox's [[Quest for the Ring]]}}
{{Blockquote|I did meet him [Tolkien], very briefly, in the Fifties. It was in a pub that he used to go to in Oxford, called the Eagle and Child. I was there having a beer and I was completely overcome when he walked in. I had already started reading the books and thought, "This man has created a unique form of literature - one of the great works of all time." While I was filming The Lord of the Rings, I thought about what he would have thought all the time, and hope he would have approved. I'm still an enormous fan - I read The Lord of the Rings every year.|[http://web.archive.org/web/20100925072809/http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/christopher-lee-you-ask-the-questions-735506.html ''The Independent'', 11 February 2009]}}

==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''

==Bibliography, selected==
* [[2003]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]''
** "Foreword"

==External links==
* '''[http://www.christopherleeweb.com/ Official website]'''
* {{WP|Christopher Lee}}

{{references}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Lee, Christopher}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:Narrators]]
[[Category:Authors]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]

[[de:Christopher Lee]]
[[fi:Christopher Lee]]

Christopher Lee

2016-02-14T17:17:31Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[File:Christopher Lee.jpg|250px]]
| name=Christopher Lee
| lifetime=[[27 May]], [[1922]]-[[7 June]], [[2015]]
| played=[[Saruman]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' film trilogy]] [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000489/ Profile]
}}
'''Sir Christopher Frank Carandini Lee''' [[Order of the British Empire|CBE]] ([[1922]]-[[2015]]) was<ref>{{webcite|author=Anita Singh|articleurl=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/celebritynews/11666316/christopher-lee-dies-live.html |articlename=Sir Christopher Lee dies at 93 - latest reaction and tributes|dated=11 June 2015|website=telegraph|accessed=14 February 2016}}</ref>an English actor, who portrayed [[Saruman]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' film trilogy]], [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]], and read the [[The Children of Húrin (audiobook)|''The Children of Húrin'' audiobook]].

==Life==
Lee had a long history with [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s fiction; he read ''[[The Hobbit]]'' after leaving the Royal Air Force in [[1945]], and since ''[[The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' came out, he read all Tolkien's books once a year. Lee also had the experience of actually meeting Tolkien in person (making him the only individual involved in the film trilogy to do so):

{{Blockquote|We were sitting there talking and drinking beer, and someone said, "Oh, look who walked in." It was Professor Tolkien, and I nearly fell off my chair. I didn't even know he was alive. He was a benign looking man, smoking a pipe, walking in, an English countryman with earth under his feet. And he was a genius, a man of incredible intellectual knowledge. He knew somebody in our group. He (the man in the group) said "Oh Professor, Professor..." And he came over. And each one of us, well I knelt of course, each one of us said "how do you do?" And I just said "Ho.. How.. How..."|<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://christopherleeweb.com/forums/front-page-news/interview-christopher-lee-ian-mckellen-and-john-rhys-0|articlename=Interview with Christopher Lee, Ian Mckellen, and John Rhys|dated=|website=[http://christopherleeweb.com/ Christopherleeweb.com]|accessed=12 June 2013}}</ref>}}

Lee always envisioned himself as being [[Gandalf]], so when he read that [[Peter Jackson]] would be adapting his bedside book, he immediately called his agent.

===Jackson===
Although he realized he was too old to play Gandalf, he read the part. He did not get it, but was called back as Saruman instead. He had never been in a movie with the actual Gandalf, [[Ian McKellen|Sir Ian McKellen]], but the two quickly became friends, being the oldest actors on the set (though Lee was 17 years older). When McKellen was cast as Gandalf, Lee was 78 years old and McKellen was 61.

Lee shot most of his scenes in [[Wellington]], in the main studio, but also shot one scene in Wellington's national park. He visited [[New Zealand]] four times, the longest time being ten weeks. He later did some post-synching in London.

While jet-lagged, Lee broke his hand smashing it against a wall. Several shots of him in the finished films show him carefully hiding this bandaged left hand.

===Other projects===
Known for his booming voice, Christopher Lee has sung operas, and performed with the [[Tolkien Ensemble]] on their CDs ''[[At Dawn in Rivendell]]'' and ''[[Leaving Rivendell]]''. He sang the role of [[Treebeard]], as well as reciting numerous other poems.

Lee has recounted his life and his connections with Tolkien's work in the foreword to [[Chris Smith]]'s ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]'', and in chapter 74, titled "Spellbinder", of his autobiography, ''Lord of Misrule''.

Lee agreed to reprise his role as Saruman for [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]] on the condition that he did not have to fly out to New Zealand to be filmed.

==Roles==
* [[2014]] - ''[[LEGO The Hobbit: The Video Game]]'' - Narrator / Saruman
* [[2014]] - ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'' - Saruman
* [[2012]] - ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey ]]'' - Saruman
* [[2007]] - [[The Children of Húrin (audiobook)|''The Children of Húrin'' (audiobook)]] - Narrator
* [[2005]] - ''[[At Dawn in Rivendell]]'' - [[Treebeard]]
* 2004 - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Third Age]]'' - Saruman
* [[2003]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]'' - Saruman (extended edition)
* 2003 - [[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (video game)|''The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King'' (video game)]] - Saruman (archive footage)
* 2003 - ''[[Beyond the Movie: The Return of the King]]'' - Himself
* 2003 - ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien: Origins of Middle-earth]]'' - Himself
* [[2002]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]'' - Saruman
* 2002 - [[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (video game)|''The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers'' (video game)]] - Saruman
* [[2001]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' - Saruman
* 2001 - ''[[Beyond the Movie: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' - Himself
* 2001 - ''[[Quest for the Ring]]'' - Himself
* 2001 - ''[[A Passage to Middle-earth]]'' - Himself

==Quotations==
{{Blockquote|What Professor Tolkien achieved is unique in the literature of my lifetime. Indeed, in my opinion, he had reached the peak of literary invention of all time. Nothing like it has ever existed, and probably never will.|Christopher Lee, foreword to ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]''}}
{{Blockquote|It's just going to be...I'm trying to think of the right word - without making it sound like the usual fashionable superlative. I think it will create film history. I think it's going to have the biggest impact, on screen, of anything of the last 40 or 50 years|Christopher Lee, SFX Magazine June #65}}
{{Blockquote|Saruman is number one. Saruman is, very definitely, the most brilliant, the most powerful, with the greatest intellect and the greatest knowledge. Gandalf...well he's number two. But Saruman's whole character becomes perverted and distorted and he lusts for power and gradually, as it very often does, the old famous quote 'power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely'.|Christopher Lee, Fox's [[Quest for the Ring]]}}
{{Blockquote|I did meet him [Tolkien], very briefly, in the Fifties. It was in a pub that he used to go to in Oxford, called the Eagle and Child. I was there having a beer and I was completely overcome when he walked in. I had already started reading the books and thought, "This man has created a unique form of literature - one of the great works of all time." While I was filming The Lord of the Rings, I thought about what he would have thought all the time, and hope he would have approved. I'm still an enormous fan - I read The Lord of the Rings every year.|[http://web.archive.org/web/20100925072809/http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/christopher-lee-you-ask-the-questions-735506.html ''The Independent'', 11 February 2009]}}

==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''

==Bibliography, selected==
* [[2003]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]''
** "Foreword"

==External links==
* '''[http://www.christopherleeweb.com/ Official website]'''
* {{WP|Christopher Lee}}

{{references}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Lee, Christopher}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:Narrators]]
[[Category:Authors]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]

[[de:Christopher Lee]]
[[fi:Christopher Lee]]

Christopher Lee

2016-02-14T17:12:47Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[File:Christopher Lee.jpg|250px]]
| name=Christopher Lee
| lifetime=[[27 May]], [[1922]]-[[7 June]], [[2015]]
| played=[[Saruman]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' film trilogy]] [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000489/ Profile]
}}
'''Sir Christopher Frank Carandini Lee''' [[Order of the British Empire|CBE]] ([[1922]]-[[2015]]) was an English actor, who portrayed [[Saruman]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' film trilogy]], [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]], and read the [[The Children of Húrin (audiobook)|''The Children of Húrin'' audiobook]].

==Life==
Lee had a long history with [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s fiction; he read ''[[The Hobbit]]'' after leaving the Royal Air Force in [[1945]], and since ''[[The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' came out, he read all Tolkien's books once a year. Lee also had the experience of actually meeting Tolkien in person (making him the only individual involved in the film trilogy to do so):

{{Blockquote|We were sitting there talking and drinking beer, and someone said, "Oh, look who walked in." It was Professor Tolkien, and I nearly fell off my chair. I didn't even know he was alive. He was a benign looking man, smoking a pipe, walking in, an English countryman with earth under his feet. And he was a genius, a man of incredible intellectual knowledge. He knew somebody in our group. He (the man in the group) said "Oh Professor, Professor..." And he came over. And each one of us, well I knelt of course, each one of us said "how do you do?" And I just said "Ho.. How.. How..."|<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://christopherleeweb.com/forums/front-page-news/interview-christopher-lee-ian-mckellen-and-john-rhys-0|articlename=Interview with Christopher Lee, Ian Mckellen, and John Rhys|dated=|website=[http://christopherleeweb.com/ Christopherleeweb.com]|accessed=12 June 2013}}</ref>}}

Lee always envisioned himself as being [[Gandalf]], so when he read that [[Peter Jackson]] would be adapting his bedside book, he immediately called his agent.

===Jackson===
Although he realized he was too old to play Gandalf, he read the part. He did not get it, but was called back as Saruman instead. He had never been in a movie with the actual Gandalf, [[Ian McKellen|Sir Ian McKellen]], but the two quickly became friends, being the oldest actors on the set (though Lee was 17 years older). When McKellen was cast as Gandalf, Lee was 78 years old and McKellen was 61.

Lee shot most of his scenes in [[Wellington]], in the main studio, but also shot one scene in Wellington's national park. He visited [[New Zealand]] four times, the longest time being ten weeks. He later did some post-synching in London.

While jet-lagged, Lee broke his hand smashing it against a wall. Several shots of him in the finished films show him carefully hiding this bandaged left hand.

===Other projects===
Known for his booming voice, Christopher Lee has sung operas, and performed with the [[Tolkien Ensemble]] on their CDs ''[[At Dawn in Rivendell]]'' and ''[[Leaving Rivendell]]''. He sang the role of [[Treebeard]], as well as reciting numerous other poems.

Lee has recounted his life and his connections with Tolkien's work in the foreword to [[Chris Smith]]'s ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]'', and in chapter 74, titled "Spellbinder", of his autobiography, ''Lord of Misrule''.

Lee agreed to reprise his role as Saruman for [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]] on the condition that he did not have to fly out to New Zealand to be filmed.

==Roles==
* [[2014]] - ''[[LEGO The Hobbit: The Video Game]]'' - Narrator / Saruman
* [[2014]] - ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'' - Saruman
* [[2012]] - ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey ]]'' - Saruman
* [[2007]] - [[The Children of Húrin (audiobook)|''The Children of Húrin'' (audiobook)]] - Narrator
* [[2005]] - ''[[At Dawn in Rivendell]]'' - [[Treebeard]]
* 2004 - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Third Age]]'' - Saruman
* [[2003]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]'' - Saruman (extended edition)
* 2003 - [[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (video game)|''The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King'' (video game)]] - Saruman (archive footage)
* 2003 - ''[[Beyond the Movie: The Return of the King]]'' - Himself
* 2003 - ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien: Origins of Middle-earth]]'' - Himself
* [[2002]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]'' - Saruman
* 2002 - [[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (video game)|''The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers'' (video game)]] - Saruman
* [[2001]] - ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' - Saruman
* 2001 - ''[[Beyond the Movie: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' - Himself
* 2001 - ''[[Quest for the Ring]]'' - Himself
* 2001 - ''[[A Passage to Middle-earth]]'' - Himself

==Quotations==
{{Blockquote|What Professor Tolkien achieved is unique in the literature of my lifetime. Indeed, in my opinion, he had reached the peak of literary invention of all time. Nothing like it has ever existed, and probably never will.|Christopher Lee, foreword to ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]''}}
{{Blockquote|It's just going to be...I'm trying to think of the right word - without making it sound like the usual fashionable superlative. I think it will create film history. I think it's going to have the biggest impact, on screen, of anything of the last 40 or 50 years|Christopher Lee, SFX Magazine June #65}}
{{Blockquote|Saruman is number one. Saruman is, very definitely, the most brilliant, the most powerful, with the greatest intellect and the greatest knowledge. Gandalf...well he's number two. But Saruman's whole character becomes perverted and distorted and he lusts for power and gradually, as it very often does, the old famous quote 'power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely'.|Christopher Lee, Fox's [[Quest for the Ring]]}}
{{Blockquote|I did meet him [Tolkien], very briefly, in the Fifties. It was in a pub that he used to go to in Oxford, called the Eagle and Child. I was there having a beer and I was completely overcome when he walked in. I had already started reading the books and thought, "This man has created a unique form of literature - one of the great works of all time." While I was filming The Lord of the Rings, I thought about what he would have thought all the time, and hope he would have approved. I'm still an enormous fan - I read The Lord of the Rings every year.|[http://web.archive.org/web/20100925072809/http://www.independent.co.uk/news/people/profiles/christopher-lee-you-ask-the-questions-735506.html ''The Independent'', 11 February 2009]}}

==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''

==Bibliography, selected==
* [[2003]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Weapons and Warfare]]''
** "Foreword"

==External links==
* '''[http://www.christopherleeweb.com/ Official website]'''
* {{WP|Christopher Lee}}

{{references}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Lee, Christopher}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:Narrators]]
[[Category:Authors]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]

[[de:Christopher Lee]]
[[fi:Christopher Lee]]

Graham McTavish

2016-02-14T17:11:42Z

85.72.212.188: /* Roles */

{{actor
| image=[[File:Graham McTavish.jpg|250px]]
| name= Graham McTavish
| lifetime=[[1961]]
| played=[[Dwalin]]
| film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| played2=
| film2=
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0574615/ Profile]
}}
'''Graham McTavish''' (born [[1961]]) is a Scottish actor who has appeared in a variety of supporting roles in many television programmes, as well as being a prolific voice actor. He portrayed [[Dwalin]] in [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]].<ref>[http://www.comingsoon.net ComingSoon.net], "[http://www.comingsoon.net/news/movienews.php?id=71003 ''The Hobbit'' Casting Announced!]" dated 21 October 2010 (accessed 9 July 2011)</ref>

==Roles==
* [[2012]]-[[2014]]: [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]: [[Dwalin]]

==External links==
* {{WP|Graham McTavish}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0574615/ Graham McTavish] at IMDb
* [http://voicechasers.com/database/showactor.php?actorid=9690 Graham McTavish] at VoiceChasers
{{references}}
{{DEFAULTSORT:McTavish, Graham}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[fi:Graham McTavish]]

Timothy Bartlett

2016-02-14T17:10:16Z

85.72.212.188: /* External Links */

{{actor
| image=
| name=Timothy Bartlett
| lifetime=
| played=Hobbit
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]]
| played2=[[Master Worrywort]]
| film2=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com//name/nm0058910/ Profile]
}}
'''Timothy Bartlett''' played a [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' and [[Master Worrywort]] in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'' and in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]].
== External Links ==
* {{WP|Timothy Bartlett}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0058910/ Timothy Bartlett] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]

[[Category:Actors and actresses|Bartlett, Timothy]]
[[Category:New Zealand people|Bartlett, Timothy]]
[[Category:People by name|Bartlett, Timothy]]

Timothy Bartlett

2016-02-14T17:09:42Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=
| name=Timothy Bartlett
| lifetime=
| played=Hobbit
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]]
| played2=[[Master Worrywort]]
| film2=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com//name/nm0058910/ Profile]
}}
'''Timothy Bartlett''' played a [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' and [[Master Worrywort]] in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'' and in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]].
== External Links ==
* {{WP|Timothy Bartlett
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0058910/ Timothy Bartlett] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]}}

[[Category:Actors and actresses|Bartlett, Timothy]]
[[Category:New Zealand people|Bartlett, Timothy]]
[[Category:People by name|Bartlett, Timothy]]

Jed Brophy

2016-02-14T17:06:25Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[Image:Jed Brophy.jpg|250px]]
| name=Jed Brophy
| lifetime=[[29 October|October 29]], [[1963]]
| played=[[Nori]]
| film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| played2=[[Snaga (orc of Isengard)|Snaga]], [[Sharku]]
| film2=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com//name/nm0112400/ Profile]
}}
'''Jed Brophy''' (b. [[29 October|October 29]], [[1963]]) is a New Zealand actor. He portrayed [[Nori]] in [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit (film series)'']]. He also played many roles in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]], though he was only credited for the second film. His children, [[Sadwyn Brophy|Sadwyn]] and Riley, also appeared in the films; the former as [[Eldarion]] and the latter as a Hobbit child. In June [[2007]], he and 14 other actors filed [http://us.imdb.com/news/ni0058227/ a lawsuit] against [[New Line Cinema]] over merchandising royalties.

==Roles==
* [[2001]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'': [[Wandering Companies|Wandering Company elf]], [[Nazgûl|Black Rider]]
* [[2002]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]'': [[Snaga (orc of Isengard)|Snaga]], Rohan soldier at [[Fords of Isen|Isen]], [[Sharku]]
* [[2003]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]'': [[Witch-king]] armourer, Orc
* [[2003]]: ''[[Home of the Horselords]]'': Himself
* [[2012]]: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'' - [[Nori]]
* [[2013]]: ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]'' - Nori
* [[2014]]: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'' - Nori

== External Links ==
* {{WP|Jed Brophy}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0112400/ Jed Brophy] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]

[[Category:Actors and actresses|Brophy, Jed]]
[[Category:New Zealand people|Brophy, Jed]]
[[Category:People by name|Brophy, Jed]]

Ian McKellen

2016-02-14T17:03:46Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[Image:Ian McKellen.jpg|250px]]
| name=Ian McKellen
| lifetime=[[25 May|May 25]], [[1939]]
| played=[[Gandalf]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]][[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0005212/ Profile]
}}
'''Sir Ian Murray McKellen''' [[Order of the British Empire|CBE]], played [[Gandalf]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]] and [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]].

He also wrote forewords to [[Alan Lee]]'s ''[[The Lord of the Rings Sketchbook]]'' and [[Brian Sibley]]'s ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Making of the Movie Trilogy]]''.

==Quotes==
{{quote|My final twentieth century job was X-Men and my first of the new millennium was The Lord of the Rings, playing two iconic men of power, Magneto the Master of Magnetism and J.R.R.Tolkien's wizard Gandalf. I was introduced to the multitudinous fans of both works via the Internet and was intrigued to enter the world of franchises and plastic dolls.|Ian McKellen, August 2000, offical website}}
{{quote|The Lord of the Rings is a mythology. It is a fairy tale. It's an adventure story. It never happened..except somewhere in our hearts. And yet, there was Hobbiton in three dimensions and smoke coming out of the holes where they live underground. And I believed.|Ian McKellen, lordoftherings.net}}
{{quote|I am encouraged by the theatricality of [Tolkien's] readings -- full of rhythm and humour and characterisation. Without question Gandalf is like Tolkien but then so, I suspect, are Frodo and Aragorn.|Ian McKellen}}
{{quote| 'Yes, it’s true,' he said. 'I spoke to Guillermo in the very room that Peter Jackson offered me the part and he confirmed that I would be reprising the role. Obviously, it’s not a part that you turn down, I loved playing Gandalf.'|Ian McKellen on portraying Gandalf in [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]].}}
__NOTOC__
==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* 2002 - '''[http://www.saturnawards.org/ Saturn Award]''', Best Supporting Actor, ''Peter Jackson's The Fellowship of the Ring''
* 2002 - '''[http://www.sagawards.org/ SAG Award]''', Outstanding Performance by a Male Actor in a Supporting Role, ''Peter Jackson's The Fellowship of the Ring''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''
* [[2004]] - '''[http://www.bfca.org/ Critics' Choice Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.nbrmp.org/ NBR Award]''', Best Acting by an Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''SAG Award''', Outstanding Performance by a Cast in a Motion Picture, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* [[2014]] - '''[http://www.cofca.org/ Central Ohio Film Critics Association]''', Best Supporting Character, ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''

==Bibliography, selected==
===Articles===
* [[2002]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Making of the Movie Trilogy]]''
** "Foreword"
* [[2005]]: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Sketchbook]]''
** "Foreword"
* [[2014]]: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Visual Companion]]''
** "Introduction"

== External Links ==
* '''[http://www.ianmckellen.us/ Offical Website]'''
* {{WP|Ian McKellen}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:McKellen, Ian}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:Authors]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]

[[de:Ian McKellen]]
[[fi:Ian McKellen]]

Elijah Wood

2016-02-14T17:02:47Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[Image:Elijah Wood.jpg|250px|Elijah Wood]]
| name=[[Elijah Wood]]
| lifetime=[[28 January|January 28]], [[1981]]
| played=[[Frodo Baggins]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]][[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| played2=
| film2=
| imdb=[http://imdb.com/name/nm0000704/ Profile]
}}
'''Elijah Jordan Wood''' (born [[28 January|January 28]], [[1981]] in Cedar Rapids, Iowa) is a U.S. actor who played [[Frodo Baggins]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]] and [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]. He is the middle of three children born to Warren and Debbie Wood, who nicknamed Elijah "Spark Plug" because he was a manically energetic child. He has a brother Zack, a video game producer and seven years his senior, as well as a younger sister [[Hannah Wood|Hannah]], a poet and actress who has had small roles in a number of his films. He has been a professional actor since the age of nine.

== Trivia ==
While filming The Faculty he learned that casting had begun for New Zealand director [[Peter Jackson]]’s epic production of [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]’s classic novel trilogy [[The Lord of the Rings]]. Wood immediately had his friend, director George Huang, film an audition tape of him running in the fields with crudely made ''Hobbit feet'', and sent the tape to Jackson. Despite Jackson’s initial assertion that all of the Hobbit characters would be played by British actors, he was immediately won over by Wood’s audition and the American Wood was cast in the lead role of Tolkien’s diminutive hero [[Frodo Baggins]]. Jackson later said he could not possibly imagine another actor in the world who would be better-suited to Frodo.

The cast of the Rings movies was nominated for Best Ensemble Acting at the Screen Actors Guild Awards for three years in a row. They finally won in 2003, for the third film [[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King|The Return of the King]]. For his performance as [[Frodo Baggins]], Elijah Wood was nominated by the MTV Movie Awards and for the final installment, The Return of the King, he was nominated for a British Academy Award for Best Actor.

== Quotes ==
{{quote|He's just got a spirit, you know? That's what I love about him...he's very alive and very lively. You don't get to see a lot of that--only in the beginning of the first film--but his spirit, the light that's in him, is what holds him together.|Elijah Wood about Frodo, E! Online}}
{{quote|It wasn't like a normal role, I don't have to be a human; I have to be a hobbit. And there were things that were sort of germane to being a hobbit, that was probably why it was so intriguing.|Elijah Wood on lordoftherings.net}}
{{quote|Quite simply it is love. It is the unconditional love that says, regardless of what you do or where you go, I will always be there for you.|Elijah Wood on the friendship of Frodo and Sam, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Official Movie Guide]]''.}}

==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.empireonline.com/ Empire Award]''', Best Actor, ''Peter Jackson's The Fellowship of the Ring''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''
* 2003 - '''[http://www.mtv.com/ MTV Movie Award]''', Best On-Screen Team, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''
* [[2004]] - '''[http://www.bfca.org/ Critics' Choice Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.nbrmp.org/ NBR Award]''', Best Acting by an Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.vesawards.com/awards/ VES Award]''', Best Performance by an Actor in an Effects Film, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.sagawards.org/ SAG Award]''', Outstanding Performance by a Cast in a Motion Picture, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.saturnawards.org/ Saturn Award]''', Best Actor, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.interactive.org/ Interactive Achievement Award]''', Outstanding Achievement in Character Performance - Male, ''[[EA's The Return of the King]]''

== External Links ==
* {{WP|Elijah Wood}}
* [http://imdb.com/name/nm0000704/ Elijah Wood] at IMDb

{{DEFAULTSORT:Wood, Elijah}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:American people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]

[[de:Elijah Wood]]
[[fi:Elijah Wood]]

Orlando Bloom

2016-02-14T17:01:52Z

85.72.212.188:

{{actor
| image=[[Image:Orlando Bloom.jpg|250px|Orlando Bloom]]
| name=Orlando Bloom
| lifetime=[[13 January|January 13]], [[1977]]
| played=[[Legolas]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]][[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| played2=
| film2=
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0089217/ IMDb Profile]
}}
English actor '''Orlando Jonathan Blanchard Bloom''' (b. [[13 January|January 13]], [[1977]]) portrayed [[Legolas]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]] and [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]].

==Quotes==
{{quote|Legolas' moves are smooth and elegant, like a cat...it's very balletic. It's also bloody hard to do without falling over!|Orlando Bloom, E! Online Force of the Hobbit}}
{{quote|(on being asked to audition for Legolas) "I thought: 'Definetly! Game on!' So I learned the scene and acted it on video tape, and, shortly after, got this incredible phone call saying they were offering me the role! It was like winning the lottery! Like having all your dreams fulfilled! It was amazing!|Orlando Bloom, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Official Movie Guide]]''}}

==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* 2002 - '''[http://www.mtv.com/ MTV Movie Award]''', Breakthrough Male Performance, ''Peter Jackson's The Fellowship of the Ring''
* 2002 - '''[http://www.empireonline.com/ Empire Award]''', Best Debut, ''Peter Jackson's The Fellowship of the Ring''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''
* [[2004]] - '''[http://www.bfca.org/ Critics' Choice Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.nbrmp.org/ NBR Award]''', Best Acting by an Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.sagawards.org/ SAG Award]''', Outstanding Performance by a Cast in a Motion Picture, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* [[2014]] - '''MTV Movie Award''', Best Fight, ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''

== External Links ==
* {{WP|Orlando Bloom}}

{{DEFAULTSORT:Bloom, Orlando}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]

Arkenstone

2016-02-14T16:57:59Z

85.72.212.188: /* Portrayals in adaptations */

[[Image:Donato Giancola - The Arkenstone.jpg|thumb|250px|''The Arkenstone'' by [[Donato Giancola]]]]
{{quote|That stone of all the treasure I name unto myself, and I will be avenged on anyone who finds it and withholds it.|[[Thorin]]<ref name="Thief">{{H|Thief}}</ref>}}
The '''Arkenstone''' was a great jewel discovered beneath the roots of the [[Lonely Mountain]] during the reign of [[Thráin I]] and prized by his descendants as the "'''Heart of the Mountain'''".

==History==
[[File:Ted Nasmith - Heart of the Mountain.jpg|thumb|[[Ted Nasmith]] - ''Heart of the Mountain'']]
The Arkenstone was discovered soon after the establishment of the [[Dwarves|Dwarf]]-kingdom in the Lonely Mountain, and the Dwarves used all their skill to work the gem into a shimmering multi-faceted jewel. In the centuries after its discovery, the Arkenstone became an heirloom of the [[Kings of Durin's Folk|Kings]] of [[Durin's Folk]].

Thráin's son [[Thorin I]] carried it away into the [[Grey Mountains]] where it remained for some generations, until in time King [[Thrór]] brought it back to the [[Great Hall of Thráin]].<ref name="Durin">{{App|Durin}}</ref> When the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Smaug]] sacked Lonely Mountain, the Arkenstone was lost to the Dwarves of Durin's Folk — it lay among Smaug's booty in the halls of Erebor.
[[File:Ted_Nasmith_-_The_Arkenstone.jpg|thumb|left|[[Ted Nasmith]] - Arkenstone]]
Many years later, when [[Thorin]] led a band of Dwarves to recover their ancient realm, their companion [[Bilbo Baggins]] discovered the Arkenstone, but kept it for himself. Thorin sought for it while exploring the treasure, and swore an oath to take revenge on anyone who knowingly kept it from him, but Bilbo stayed silent nonetheless.<ref name="home"/> Later, when the [[Lake-men]] and the [[Elves of Mirkwood|Wood-elves]] came to demand a share of Smaug's treasure from Thorin, Bilbo was disturbed by Thorin's unwillingness to barter. Hoping to aid negotiations, he secretly entered the camp of the Men and Elves and delivered the Arkenstone to their leaders, [[Bard]] and [[Thranduil]]. The next day a twelfth share of the treasure was demanded from Thorin for the ransom of his people's heirloom.<ref name="Thief"/>

After the [[Battle of Five Armies]], enmity was set aside between the leaders of the Dwarves, Elves, and Men, and Bard of [[Dale]] placed the Heart of the Mountain on the breast of Thorin in Thorin's tomb. Thus, nearly a thousand years after its discovery, the Arkenstone was buried once more in the depths beneath the Lonely Mountain.

==Description==
The Dwarves worked the stone into a multifaceted jewel. It shone with its own pale light, but when outer light fell upon the Arkenstone, it "...changed it into ten thousand sparks of white radiance shot with glints of the rainbow". It was a heavy gem, small enough for [[Bilbo Baggins]] to hold in one hand, yet not so small that he could close his own small hand around it.<ref name="home">{{H|Home}}</ref>

==Etymology==
Arkenstone means roughly "precious stone", although the element *''arken'' does not exist in modern English. ''Arkenstone'' is a modernization of an ancient word which appears in the [[Edda]] as ''jarknasteinn'' and in [[Old English]] as ''eorclanstán''.

Note that [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]] used the word ''eorclanstánas'' to refer to the [[Silmarilli]] in Old English texts by [[Eriol]].<ref>{{HM|SM}}, [[The Earliest Annals of Valinor]]</ref> Some fans explore the possibility that the Arkenstone was one of the Silmarilli, specifically the one [[Maedhros]] threw in the chasm, until supposedly found by the Dwarves of Erebor.<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mythsoc/message/17693|articlename=RE: Eorclanstanas (was Re: For JDR: Query on Hobbit geography)|dated=2 January 2007|website=Mythsoc|accessed=9 June 2013}}</ref>

==Other Versions of the Legendarium==
In the writing of ''[[The Hobbit]]'' [[J.R.R. Tolkien]] halted after the capture of the Dwarves by the Wood-elves and sketched out the continuation of the story in plot notes. In these notes Bilbo stole a "gem", which became a "marvelous gem", and finally the "Jem [sic] of Girion" which the king of [[Dale]] had given to the Dwarves for the arming of his son.<ref>{{HH|PNB}}, p. 364</ref> As noted by [[John D. Rateliff]], the Gem of Girion was to be offered by the Dwarves to Bilbo as his share of the payment,<ref>{{HH|PNB}}, (vii) ''The Gem of Girion'', p. 373</ref> thus solving the problem of how to transport Bilbo's one-fourteenth share back to [[Bag End]].

Tolkien originally had the notion that Bilbo would kill Smaug. As his story progressed Tolkien decided that this strained credibility and so he introduced [[Bard]] as the dragon slayer and made him the heir of Girion. This led to a series of re-conceptualizations since now the Lake-men and the Elves were no longer mere opportunistic scavengers; there was one within their ranks with a legitimate claim to part of the treasure. The Gem of Girion became the Arkenstone and the one part of the hoard that Thorin would insist upon keeping. The elevation of Girion's gem led to the invention of the [[Necklace of Girion]] as the payment of Girion to the Dwarves for the arming of his son.<ref>{{HH|While}}, (ii) ''The Arkenstone as Silmaril'', p. 603</ref>
==Portrayals in adaptations==

'''1966: ''[[The Hobbit (1966 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1966 film)]]'':'''
:In this film the Arkenstone was a heart-shaped jewel of Earth and was later used as an arrowhead to a large crossbow made of old mining machines by Bilbo and company to kill [[Smaug|Slag the Dragon]].

'''2003:''[[The Hobbit (2003 video game)]]'':'''
:In the game, Thorin orders Bilbo to find the Arkenstone.He eventually finds it and as in the book, he gives it to Thranduil and Bard in order to negotiate with the Dwarves and to avoid war.It can be presumed that as in the book, it was placed in Thorin's tomb.

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:The Arkenstone is discovered during the reign of [[Thrór]] - rather than that of [[Thráin I]] - and never leaves the [[Lonely Mountain]]. It is considered a divine symbol for the [[King under the Mountain]] to rule, and is fastened on the king's throne. During the [[Sack of Erebor]], Thrór fails to save it as it falls into the great hoard of [[gold]].

'''2013: ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]'':'''
:The Arkenstone is seen depicted in a mural just inside the [[Back Door]]. It is mentioned that the [[Quest of Erebor]] was to retrieve it, as possessing it would give [[Thorin]] the authority to unite all the Dwarven clans to liberate [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]], and reclaim it from the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Smaug]]. [[Bilbo Baggins]] is shown to have discovered it in the treasure hoard during his conversation with Smaug, who even contemplates letting the [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] have it just to see it corrupt Thorin's mind, before deciding against it.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:As in the book, the Arkenstone is given by Bilbo (who recovered it during his escape from Smaug) to [[Thranduil]] and [[Bard]], in order to negotiate with the Dwarves and to avoid war. In [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies (extended edition)|the extended edition of the film]], it was placed upon Thorin's chest within his tomb and returned back to earth from whence it came.

==External links==
*[http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=2158 New evidence for the Arkenstone-Silmaril case]
*[http://themidhavens.net/heretic_loremaster/2014/12/so-about-that-theory-that-the-arkenstone-is-a-silmaril/ So About That Theory That the Arkenstone Is a Silmaril] - Criticism of the above theory
{{References}}
[[Category:Rings and Jewels]]
[[de:Arkenstein]]
[[fr:encyclo/artefacts/bijoux/arkenstone]]
[[fi:Arkkikivi]]

Arkenstone

2016-02-14T16:46:18Z

85.72.212.188: /* Portrayals in adaptations */

[[Image:Donato Giancola - The Arkenstone.jpg|thumb|250px|''The Arkenstone'' by [[Donato Giancola]]]]
{{quote|That stone of all the treasure I name unto myself, and I will be avenged on anyone who finds it and withholds it.|[[Thorin]]<ref name="Thief">{{H|Thief}}</ref>}}
The '''Arkenstone''' was a great jewel discovered beneath the roots of the [[Lonely Mountain]] during the reign of [[Thráin I]] and prized by his descendants as the "'''Heart of the Mountain'''".

==History==
[[File:Ted Nasmith - Heart of the Mountain.jpg|thumb|[[Ted Nasmith]] - ''Heart of the Mountain'']]
The Arkenstone was discovered soon after the establishment of the [[Dwarves|Dwarf]]-kingdom in the Lonely Mountain, and the Dwarves used all their skill to work the gem into a shimmering multi-faceted jewel. In the centuries after its discovery, the Arkenstone became an heirloom of the [[Kings of Durin's Folk|Kings]] of [[Durin's Folk]].

Thráin's son [[Thorin I]] carried it away into the [[Grey Mountains]] where it remained for some generations, until in time King [[Thrór]] brought it back to the [[Great Hall of Thráin]].<ref name="Durin">{{App|Durin}}</ref> When the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Smaug]] sacked Lonely Mountain, the Arkenstone was lost to the Dwarves of Durin's Folk — it lay among Smaug's booty in the halls of Erebor.
[[File:Ted_Nasmith_-_The_Arkenstone.jpg|thumb|left|[[Ted Nasmith]] - Arkenstone]]
Many years later, when [[Thorin]] led a band of Dwarves to recover their ancient realm, their companion [[Bilbo Baggins]] discovered the Arkenstone, but kept it for himself. Thorin sought for it while exploring the treasure, and swore an oath to take revenge on anyone who knowingly kept it from him, but Bilbo stayed silent nonetheless.<ref name="home"/> Later, when the [[Lake-men]] and the [[Elves of Mirkwood|Wood-elves]] came to demand a share of Smaug's treasure from Thorin, Bilbo was disturbed by Thorin's unwillingness to barter. Hoping to aid negotiations, he secretly entered the camp of the Men and Elves and delivered the Arkenstone to their leaders, [[Bard]] and [[Thranduil]]. The next day a twelfth share of the treasure was demanded from Thorin for the ransom of his people's heirloom.<ref name="Thief"/>

After the [[Battle of Five Armies]], enmity was set aside between the leaders of the Dwarves, Elves, and Men, and Bard of [[Dale]] placed the Heart of the Mountain on the breast of Thorin in Thorin's tomb. Thus, nearly a thousand years after its discovery, the Arkenstone was buried once more in the depths beneath the Lonely Mountain.

==Description==
The Dwarves worked the stone into a multifaceted jewel. It shone with its own pale light, but when outer light fell upon the Arkenstone, it "...changed it into ten thousand sparks of white radiance shot with glints of the rainbow". It was a heavy gem, small enough for [[Bilbo Baggins]] to hold in one hand, yet not so small that he could close his own small hand around it.<ref name="home">{{H|Home}}</ref>

==Etymology==
Arkenstone means roughly "precious stone", although the element *''arken'' does not exist in modern English. ''Arkenstone'' is a modernization of an ancient word which appears in the [[Edda]] as ''jarknasteinn'' and in [[Old English]] as ''eorclanstán''.

Note that [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]] used the word ''eorclanstánas'' to refer to the [[Silmarilli]] in Old English texts by [[Eriol]].<ref>{{HM|SM}}, [[The Earliest Annals of Valinor]]</ref> Some fans explore the possibility that the Arkenstone was one of the Silmarilli, specifically the one [[Maedhros]] threw in the chasm, until supposedly found by the Dwarves of Erebor.<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://groups.yahoo.com/group/mythsoc/message/17693|articlename=RE: Eorclanstanas (was Re: For JDR: Query on Hobbit geography)|dated=2 January 2007|website=Mythsoc|accessed=9 June 2013}}</ref>

==Other Versions of the Legendarium==
In the writing of ''[[The Hobbit]]'' [[J.R.R. Tolkien]] halted after the capture of the Dwarves by the Wood-elves and sketched out the continuation of the story in plot notes. In these notes Bilbo stole a "gem", which became a "marvelous gem", and finally the "Jem [sic] of Girion" which the king of [[Dale]] had given to the Dwarves for the arming of his son.<ref>{{HH|PNB}}, p. 364</ref> As noted by [[John D. Rateliff]], the Gem of Girion was to be offered by the Dwarves to Bilbo as his share of the payment,<ref>{{HH|PNB}}, (vii) ''The Gem of Girion'', p. 373</ref> thus solving the problem of how to transport Bilbo's one-fourteenth share back to [[Bag End]].

Tolkien originally had the notion that Bilbo would kill Smaug. As his story progressed Tolkien decided that this strained credibility and so he introduced [[Bard]] as the dragon slayer and made him the heir of Girion. This led to a series of re-conceptualizations since now the Lake-men and the Elves were no longer mere opportunistic scavengers; there was one within their ranks with a legitimate claim to part of the treasure. The Gem of Girion became the Arkenstone and the one part of the hoard that Thorin would insist upon keeping. The elevation of Girion's gem led to the invention of the [[Necklace of Girion]] as the payment of Girion to the Dwarves for the arming of his son.<ref>{{HH|While}}, (ii) ''The Arkenstone as Silmaril'', p. 603</ref>
==Portrayals in adaptations==

'''1966: ''[[The Hobbit (1966 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1966 film)]]'':'''
:In this film the Arkenstone was a heart-shaped jewel of Earth and was later used as an arrowhead to a large crossbow made of old mining machines by Bilbo and company to kill [[Smaug|Slag the Dragon]].

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:The Arkenstone is discovered during the reign of [[Thrór]] - rather than that of [[Thráin I]] - and never leaves the [[Lonely Mountain]]. It is considered a divine symbol for the [[King under the Mountain]] to rule, and is fastened on the king's throne. During the [[Sack of Erebor]], Thrór fails to save it as it falls into the great hoard of [[gold]].

'''2013: ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]'':'''
:The Arkenstone is seen depicted in a mural just inside the [[Back Door]]. It is mentioned that the [[Quest of Erebor]] was to retrieve it, as possessing it would give [[Thorin]] the authority to unite all the Dwarven clans to liberate [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]], and reclaim it from the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Smaug]]. [[Bilbo Baggins]] is shown to have discovered it in the treasure hoard during his conversation with Smaug, who even contemplates letting the [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] have it just to see it corrupt Thorin's mind, before deciding against it.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:As in the book, the Arkenstone is given by Bilbo (who recovered it during his escape from Smaug) to [[Thranduil]] and [[Bard]], in order to negotiate with the Dwarves and to avoid war. In [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies (extended edition)|the extended edition of the film]], it was placed upon Thorin's chest within his tomb and returned back to earth from whence it came.

==External links==
*[http://forum.barrowdowns.com/showthread.php?t=2158 New evidence for the Arkenstone-Silmaril case]
*[http://themidhavens.net/heretic_loremaster/2014/12/so-about-that-theory-that-the-arkenstone-is-a-silmaril/ So About That Theory That the Arkenstone Is a Silmaril] - Criticism of the above theory
{{References}}
[[Category:Rings and Jewels]]
[[de:Arkenstein]]
[[fr:encyclo/artefacts/bijoux/arkenstone]]
[[fi:Arkkikivi]]

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T16:41:38Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

Sylvester McCoy

2016-02-14T16:23:46Z

85.72.212.188: /* Roles */

{{actor
| image=[[Image:Sylvester McCoy.jpg|250px]]
| name=Sylvester McCoy
| lifetime=[[20 August|August 20]], [[1943]]
| played=[[Radagast]]
| film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
| played2=
| film2=
| imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0566809/ Profile]
}}
'''Sylvester McCoy''' (b. [[20 August|August 20]], [[1943]] as '''Percy James Patrick Kent-Smith''') is a Scottish actor. He is best known for playing the seventh incarnation of The Doctor in the ''Doctor Who'' series. He portrayed [[Radagast]] in [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit (film series)'']].

==Roles==
* [[2012]]-[[2014]]: [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]: [[Radagast]]

==External links==
* {{WP|Sylvester McCoy}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0566809/ Sylvester McCoy] at IMDb

{{DEFAULTSORT:McCoy, Sylvester}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T16:07:46Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T14:44:49Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T14:44:09Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

= 2016 =
== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why doesn't exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;
:SIGN. YOUR. POSTS.
:I asked a very similar question. Not why does it exist, but why should it exist? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 01:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

i have a question.Why does the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' exists;For the same reason this category exist, this new categories that I suggested should be added.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 16:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T14:43:43Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

= 2016 =
== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why doesn't exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;
:SIGN. YOUR. POSTS.
:I asked a very similar question. Not why does it exist, but why should it exist? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 01:58, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

i have a question.Why does the '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' existsq;For the same reason this category exist, this new categories that I suggested should be added.--[[User talk:85.72.212.188|85.72.212.188]] 16:42, 14 February 2016 (UTC)

The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies

2016-02-14T14:38:34Z

85.72.212.188: Undo revision 285833 by BalrogTrainer (talk)

{{disambig-more|Battle of Five Armies|[[Battle of Five Armies (disambiguation)]]}}
{{film infobox
| image=[[File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Poster2.jpg|250px]]
| name=''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''
| director=[[Peter Jackson]]<ref name="HBTitles">{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.thehobbitblog.com/?p=2563|articlename=Titles and Release Dates Announced|dated=31-May-2011|website=[http://www.thehobbitblog.com/ The Hobbit Blog]|accessed=21-Dec-2011}}</ref> [[Andy Serkis]] (Second Unit Director)<ref name="HBAndy">
{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.thehobbitblog.com/?p=2234|articlename=Andy Serkis to serve as Second Unit Director|dated=8-April-2011|website=[http://www.thehobbitblog.com/ The Hobbit Blog]|accessed=21-Dec-2011}}</ref>
| producer=Peter Jackson [[Fran Walsh]] [[Carolynne Cunningham]] [[Philippa Boyens]] (Co-Producer) [[Ken Kamins]] (Executive Producer) [[Zane Weiner]] (Executive Producer)<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| writer=[[Guillermo del Toro]] Peter Jackson Fran Walsh Philippa Boyens<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| narrator=
| starring=[[Martin Freeman]] [[Ian McKellen]] [[Richard Armitage]]<ref name="PJCasting1">{{webcite|author=[[Peter Jackson]]|articleurl=http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150168211921558|articlename=Production begins in New Zealand on The Hobbit|dated=20-March-2011|website=FB|accessed=21-Dec-2011}}</ref> ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies#Cast|See cast section below for more]]''
| music=[[Howard Shore]]<ref name="PJCasting1"/>
| cinematography=[[Andrew Lesnie]]<ref name="PJCasting1"/>
| editing=
| studio=[[New Line Cinema]] [[MGM]] [[WingNut Films]]<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| distributor=[[Warner Bros.|Warner Bros. Pictures]]<ref name="HBTitles"/>
| released=[[17 December]] [[2014]]
| runtime='''Theatrical:''' 144 minutes '''Extended Edition:''' 164 minutes
| country=[[New Zealand]] [[United Kingdom]] [[United States]]
| language=English
| budget=
| website=[http://www.thehobbit.com/ TheHobbit.com]
| imdb_id=2310332
}}
'''''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''''' is the third of [[Peter Jackson]]'s [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' film trilogy]] based on [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]'s [[1937]] novel ''[[The Hobbit]]''. It premiered in London on [[1 December]] [[2014]], and saw release in most of Europe on [[10 December]] and North America on [[17 December]]. It was preceded by ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|An Unexpected Journey]]'' in [[2012]] and ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug|The Desolation of Smaug]]'' in [[2013]].

==Synopsis==
{{Blockquote|“From Academy Award®-winning filmmaker Peter Jackson comes ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'', the third in a trilogy of films adapting the enduringly popular masterpiece The Hobbit, by J.R.R. Tolkien. ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' brings to an epic conclusion the adventures of Bilbo Baggins, Thorin Oakenshield and the Company of Dwarves. Having reclaimed their homeland from the Dragon Smaug, the Company has unwittingly unleashed a deadly force into the world. Enraged, Smaug rains his fiery wrath down upon the defenseless men, women and children of Lake-town. Obsessed above all else with his reclaimed treasure, Thorin sacrifices friendship and honor to hoard it as Bilbo’s frantic attempts to make him see reason drive the Hobbit towards a desperate and dangerous choice. But there are even greater dangers ahead. Unseen by any but the Wizard Gandalf, the great enemy Sauron has sent forth legions of Orcs in a stealth attack upon the Lonely Mountain. As darkness converges on their escalating conflict, the races of Dwarves, Elves and Men must decide – unite or be destroyed. Bilbo finds himself fighting for his life and the lives of his friends in the epic Battle of the Five Armies, as the future of Middle-earth hangs in the balance.|[[Warner Bros.]] Press Release<ref name="WBPressRelease1">{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.theonering.net/torwp/2014/06/22/90301-hobbit-3-fact-sheet-what-do-we-actually-know-about-the-hobbit-the-battle-of-the-five-armies/#synopsis|articlename=THE Hobbit 3 fact sheet: everything we know about The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies|website=[http://www.warnerbros.com/ Warner Bros.]|accessed=19-July-2014}}</ref>}}

==Plot==
[[Bilbo Baggins]] and the [[Thorin and Company|Dwarves]] watch from the [[Lonely Mountain]] as the [[Dragons|Dragon]] [[Smaug]] destroys [[Lake-town]]. [[Bard]] breaks out of prison and kills Smaug with the [[Black Arrow]] (brought to him by his son [[Bain]]), whose falling body crushes the fleeing [[Master of Lake-town]]. Bard - chosen as the new leader - and the people of Lake-town seek refuge in the ruins of [[Dale]]. Upon learning of her banishment from the [[Woodland Realm]], [[Tauriel]] travels to investigate [[Gundabad]] with [[Legolas]] (having previously tracked [[Bolg]] there).

Upon arriving at [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]], [[Fíli]], [[Kíli]], [[Bofur]], and [[Óin]] are informed by Bilbo that [[Thorin]] has been inflicted with Smaug's "dragon sickness" as he searched for the [[Arkenstone]]. It is revealed that Bilbo actually stole the Arkenstone from Smaug, but knows it should be hidden from Thorin, who orders the entrance of the Lonely Mountain be sealed off.

Meanwhile, having become a prisoner in [[Dol Guldur]], [[Gandalf]] is saved by [[Galadriel]]. She carries an unconscious Gandalf into a more open area while being taunted by the [[Sauron#Sauron's Return|Necromancer]]. [[Elrond]], [[Saruman]], and [[Radagast]] arrive to help rescue the Grey [[Wizards|Wizard]]. Gandalf is saved by Galadriel and given to Radagast while Elrond and Saruman hold off the [[Nazgûl]]. [[Sauron]] appears to them with the Nine at his side. Using the power of [[Nenya]] and her [[Phial of Galadriel|Phial]], Galadriel takes on the Dark Lord and the Ringwraiths, banishing them out of the fortress. Galadriel falls back fainting as Elrond supports her, realizing she has used her full strength in order to cast him away. Though Elrond believes they must warn the [[Free peoples]] of the enemy's return, Saruman tells him to take Galadriel to safety while he deals with Sauron.

Radagast provides Gandalf a horse and his staff before riding to Dale. At that time, [[Azog]] the Defiler approaches the Lonely Mountain with his vast [[Orcs|Orc]] army while learning from Bolg that an [[Elves|Elf]] army under the lead of [[Thranduil]] is also approaching. Azog tells Bolg to head to Gundabad and ready their other army. Following Bolg to the fortress of Gundabad, Legolas and Tauriel see Bolg with another army of Orcs and hundreds of war-bred [[bats]]. They decide to return to Lake-town to warn the others.

When Thranduil's army arrives in Dale, he forges an allegiance with Bard to claim a necklace of white gems from Thorin's treasure. Though Bard attempts to reason with Thorin to avoid further bloodshed, the stubborn [[Dwarves|Dwarf]] refuses to listen, much to his Company's dismay. As they prepare for the battle, Thorin gives Bilbo a ''[[mithril]]'' [[Mithril#The Mithril Coat|vest]]. Thorin begins to talk like Smaug, telling Bilbo that he will never share the treasure with Bard and Thranduil, not wanting to part with a single coin.

After Gandalf arrives at Dale, Bilbo sneaks out of the Lonely Mountain to hand the Arkenstone over to Thranduil and Bard. Inside the camp, Thranduil reminds Gandalf that he is the one who started all this and he will finish it. The next day, the Elf army and the armed people of Lake-town gather at the entrance of the Lonely Mountain to confront the Dwarves. Thranduil and Bard ride at the front, where Thorin threatens to kill them if they get any closer. Bard unveils the Arkenstone at the gates of Erebor and Thorin learns of Bilbo's actions and almost kills the [[Hobbits|Hobbit]]. Luckily, Gandalf approaches at the front with Bard and Thranduil, telling Thorin that Bilbo is his to keep. The other Dwarves hold back their leader so Bilbo can escape down the wall to Gandalf. Then, a Dwarf company under [[Dáin Ironfoot]] arrives and is about to attack the Elves, but Azog's Orc army unexpectedly arrives through underground tunnels created by [[were-worms]].

Thus, the Battle of the Five Armies begins as Azog sends one half of his army to attack the Lonely Mountain with Dáin's force defending it. While Thranduil assists Dáin, Azog sends the rest of his forces to attack Dale with Bilbo, Gandalf, Bard, and the other Elves coming to its defense. Gandalf, Thranduil, Bard, and Dain do the best they can to hold off the Orc armies as more and more come, killing more Dwarves, [[Men]], and Elves. Meanwhile, [[Alfrid]] takes a pile of treasure and escapes the battlefield, with Bard permitting him to do so.

Inside the Lonely Mountain, Thorin eventually overcomes his madness after a lengthy hallucination. Thorin and Company burst out of the Mountain and join the battle, much to Dáin's delight. While the others aid what remains of Dáin's forces, Thorin rides toward [[Ravenhill]] with [[Dwalin]], Fíli, and Kíli in order to kill Azog and send the Orc army scattering. At the same time, Legolas and Tauriel set off for Ravenhill with Bilbo following to warn the Dwarves of the second Orc army. Azog captures Fíli and stabs him in the back before throwing him off of a cliff. Bilbo is knocked out, while Bolg stabs Kíli in the chest. After Legolas kills Bolg, the Great [[Eagles]] arrive, led by Radagast and [[Beorn]], to assist in the battle, quickly decimating the Orc army. When Bilbo regains consciousness, he finds that Thorin has killed Azog but was mortally wounded in the process and dies soon after making his peace with the Hobbit. Sometime after, a disillusioned Legolas decides to leave his father's Realm. Thranduil urges him to go North to meet with one of the [[Dúnedain]], a Man who goes by the name of [[Strider (Aragorn)|"Strider"]]. Thranduil, after seeing Tauriel kiss Kíli's dead body, finally accepts Tauriel's love for Kíli and agrees with her plan to bury the Dwarf.

Bilbo bids farewell to the surviving members of Thorin's Company, telling them they are welcome to join him for tea whenever they are in [[the Shire]], to which he returns with Gandalf. As they part on the outskirts of the Shire, Gandalf reveals that he knows of the [[The One Ring|Ring]] that Bilbo found in the Goblin tunnels (though unaware that it was the One Ring) before they part ways on good terms. Bilbo's story ends when he returns to [[Bag End]] and finds the townspeople are auctioning off his belongings and are about to sell his house. The scene transitions to Bilbo on the day of his 111th birthday when he receives a visit from Gandalf, ending where ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]'' begins.

===Scenes===
# [[Fire and Water (scene)|Fire and Water]]
# [[Bard the Dragon-slayer]]**
# [[Dungeons of the Dark Lord]]
# [[Shores of the Long Lake (scene)|Shores of the Long Lake]]
# [[Not at Home (scene)|Not at Home]]
# [["Others Will Now Look to the Mountain"]]
# [[Legions of the Defiler]]
# [[The Mark of Gundabad]]
# [[Attack on Dol Guldur (scene)|Attack on Dol Guldur]]**
# [["Summon Our Friends"]]**
# [[The King's Jewel]]
# [[The Ruins of Dale (scene)|The Ruins of Dale]]
# [[Erebor Fortified]]
# [[The Elven-king's Aid]]**
# [[The Gathering of the Clouds (scene)|The Gathering of the Clouds]]
# [[A Token of Frienship]]
# [[The Shadow of Gundabad]]
# [["The Last Move in a Master Plan"]]
# [[Bolg of the North]]
# [[The Night Watch]]*
# [[A Thief in the Night (scene)|A Thief in the Night]]
# [[An Honest Burglar]]**
# [[Dáin Ironfoot (scene)|Dáin Ironfoot]]**
# [[The Clouds Burst (scene)|The Clouds Burst]]**
# [[The Battle at Dale]]
# [[The Darkest Hour (scene)|The Darkest Hour]]**
# [[Dragon Sickness (scene)|Dragon Sickness]]
# [[The Return of Thorin Oakenshield]]
# [[Sons of Durin (scene)|Sons of Durin]]
# [["To the King!"]]**
# [[A Call to Arms]]**
# [[Thorin's Plan]]**
# [[The War Chariot]]*
# [[Courage and Cowardice]]**
# [[The Fifth Army]]
# [[Scouting Ravenhill]]
# [[Blood of the Eldar]]
# [[An Unforeseen Remedy]]*
# [[The Fallen (scene)|The Fallen]]
# [[The Battle at Ravenhill]]**
# [[To the Death (scene)|To the Death]]**
# [[Parting in Friendship]]
# [[The Sorrow of Elves]]
# [[Eyes That Fire and Sword Have Seen]]
# [[King Under the Mountain]]*
# [[The Return Journey (scene)|The Return Journey]]
# [[The Last Stage (scene)|The Last Stage]]
# Credits

<nowiki>*</nowiki> denotes a scene only available in the Extended Edition cut of the film. 
<nowiki>**</nowiki> denotes a scene which includes extended content only available in the Extended Edition cut of the film.

==Cast==
:''See also:[[The Hobbit (film series)#Cast|''The Hobbit'' (film series)#Cast]]''
{| class="wikitable"
|- bgcolor="#CCCCCC"
! Actor !! Role
|-
| [[Richard Armitage]] || [[Thorin]]
|-
| [[Dee Bradley Baker]] || Creature Voices
|-
| Erin Banks || [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]]
|-
| [[Timothy Bartlett]] || [[Master Worrywort]]
|-
| [[John Bell]] || [[Bain]]
|-
| [[Manu Bennett]] || [[Azog]]
|-
| Nick Blake || [[Percy]]
|-
| [[Cate Blanchett]] || [[Galadriel]]
|-
| [[Orlando Bloom]] || [[Legolas]]
|-
| [[Jed Brophy]] || [[Nori]]
|-
| [[Adam Brown]] || [[Ori]]
|-
| [[John Callen]] || [[Óin]]
|-
| [[Billy Connolly]] || [[Dáin Ironfoot]]
|-
| [[Benedict Cumberbatch]] || [[Smaug]] The [[Sauron#Sauron's Return|Necromancer]]
|-
| [[Luke Evans]] || [[Bard]]
|-
| [[Martin Freeman]] || [[Bilbo Baggins]]
|-
| [[Stephen Fry]] || The [[Master of Lake-town]]
|-
| [[Ryan Gage]] || [[Alfrid]]
|-
| [[Mark Hadlow]] || [[Dori]]
|-
| [[Peter Hambleton]] || [[Glóin]]
|-
| Miranda Harcourt || [[Olga]]
|-
| [[Ian Holm]] || Older [[Bilbo Baggins]]
|-
| Brian Hotter || [[Otho Sackville-Baggins]]
|-
| [[Stephen Hunter]] || [[Bombur]]
|-
| Olof Johnsson || Creature Voices
|-
| Robin Kerr || [[Elros (Mirkwood guard)|Elros]]
|-
| [[William Kircher]] || [[Bifur]]
|-
| Kelly Kilgour || [[Soury]]
|-
| Martin Kwok || [[Ragash]] (voice)
|-
| [[Christopher Lee]] || [[Saruman|Saruman the White]]
|-
| [[Evangeline Lilly]] || [[Tauriel]]
|-
| Simon London || [[Feren]]
|-
| [[Sylvester McCoy]] || [[Radagast|Radagast the Brown]]
|-
| [[Ian McKellen]] || [[Gandalf|Gandalf the Grey]]
|-
| Thomasin McKenzie || [[Astrid]]
|-
| [[Graham McTavish]] || [[Dwalin]]
|-
| Mark Mitchinson || [[Braga]]
|-
| [[James Nesbitt]] || [[Bofur]]
|-
| Mary Nesbitt || [[Tilda]]
|-
| Peggy Nesbitt || [[Sigrid]]
|-
| [[Dean O'Gorman]] || [[Fíli]]
|-
| Jon Olson || Creature Voices
|-
| [[Lee Pace]] || [[Thranduil]]
|-
| Sarah Peirse || [[Hilda Bianca]]
|-
| [[Mikael Persbrandt]] || [[Beorn]]
|-
| Otep Shamaya || Creature Voices
|-
| Allan Smith || [[Ragash]]
|-
| Merv Smith || [[Tosser Grubb]]
|-
| [[Conan Stevens]] || Keeper of the Dungeons
|-
| [[Ken Stott]] || [[Balin]]
|-
| John Tui || [[Bolg]]
|-
| [[Aidan Turner]] || [[Kíli]]
|-
| Debra Wilson || Creature Voices
|-
|[[Katie Jackson]] || Girl in Lake-town
|-
| Cameron Jones || Thranduil's Lieutenant
|-
| Hilary Norris || Laketown Woman
|-
| Lise Perishon || Laketowner
|-
| Gabriela Roque López || Laketowner
|-
| Jeff Slaven || Laketowner
|-
| Chris Reilly || Dwarf Lieutenant
|-
| [[Hugo Weaving]] || [[Elrond]]
|-
|}

==Deviations from the source material==
''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' covers the final seven chapters of ''[[The Hobbit]]'' with a few elements added from the [[The Lord of the Rings Appendices|Appendices]] from ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]''. While it generally follows the story, a number of liberties were still taken:

*There is no thrush telling [[Bard]] of [[Smaug]]'s weak point while trying to kill him (having been replaced by the legend that [[Girion]] had loosened a scale on the [[Dragons|Dragon]]'s breast in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug|previous film]]). Also, his son [[Bain]] assists Bard by getting him the last [[Black Arrow]].
*Smaug directly confronts Bard after several of the Bowman's arrows deflect his hide, whereas the Dragon was unaware of him and was shot down while airborne in the book.
*The [[Master of Lake-town]] dies by Smaug falling on his boat while trying to escape [[Lake-town]] instead of starvation in the desert.
*The storyline concerning [[Legolas]] and [[Tauriel]] (who is an original character) both riding to [[Gundabad]] where they discover a second Orc army - led by [[Bolg]] - is headed to [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]] (along with thousands of [[bats]]) is invented for the film. It's this army that is designated as the fifth army in the film's eponymous battle instead of the [[Wargs|Warg]] army, as in the book.
*Also at Gundabad, Legolas divulges to Tauriel that his mother had been killed there, though there is never any mention of her in [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien's]] writings.
*As all of the members of [[Thorin and Company]] reached the [[Lonely Mountain]] together in the first place, in the books [[Óin]], [[Bofur]], [[Fíli]] and [[Kíli]] are not later coming to the Mountain alone.
*[[Galadriel]] does not free [[Gandalf]] in [[Dol Guldur]] in the books, as he never got captured in them.
*In the books, there is no hint that the [[Nazgûl]] are present at the [[Attack on Dol Guldur]] launched by the [[White Council]]. Furthermore, in ''[[The Fellowship of the Ring]]'', Gandalf points out at the [[Council of Elrond]] that the victory was thanks to the devices of [[Saruman]]. In this film, however, it is chiefly Galadriel who expels [[Sauron]] with her [[Phial of Galadriel|phial]].
*[[Thranduil]] wishes to claim a particular Elven necklace of white gems from the Mountain. It is revealed that they were originally for his wife (a point which is invented for the film).
*Gandalf says that Sauron wants to conquer the Lonely Mountain because of its "strategic position". In the books, Gandalf indeed fears that Sauron could ally with the Dragon, but the [[Dark Lord]] isn't concerned with the [[Battle of Five Armies]] or [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]].
*[[Azog]] isn't present at this point in the books, as he was killed during the [[Battle of Azanulbizar]].
*The huge animals called "[[Were-worms]]," which burrow tunnels to Erebor through which the [[Orcs|Orc]] armies travel, never appear in that capacity in any of Tolkien's writings.
*The Orcs have a watchtower on [[Ravenhill]] - which is overseen by Azog - that gives semaphore signals to the rest of the army.
*Instead of a red axe, [[Dáin Ironfoot]] wields a red war hammer.
*Since [[Bilbo Baggins|Bilbo]] is unconscious for most of the battle in the book and Tolkien offers only a few retrospective details of what happened, most things in the film's battle are invented, such the presence of [[Trolls]], [[Ogres]], war machinery, and battle rams.
*At one point in the battle, the women of Lake-town decide to take up arms and fight alongside the men.
*Instead of dying while defending their mortally wounded uncle, Fíli and Kíli are slain by Azog and Bolg, respectively, on Ravenhill before [[Thorin]] ever receives such injury.
*Legolas returns [[Orcrist]] to Thorin during the battle by throwing it at and stabbing an Orc that Thorin was combating at that moment.
*Instead of [[Beorn]] killing Bolg, it is Legolas who does so.
*Thorin kills Azog after the Pale Orc mortally wounds him.
*Thorin dies on Ravenhill without Beorn ever taking him to safety (though he still makes peace with Bilbo before doing so).
*When Legolas informs his father he will not be returning to [[Mirkwood]], Thranduil urges him to find a [[Men|Man]] known as [[Strider (Aragorn)|"Strider"]]. Thranduil had little to nothing to do with the [[Rangers of the North]] in the books, and, during the events of ''The Hobbit'', Aragorn is a mere 10 years old (he was said to be 87 in the [[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]'').
*As in the 1977 [[Rankin/Bass]] [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|animated film]], most of Bilbo's return journey is omitted, as is Gandalf and [[Balin]]'s subsequent visit to [[Bag End]] years later. The scene of Bilbo's belongings being auctioned off upon his return, however, remains.
*The film ends with a callback to the arrival of Gandalf at Bag End for [[Bilbo's Farewell Party]] at the beginning of ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''.

==Gallery==
{{Seealso|:Category:Images from The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies}}
{{Gallery
|title=Pictures from ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''
|height=200
|width=300
|lines=2
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Bard and Legolas.jpg|[[Bard]] and [[Legolas]]
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Gandalf and Bard.jpg|[[Gandalf]] and Bard
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - The Company.jpg|The [[Thorin and Company|Company]] inside [[Lonely Mountain|Erebor]]
|File:The Hobbit - The Battle of the Five Armies - Thranduil.jpg|[[Thranduil]]
}}

==Trailers==
{{VideosHD|ZSzeFFsKEt4|iVAgTiBrrDA}}

==See also==
*[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
**''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|An Unexpected Journey]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug|The Desolation of Smaug]]''
*[[:Category:Images from The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies|Images from ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'']]
*[[:Category:Images of The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies posters|''The Battle of the Five Armies'' posters]]
*''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' soundtrack:
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies - Original Motion Picture Soundtrack - Special Edition]]''
*''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies'' tie-in books:
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Annual 2015]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: Art & Design]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Chronicles: The Art of War]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Official Movie Guide]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: The Movie Storybook]]''
**''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Visual Companion]]''
** ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies: Activity Book]]''

==External links==
*[http://www.thehobbit.com/ TheHobbit.com] (official website)
*[http://www.thehobbitblog.com/ TheHobbitBlog.com] (official blog)
*[http://www.facebook.com/PeterJacksonNZ Peter Jackson's Facebook page]
===Reviews===
*[http://kalimac.blogspot.com/2014/12/movie-review-battle-of-between-four-and.html movie review: The Battle of Between Four and Seven Armies] by [[David Bratman]]
*[http://wormtalk.blogspot.com/2014/12/the-hobbit-battle-of-five-armies.html ''The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies''] by [[Michael D.C. Drout]]
*[http://sacnoths.blogspot.com/2014/12/the-third-hobbit-movie-battle-of-five.html The Third ''Hobbit'' Movie: ''Battle of the Five Armies''] by [[John D. Rateliff]]

{{references}}
{{Films}}
{{title|italics}}
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series)| ]]
[[fi:Hobitti – Viiden armeijan taistelu]]

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T00:32:10Z

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'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

= 2016 =
== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why shouldnt exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-14T00:24:06Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==
Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why shouldnt exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time; {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:Sign your posts. Also, something that big requires discussion. As you can see, that category hasn't been touched in years, is woefully incomplete, and lacks companion categories (not just The Hobbit, also the previous movies, games, radio plays). --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:45, 13 February 2016 (UTC)

Then why there is the category called '''Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast''' in Tolkien Gateway;

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-13T22:02:41Z

85.72.212.188: /* Mistake */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

Here there is a category named '''The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast'''.Why it doesnt exist a similar category for The Hobbit film series this time;Why dont you went to be created a siiilar category, but for The Hobbit film series; I think a similar category should exist.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-13T21:56:35Z

85.72.212.188: /* Mistake */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

Here there is a category named '''The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast'''.Why it doesnt exist a similar category for The Hobbit film series this time;Why dont you went to be created a siiilar category, but for The Hobbit film series; I think a similar category should exist.

Elijah Wood

2016-02-13T21:55:58Z

85.72.212.188: Undo revision 285819 by Ederchil (talk)

{{actor
| image=[[Image:Elijah Wood.jpg|250px|Elijah Wood]]
| name=[[Elijah Wood]]
| lifetime=[[28 January|January 28]], [[1981]]
| played=[[Frodo Baggins]]
| film=[[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]]
| played2=
| film2=
| imdb=[http://imdb.com/name/nm0000704/ Profile]
}}
'''Elijah Jordan Wood''' (born [[28 January|January 28]], [[1981]] in Cedar Rapids, Iowa) is a U.S. actor who played [[Frodo Baggins]] in [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]] and [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]. He is the middle of three children born to Warren and Debbie Wood, who nicknamed Elijah "Spark Plug" because he was a manically energetic child. He has a brother Zack, a video game producer and seven years his senior, as well as a younger sister [[Hannah Wood|Hannah]], a poet and actress who has had small roles in a number of his films. He has been a professional actor since the age of nine.

== Trivia ==
While filming The Faculty he learned that casting had begun for New Zealand director [[Peter Jackson]]’s epic production of [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]’s classic novel trilogy [[The Lord of the Rings]]. Wood immediately had his friend, director George Huang, film an audition tape of him running in the fields with crudely made ''Hobbit feet'', and sent the tape to Jackson. Despite Jackson’s initial assertion that all of the Hobbit characters would be played by British actors, he was immediately won over by Wood’s audition and the American Wood was cast in the lead role of Tolkien’s diminutive hero [[Frodo Baggins]]. Jackson later said he could not possibly imagine another actor in the world who would be better-suited to Frodo.

The cast of the Rings movies was nominated for Best Ensemble Acting at the Screen Actors Guild Awards for three years in a row. They finally won in 2003, for the third film [[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King|The Return of the King]]. For his performance as [[Frodo Baggins]], Elijah Wood was nominated by the MTV Movie Awards and for the final installment, The Return of the King, he was nominated for a British Academy Award for Best Actor.

== Quotes ==
{{quote|He's just got a spirit, you know? That's what I love about him...he's very alive and very lively. You don't get to see a lot of that--only in the beginning of the first film--but his spirit, the light that's in him, is what holds him together.|Elijah Wood about Frodo, E! Online}}
{{quote|It wasn't like a normal role, I don't have to be a human; I have to be a hobbit. And there were things that were sort of germane to being a hobbit, that was probably why it was so intriguing.|Elijah Wood on lordoftherings.net}}
{{quote|Quite simply it is love. It is the unconditional love that says, regardless of what you do or where you go, I will always be there for you.|Elijah Wood on the friendship of Frodo and Sam, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: Official Movie Guide]]''.}}

==Awards==
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.cinemaclips.com/PFCS.htm PFCS Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Fellowship of the Ring]]''
* [[2002]] - '''[http://www.empireonline.com/ Empire Award]''', Best Actor, ''Peter Jackson's The Fellowship of the Ring''
* [[2003]] - '''[http://ofcs.rottentomatoes.com/ OFCS Award]''', Best Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Two Towers]]''
* 2003 - '''PFCS Award''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''
* 2003 - '''[http://www.mtv.com/ MTV Movie Award]''', Best On-Screen Team, ''Peter Jackson's The Two Towers''
* [[2004]] - '''[http://www.bfca.org/ Critics' Choice Award]''', Best Acting Ensemble, ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.nbrmp.org/ NBR Award]''', Best Acting by an Ensemble, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.vesawards.com/awards/ VES Award]''', Best Performance by an Actor in an Effects Film, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.sagawards.org/ SAG Award]''', Outstanding Performance by a Cast in a Motion Picture, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.saturnawards.org/ Saturn Award]''', Best Actor, ''Peter Jackson's The Return of the King''
* 2004 - '''[http://www.interactive.org/ Interactive Achievement Award]''', Outstanding Achievement in Character Performance - Male, ''[[EA's The Return of the King]]''

== External Links ==
* {{WP|Elijah Wood}}
* [http://imdb.com/name/nm0000704/ Elijah Wood] at IMDb

{{DEFAULTSORT:Wood, Elijah}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:American people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast]]
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series) cast]]

[[de:Elijah Wood]]
[[fi:Elijah Wood]]

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-13T21:50:27Z

85.72.212.188: /* Mistake */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

Here there is a category named '''The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast'''.Why it doesnt exist a similar category for The Hobbit film series this time;Why dont you went to be created a siiilar category, but for The Hobbit film seriesq; I think a similar category should exist.

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-13T21:47:20Z

85.72.212.188: /* Mistake */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-13T21:45:02Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.This category is about the cast of the Lord of the Rings film trilogy.Why it doesnt exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series;I think it should erxist a similar category for the Hobbit film series.

User talk:Ederchil

2016-02-13T21:42:51Z

85.72.212.188: /* Explanation */ new section

{{usertalk}}

{| align="right"
| __TOC__
|}
<center>
=Archive=
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2008|January 12, 2008 - December 19, 2008]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2009|January 9, 2009 - December 23, 2009]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2010|January 9, 2010 - November 19, 2010]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2011|February 14, 2011 - December 14, 2011]]''' 
'''[[User talk:Ederchil/2012-3|February 15, 2012 - December 14, 2013]]''' 
=2014=
</center>


== Spam ==

I don't know if you or Morgan already contacted Hyarion, but I've just emailed him about today's spam influx.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 17:23, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:I completely forgot to do that. I was too busy having flashbacks to a couple of years back. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:32, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

::Thanks for all your effort to undo the mess guys, and thanks for the e-mail KA. For the time being I've just shut off new account creation until we implement a stricter process. Although I'm having a hard time thinking of something stricter, manual approval wouldn't even work since it would be sometimes difficult to differentiate solely based on the username. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 17:44, 1 February 2014 (UTC)

:::You may be aware that I am pretty much computer-less at the moment (temporarily boring a PC right now). The way to fix this, Hyarion, is to change the CAPTCHA questions in LocalSettings.php. That will stop them until they figure out an answer. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:54, 2 February 2014 (UTC)

== List of Book that inspired Tolkien ==

It is difficult to put link sources when I just created the page and was begining to edit including informations, and you delete the page... Be more pacient. Otherwise it will be hard to help this wiki. {{unsigned|Sigurd }}

:Couple of things:
* Add new messages at the ''bottom'' of the talk page. They go in chronological order from old to new.
* The entire concept is vague. "Books that inspired Tolkien"? Inspired him on what? To write a book? To become a philologist? To write an alternate mythology for England? To write a specific element?
* As I said, sources. The only source you list is a summary of his personal library, without explaining how this book being in his library inspired him. Unless you have a specific sources that explicitly says Book X inspired him to do action Y, it's just speculation.
* No content other than a list. The introduction is essentially "Books that have inspired Tolkien are books that have inspired Tolkien".
* Basic layout and spelling. That's something that you should do before saving the page.
:As this is a vague and slippery slope (just as our existing train wreck [[Inspirations]] is), it adds nothing at the moment. Without addressing all these points (apart from the first, naturally), I see no point in having it. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 13:38, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

:Couple of things:
* Whatever. If you see the message works.
* To put links, sources and more informations need time to included.
* I was working in that page and adding all informations. But is Impossible to do this when someone came and deleted the page... minutes after I began to write.
* So I think you have to whait some time before going to deleted a page. That is not the first time that you dont have paciense.{{unsigned|Sigurd}}

::While you're putting the page together you can use [[User:Sigurd/Sandbox|a sandbox in your user area]].--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 16:37, 1 March 2014 (UTC)

== Battle of the Five Armies ==

I'd just come on to change all the links - I'm glad you beat me to it! Thank you! --{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 19:17, 24 April 2014 (UTC)

== Song_of_the_Lonely_Mountain (Talk_Page) ==

Hello. Please forgive me, I really made a mistake: the confusion occured.So, in this time, could you help me, where can I publish my translation? On the forum? (From Pnompen)

:We're not really the right place for fan translations. Also, what would it help? None of us here knows Russian. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:45, 7 June 2014 (UTC)

== Copyright Violation ==

May I ask why the images I uploaded are copyright violations? I personally asked the artist through deviantART. I asked through a note, so I can send you a printscreen or something. She told me that she does not mind as long as she is credited and it is not for profit. I also asked for these three specific images. --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:08, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:I explained what you needed to add on your message wall. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 15:14, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::If you mean my Discussion page nothing new has showed up. If you mean another message wall then I have no idea what it is. Sorry :( --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:28, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:::My bad i just saw it. Thanks for the info! --[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:29, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

::::I know, I have spammed you extensively today, and I'm sorry for that. I just want to be sure that this won't happen again. So, I created the page with the permission; Am I allowed to upload them now? And if so, in the template where it says "Permission for use on Tolkien Gateway" will it be automatically linked to the page I created or do I need to do something extra? Thanks again!--[[User:Sandy|Sandy]] 15:53, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

:You need to add the template like you used to, but instead of DeviantArt, write Kimberly. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:15, 19 July 2014 (UTC)

== Hi ==

Sorry for trying to help with info. I wont help anymore. I dont know what you mean by "primary source".

= 2015 =
==Elves infobox==

: Yes, you are right about the Longbeards. After all, most of the Dwarven characters in the legendarium are Longbeards.

To return to the topic...As you have no doubt already seen that I created the template for the generic Elven infobox, I think some of the characters from the legendarium should be put under that template: for example: Imin, Tata, Enel and their spouses and many other Elven characters who's nationality isn't determined by any of the writings.

Celeborn would be a good candidate for such a template and few other major characters who have ambiguous histories...
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:08, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

:: Also, please do me a favor and delete the article "Morwë and Nurwë" considering they have no more use on the site.
[[User:Woolly Mammoth|Woolly Mammoth]] 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
::Yeah, a generic/unclear Elf template is a good idea. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:11, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

==Woolly Mammoth, the Nuisance everlasting==
:: To [[User:Ederchil]] and [[User:Mith]] - wouldn't it be much easier for you to unblock me than to constantly tidy up my "mess" - I have much to contribute to this wiki - and, as I said before, I SINCERELY apologize for any insult made to any of you, especially to [[User:Mith]]. From a more practical perspective, it would be good for you to unblock me - of course, if you do not want to clear up the mess that will be gathering in the following years - I am not a madman - I simply feel insulted by your behavior - I would like to edit this wiki - as I no doubt showed before - and it would be to your well-being (and to the well-being of this site) if I would continue editing this Wiki without any further hindrance. As for the images that I uploaded - I have proof that the permission was granted - although I have not been able to present the evidence to you - but if you unblock me I will - the visual representation of [[Tolkien]]'s works is to me, at least, an important aspect of his work. That is the reason I am hellbent on including the images, and I spend a lot of time on DevinatArt searching for Tolkien related art, and I am in good relation to other members of that community. This is all for me at the time - and I hope you will reconsider the ban.

Respectfully - Woolly Mammoth! [[User:Laurentus|Laurentus]] 20:48, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

:It's "Mess" because you're doing exactly the same we told you ''repeatedly'' not to do before. You're blocked. Every time you make a new account, you're evading a block - which is also a blockable offence. You're in the penalty box. You can't just jump back on the ice after putting on a teammate's jersey.
:Quite frankly, your "practical perspective"... that's an insult. Not just to me (or Mith), but to pretty much every moderator on all kinds of wikis and forums, everywhere on the internet. If you don't see that, I really can't help you. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:08, 14 September 2015 (UTC)

== Again ME ==
I was just wondering...You are cutting the branch on which you are sitting by consistently blocking my unnumbered profiles. Tell me now...Wouldn't it be easier for you and me to simply unblock me? I have added more "canonical" information to this site than everyone here around.

Take for example [[Maedhros]] (which, according to Tolkien's latest use, should be MaeDros) - I have added information which none of your timid fellows has been wont to do.

And by [[User:Mith|Mith]]'s Pythonesque farewell of "fucking off", I wonder if you, my dear "administrators", hold any supremacy over my "uncivil" behaviour. In the end, I altogether guessed rightly that most of you are, indeed, assholes (or at least you have buried your head in it).

Yours truly...dear Woolly Mammmoth ;).

:Your arrogance is truly mindboggling. You were blocked. This ban evasion is also a blockable offense. No matter the quality of your edits, you won't be unblocked.
:You're sent to the penalty box. You can't put on a teammate's jersey and get back on the ice. Just because you score a lot of goals doesn't mean that's suddenly okay. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:59, 6 October 2015 (UTC)

== Tim Burton article ==

Why was it deleted? Tim Burton actually DID work on the 1978 Lord of the Rings film. Sure, he wasn't that famous at the time, but he still did artwork for it. We've got articles for fan films, so I don't see why we couldn't have an article for someone that worked on an official adaptation, however minor the involvement was. It just seems like disrepect to ignore the humble beginnings of such a well-known filmmaker, especially since a lot of people weren't all too famous until they were involved in adapting Tolkien's work. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 15:59, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:The only reason he had an article was not because he
worked on LotR, but because he did other, more famous stuff later. We wouldn't have articles on other artists on the movie either. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:10, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

::So what? We have separate articles for regional translators and for the Inklings, even the ones that probably never even LOOKED at one of Tolkien's books. We even have articles for artists that worked on the Peter Jackson movies and the other two animated films. What makes the 1978 film the exception? If the article seemed like it was just advertising Tim Burton's other stuff, then how about rewriting it so that it seemed more relevant to Tolkien instead of just deleting it? It's like throwing away a perfectly good pizza just because it had an extra topping you didn't want. [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 16:15, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

:::I would argue it's throwing out a pizza because we're a pie shop. The problem is, there isn't much. What exactly did he work on? --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 16:34, 8 October 2015 (UTC)
::::Well, Tim Burton was uncredited for his work, but it was one of the first movies he ever worked on, so it's to be expected. He was mostly an "inbetween" artist, so I guess that means he did some miscellaneous artwork. Couldn't tell you which ones were all his, though. Also, in response to that "pie shop" analogy, I'd like to remind you that"pizza pies" are a thing.[[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 17:05, 8 October 2015 (UTC)

--> Okay, here's a compromise: Have the Tim Burton article on this site, but keep it simple, so that it doesn't delve too deeply into his post-LOTR career. Something like:

:"'''Tim Burton''' (born on August 25th, 1958) is an American filmmaker. He made his film debut in 1978, as an artist for [[Ralph Bakshi]]'s animated film adaptation of ''[[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|The Lord of the Rings]]''. He mostly worked on miscellaneous artwork as an "in-between" artist and thus largely remained uncredited for specific pieces."

:What do you think? [[User:EldritchNexus|EldritchNexus]] 19:49, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

::Not sure on the use of "miscellaneous artwork". In-between artists also needs no quotation marks, it's a normal job description - they're the people who make the animation fluid by creating the art that's in between the rougher, preliminary animation. The finishing touches. It'd be nice to know what scenes he worked on, if that could be found at all. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:35, 18 October 2015 (UTC)

== Template:VT2 ==

What's happening with {{redlink|[[Template:VT2]]}}? Is it useful? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 12:54, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

:I'm not sure what my intentions with it were, but it looks like Template:VT covers the same things, so we can probably do without. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:57, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

::Done. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:17, 8 November 2015 (UTC)

== Vunasti Mamut ==

Hello! Ederchil! Despite all my mistakes and insults...I truly regret that...Listen up! T is my favorite badass vilaine! I have spent a shitload of time trying to escape from the inevitable killing machine

== Explanation ==

Do you think I am a liar(that I am lying to you) or I make some kind of a joke about Bolg? In '''One Wiki to Rule Them All''' wiki and in Wikipedia pages about Bolg and the Hobbit film trilogy it is never said that Bolg participated in the Battle of Azanulbizar.Moreover, in the One Wiki to Rule Them All wiki about Unamed Orc Brute it is said that Bolg and this Unamed Orc Brute are separate characters.Also you can check it and in Bolg page on IMDB. So that is why I am asking you to change the page on [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] about Bolg.See: Cast

You believe me that I am not liar or I that this is not some kind of joke? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:You're neither a liar nor a joker. You're simply incorrect. Those three sources you list are, like us, third party sources. We included sources that he was initially cast as Azog, before being recast as Bolg. I'd have to check, but BalrogTrainer mentions he appears in the credits as Bolg. Nowhere was he credited as Gundabad Orc or Unnamed Orc Brute. You're removed two primary sources, and offered none in return. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 11:33, 27 November 2015 (UTC)

Am I disturbing you?BalrogTrainer is right. If you see at the end credits of the First Hobbit film you will find that Conan Stevens is credited as Bolg.This is wrong because in the next two movies Conan Stevens is not credited as Bolg. This mistake the filmmakers should see and fix it.Why didnt they fix it? Do you know any way to contact with the filmakers in order to mention this mistake and correct it? Or anyone else WHO knows about these matters? {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:We don't know why they changed it. But the fact remains: he was credited as Bolg (I checked it myself in the mean time). So we list him as Bolg. No reason to list him as anything else. I don't think it was ever fully explained why he was recast. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 20:22, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

No no no.I am asking you if you know how to contact with the filmakers of the Hobbit film trilogy in order to correct this mistake in the end credits of the First Hobbit film or if you know anyone else WHO is expert on that matters. {{Unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:Try looking for contact details of MGM or New Line Cinema. However, it wasn't a mistake at the time the movie was released. That was still Bolg back then. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 21:42, 2 December 2015 (UTC)

== Peter Jackson cameo appearence in [[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]] ==

Peter Jackson appears uncredited in ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''.He makes a cameo appearence at the end of the third Hobbit film in the painting of Bungo Baggins in case you dont know it.This painting can be seen in the final scene at the Bag End when Bilbo (Martin Freeman) returns home.You can check it on IMDB page about Peter Jackson and in Wikipedia page about Peter Jackson. {{unsigned|2.86.255.196}}

:The picture was based on Jackson's face. In fact, that was used back in LotR as well. See our page on [[Bungo Baggins]]. It shouldn't be on PJ's page as a cameo because it's not a physical cameo. Do not add it again. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:01, 4 December 2015 (UTC)

==Lady of the Star-brow==
Thank you so much! I did not know how to make it redirect. I appreciate that. ^_^ Do you know how to change titles on a page? For example, changing the [[Second Kinslaying]] to just Second Kinlaying? --[[User:Elf-esteem|Elf-esteem]] 17:20, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

:There's a "move" button, but I've been an admin for so long I don't remember whether this is admin-only or for everyone. Just suggest a move on the talk page. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:05, 6 December 2015 (UTC)

== [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]]/Mistakes ==

look what I have written in [[Talk:The Hobbit (film series)]] about some mistakes.

The of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] |the First Hobbit film]] and not about the The Hobbit film Project generally. I added the other two IMDB files about the other two movies but they dont appear on screen genrerally.That is why I have added all three IMDB files at the bottom of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Why are you insisting on that case? According to the title of the page ''The Hobbit (film series)'', that page talks about the The Hobbit film Project generally.So, that means the page is not only about the First Hobbit film.That is why I removed that IMDB file and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:What you did didn't work because there is only one template parameter - imdb_id. imdb_id1, imdb_id2 and imdb_id3 don't exist in the template, so adding them won't change anything. A link to the first film suffices. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:00, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Yes. I saw it and that is why I removed the IMDB file from the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and I didnt remove the Hobbit Blog page from there.Why are you insisting on keeping the IMDB file on [[The Hobbit (film series)]];Look at External links of [[The Hobbit (film series)]] and see what I have added. {{unsigned| 85.72.247.184 }}

:The first film suffices. Do not add the others again, that doesn't work. Also, IMDb is spelled with a lower case b. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:28, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

Why are you insisting on adding in Film infobox of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]] the IMDb file of [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|the First Hobbit film]];It is not reasonable, especially since the fact the the IMDb file of the First Hobbit film alrady exists in the external links of the page [[The Hobbit (film series)]]. Moreover, the other reason is that this IMDb page in Film infobox is only about [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]].That is why I inisist on the fact that this is a mistake. I would suggest you to remove the IMDB file from the Film infobox of The Hobbit (film series). {{unsigned|85.72.247.184}}

:It's not a mistake. It's fine as it is now. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:51, 16 December 2015 (UTC)

You make a great mistake by keeping this file on infobox of the page, for the reasons that I told you. Moreover,someone else has made another mistakes on the same page.In Content '''See also''' of the same page someone has added all The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey tie-in books.I mean these books are mentioned in that content WHO has added these books and Why;What is the point. These books are also mentioned in the page [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]] and are related only to the First film and not to the Hobbit film project generally.Why doesnt someone remove these tie-in books from that content;It is not reasonable to exist, since that pages is about for the Hobbit film Project '''generally'''.

Won't you say something about it;Won't you say your opinion;

== Spam Bots ==

Hope everything is going great with you Ederchil! Thanks for blocking those spam bots; just wanted to give you a heads up I changed the new user security questions so hopefully the account creations will subside. --[[User:Hyarion|Hyarion]] 16:50, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

:Not much effort. We've had worse. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 17:22, 24 January 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Thank you.Because Tolien Gateway mentions the Awards that were won by the people who worked for the [[The Lord of the Rings (film series) ]] , why shouldnt I do the same the thing for the people who worked for [[The Hobbit (film series)]];

:No need to explain - that's indeed necessary. We just completely forgot. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:12, 29 January 2016 (UTC)

== Mistake ==

Mike Mizrahi played Thrain in flasback scene in the [[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug (extended edition)|Extended Edition]] of ''[[The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug]]''.Specifically he portrayed him in [[The Battle of Azanulbizar]].[[Thomas Robins]] played him in the theatrical version.Specifically he portrayed him in Erebor scene (befor the attack of smaug in Erebor) in ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]''. {{unsigned|85.72.212.188}}

:It might not be wrong, but that was not the reason for reverting it. You added the names without updating the source. That source does not say three people played Thrain. --{{User:Ederchil/sig}} 18:17, 2 February 2016 (UTC)

== Explanation ==

Here there is category called <<Category:The Lord of the Rings (film series) cast>>.Why shouldnt exist a similar category for the Hobbit film series this time;

Ryan Gage

2016-02-13T21:39:58Z

85.72.212.188: /* External Links */

{{Expansion}}
{{actor
|Image =
|name=Ryan Gage
|played=[[Alfrid]]
|film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
|played2=
|film2=
|imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2187587/ Profile]
}}
'''Ryan Gage''' portrayed [[Alfrid]] in the [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]].<ref>{{webcite|author=[[Peter Jackson]]|articleurl=http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150257180211558|articlename=Casting News for The Hobbit|dated=19-May-2011|website=[http://www.facebook.com/ Facebook]|accessed=22-Dec-2011}}</ref> He was originally cast as [[Drogo Baggins]], who was the father of [[Frodo Baggins]], but changed role.<ref>{{webcite|website=[http://www.twitter.com Twitter]|articleurl=http://twitter.com/RyanGage/status/388856306767245313|articlename=Ryan Gage on Twitter|accessed=11 November 2014|dated=12 October 2013}}</ref>

==Awards==
* [[2014]] - '''[http://www.caprihollywood.com/ Capri Hollywood Award]''', Breakout Actor Award, ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''
* 2014 - '''Capri Film Festival, Italy''', Breakout Actor Award, ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]''

{{References}}

==External Links==
* {{WP|Ryan Gage}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2187587/ Ryan Gage] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]

{{DEFAULTSORT:Gage, Ryan}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series) cast]]

Ken Stott

2016-02-13T21:39:22Z

85.72.212.188: /* External links */

{{actor
|image=[[File:Ken Stott.jpg|250px]]
|name=Ken Stott
|played=[[Balin]]
|film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
|played2=
|film2=
|imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0832792/ Profile]
}}
'''Kenneth Campbell "Ken" Stott''' is a Scottish actor. He portrayed [[Balin]] in [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit (film series)'']]. He is best known as DCI Red Metcalfe in ''[[wikipedia:Messiah (TV series)|Messiah]]''.

==Filmography==
* [[2012]]-[[2014]]: [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]: [[Balin]]

==External links==
* {{WP|Ken Stott}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0832792/ Ken Stott] at IMDb
{{DEFAULTSORT:Stott, Ken}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:British people]]
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series) cast]]
[[fi:Ken Stott]]

Ryan Gage

2016-02-13T21:38:50Z

85.72.212.188: /* External Links */

Stephen Hunter

2016-02-13T21:38:21Z

85.72.212.188: /* External links */

{{Expansion}}
{{actor
|image=[[File:Stephen Hunter.jpg|250px]]
|name=Stephen Hunter
|played=[[Bombur]]
|film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
|played2=
|film2=
|imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1053536/ Profile]
}}
'''Stephen Hunter''' portrayed [[Bombur]] in the [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]].<ref>{{webcite|author=[[Peter Jackson]]|articleurl=http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150168211921558|articlename=Production begins in New Zealand on The Hobbit|dated=20-March-2011|website=[http://www.facebook.com/ Facebook]|accessed=22-Dec-2011}}</ref>

{{References}}
==External links==
* {{WP|Stephen Hunter}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1053536/ Stephen Hunter] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]
{{DEFAULTSORT:Hunter, Stephen}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:New Zealand people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series) cast]]

Peter Hambleton

2016-02-13T21:37:44Z

85.72.212.188: /* External links */

{{Expansion}}
{{actor
|image=[[File:Peter Hambleton.jpg|250px]]
|name=Peter Hambleton
|played=[[Glóin]], [[William]]
|film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
|played2=
|film2=
|imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0357396/ Profile]
}}
'''Peter Hambleton''' portrayed [[Glóin]] in the [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]], as well as [[William]] the [[Troll]] (through motion capture).<ref>{{webcite|author=[[Peter Jackson]]|articleurl=http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150168211921558|articlename=Production begins in New Zealand on The Hobbit|dated=20-March-2011|website=[http://www.facebook.com/ Facebook]|accessed=22-Dec-2011}}</ref>

{{References}}

==External links==
* {{WP|Peter Hambleton}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0357396/ Peter Hambleton] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]

{{DEFAULTSORT:Hambleton, Peter}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:New Zealand people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series) cast]]

William Kircher

2016-02-13T21:37:24Z

85.72.212.188: /* External links */

{{Expansion}}
{{actor
|image=[[File:William Kircher.jpg|250px]]
|name=William Kircher
|played=[[Bifur]], [[Tom]]
|film=[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]
|played2=
|film2=
|imdb=[http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0456270/ Profile]
}}
'''William Kircher''' portrayed [[Bifur]] in the [[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]],<ref>{{webcite|author=[[Peter Jackson]]|articleurl=http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150168211921558|articlename=Production begins in New Zealand on The Hobbit|dated=20-March-2011|website=[http://www.facebook.com/ Facebook]|accessed=22-Dec-2011}}</ref> as well as [[Tom]] the [[Troll]] in [[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey|''The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey'']].

{{References}}
==External links==
* {{WP|William Kircher}}
* [http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0456270/ William Kircher] at [http://www.imdb.com IMDb]
{{DEFAULTSORT:Kircher, William}}
[[Category:Actors and actresses]]
[[Category:New Zealand people]]
[[Category:People by name]]
[[Category:The Hobbit (film series) cast]]