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Tindómiel

2023-06-25T04:20:29Z

Trahald: /* Etymology */

{{numenorean infobox
| name=Tindómiel
| image=
| caption=
| pronun=
| othernames=
| titles=
| position=
| location=[[Númenor]]
| affiliation=
| language=[[Adûnaic]], [[Quenya]] and [[Sindarin]]
| birth=After {{SA|61}}
| birthlocation=[[Númenor]]
| rule=
| death=
| deathlocation=
| age=
| notablefor=
| house=[[House of Elros]]
| parentage=[[Elros]]
| siblings=[[Vardamir]], [[Manwendil]] and [[Atanalcar]]
| spouse=
| children=
| gender=Female
| height=
| hair=
| eyes=
| clothing=
| weapons=
| steed=
}}
'''Tindómiel''' was the second child, and only daughter, of [[Elros|Elros Tar-Minyatur]], the first [[King of Númenor]]. Almost nothing is known about her life.<ref>{{UT|earlier}}</ref>

==Etymology==
''Tindómiel'' is a [[Quenya]] name. Its meaning is not glossed, but it's listed along with Tinúviel among the examples of the ending ''[[-iel]]'' for "female"<ref>{{PE|17}} P190.</ref>. [[Paul Strack]] suggests it means "Daugther of Twilight" and is a compound of ''[[tindómë]]'' ("twilight") and ''[[-iel]]'' ("daughter", feminine suffix). The [[Sindarin]] name ''Tinúviel'' has the same meaning.<ref>{{webcite|author=Paul Strack|articleurl=https://www.eldamo.org/content/words/word-2039964243.html|articlename=Q. ''Tindómiel'' f.|website=Eldamo|accessed=20 January 2022}}</ref>

It could also mean "Morning Star" in [[Quenya]] and consist of an assimilation of ''[[tindómë]]'' and ''[[elen|el]]'' ("star"),{{fact}} analogous to [[Arwen]] [[Undómiel]] "Evenstar", who was a cousin of [[Tindómiel]], while [[Tindómerel]] is better documented as meaning "Daughter of Twilight"<ref>{{PE|19}} P73</ref>.

== Genealogy ==
<div style="overflow-x: scroll; overflow-y: hidden; border: 1px solid #AAAAAA; padding: 3px; background: #EEEEEE;">
{{familytree/start}}
{{familytree | | | | | | | EAR |y| ELW | | | | | | | | | | |EAR=[[Eärendil]] ''b. {{FA|503}}''|ELW=[[Elwing]] ''b. {{FA|503}}''}}
{{familytree | | | | | | | |,|-|^|-|.| | | | | | | | | | | |}}
{{familytree | | | | | | | ELR | | ELD | | | | | | | | | | |ELR=[[Elros|Elros Tar-Minyatur]] ''{{FA|532}} - {{SA|442}}''|ELD=[[Elrond]] ''b. {{FA|532}}''}}
{{familytree | | | | | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | | | |}}
{{familytree | | | | | VAR | | TIN | | MAN | | ATA | | | | |VAR=[[Vardamir|Vardamir Nólimon]] ''{{SA|61}} - {{SA|471|n}}''|TIN='''TINDÓMIEL''' ''after {{SA|61|n}}''|MAN=[[Manwendil]] ''after {{SA|61|n}}''|ATA=[[Atanalcar]] ''after {{SA|61|n}}''}}
{{familytree | | | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | | | | | |}}
{{familytree | | | AMA | | VAR | | AUL | | NOL | | | | | | |AMA=[[Tar-Amandil]] ''{{SA|192|n}} - {{SA|603|n}}''|VAR=[[Vardilmë]] ''b. {{SA|203|n}}''|AUL=[[Aulendil (son of Vardamir)|Aulendil]] ''b. {{SA|213|n}}''|NOL=[[Nolondil]] ''b. {{SA|222|n}}''}}
{{familytree | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|.| |}}
{{familytree | ELE | | EAR | | MAI | | YAV | | ORO | | AXA |ELE=[[Tar-Elendil]] ''{{SA|350|n}} - {{SA|751|n}}''|EAR=[[Eärendur (son of Tar-Amandil)|Eärendur]] ''b. {{SA|361|n}}''|MAI=[[Mairen]] ''b. {{SA|377|n}}''|YAV=[[Yávien]] ''b. {{SA|371|n}}''|ORO=[[Oromendil]] ''b. {{SA|382|n}}''|AXA=[[Axantur]] ''b. {{SA|395|n}}''}}
{{familytree/end}}
</div>

{{References}}
{{DEFAULTSORT:Tindomiel}}
[[Category:House of Elros]]
[[Category:Quenya names]]
[[Category:Second Age characters]]

Tindómiel

2023-06-25T04:00:18Z

Trahald: /* Etymology */

{{numenorean infobox
| name=Tindómiel
| image=
| caption=
| pronun=
| othernames=
| titles=
| position=
| location=[[Númenor]]
| affiliation=
| language=[[Adûnaic]], [[Quenya]] and [[Sindarin]]
| birth=After {{SA|61}}
| birthlocation=[[Númenor]]
| rule=
| death=
| deathlocation=
| age=
| notablefor=
| house=[[House of Elros]]
| parentage=[[Elros]]
| siblings=[[Vardamir]], [[Manwendil]] and [[Atanalcar]]
| spouse=
| children=
| gender=Female
| height=
| hair=
| eyes=
| clothing=
| weapons=
| steed=
}}
'''Tindómiel''' was the second child, and only daughter, of [[Elros|Elros Tar-Minyatur]], the first [[King of Númenor]]. Almost nothing is known about her life.<ref>{{UT|earlier}}</ref>

==Etymology==
''Tindómiel'' is a [[Quenya]] name. Its meaning is not glossed, but it's listed along with Tinúviel as examples of the ending ''[[-iel]]'' for "female"<ref>{{PE|17}} P190.</ref>. [[Paul Strack]] suggests it means "Daugther of Twilight" and is a compound of ''[[tindómë]]'' ("twilight") and ''[[-iel]]'' ("daughter", feminine suffix). The [[Sindarin]] name ''Tinúviel'' has the same meaning.<ref>{{webcite|author=Paul Strack|articleurl=https://www.eldamo.org/content/words/word-2039964243.html|articlename=Q. ''Tindómiel'' f.|website=Eldamo|accessed=20 January 2022}}</ref>

It could also mean "Morning Star" in [[Quenya]] and consist of an assimilation of ''[[tindómë]]'' and ''[[elen|el]]'' ("star"),{{fact}} analogous to [[Arwen]] [[Undómiel]] "Evenstar", who was a cousin of [[Tindómiel]].

== Genealogy ==
<div style="overflow-x: scroll; overflow-y: hidden; border: 1px solid #AAAAAA; padding: 3px; background: #EEEEEE;">
{{familytree/start}}
{{familytree | | | | | | | EAR |y| ELW | | | | | | | | | | |EAR=[[Eärendil]] ''b. {{FA|503}}''|ELW=[[Elwing]] ''b. {{FA|503}}''}}
{{familytree | | | | | | | |,|-|^|-|.| | | | | | | | | | | |}}
{{familytree | | | | | | | ELR | | ELD | | | | | | | | | | |ELR=[[Elros|Elros Tar-Minyatur]] ''{{FA|532}} - {{SA|442}}''|ELD=[[Elrond]] ''b. {{FA|532}}''}}
{{familytree | | | | | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | | | |}}
{{familytree | | | | | VAR | | TIN | | MAN | | ATA | | | | |VAR=[[Vardamir|Vardamir Nólimon]] ''{{SA|61}} - {{SA|471|n}}''|TIN='''TINDÓMIEL''' ''after {{SA|61|n}}''|MAN=[[Manwendil]] ''after {{SA|61|n}}''|ATA=[[Atanalcar]] ''after {{SA|61|n}}''}}
{{familytree | | | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | | | | | |}}
{{familytree | | | AMA | | VAR | | AUL | | NOL | | | | | | |AMA=[[Tar-Amandil]] ''{{SA|192|n}} - {{SA|603|n}}''|VAR=[[Vardilmë]] ''b. {{SA|203|n}}''|AUL=[[Aulendil (son of Vardamir)|Aulendil]] ''b. {{SA|213|n}}''|NOL=[[Nolondil]] ''b. {{SA|222|n}}''}}
{{familytree | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | |,|-|^|-|v|-|-|-|.| |}}
{{familytree | ELE | | EAR | | MAI | | YAV | | ORO | | AXA |ELE=[[Tar-Elendil]] ''{{SA|350|n}} - {{SA|751|n}}''|EAR=[[Eärendur (son of Tar-Amandil)|Eärendur]] ''b. {{SA|361|n}}''|MAI=[[Mairen]] ''b. {{SA|377|n}}''|YAV=[[Yávien]] ''b. {{SA|371|n}}''|ORO=[[Oromendil]] ''b. {{SA|382|n}}''|AXA=[[Axantur]] ''b. {{SA|395|n}}''}}
{{familytree/end}}
</div>

{{References}}
{{DEFAULTSORT:Tindomiel}}
[[Category:House of Elros]]
[[Category:Quenya names]]
[[Category:Second Age characters]]

Miruvor

2023-02-09T01:20:26Z

Trahald: source request

__NOTOC__
[[Image:John Howe - Miruvor.jpg|thumb|''Miruvor'' by [[John Howe]]]]

{{quote|Yéni ve lintë yuldar avánier mi oromardi lisse-miruvóreva|[[Namárië]]}}
'''Miruvor''' and '''miruvórë''' was, or were, a type of cordial used by the [[Valar]] and the [[Elves]].

==History==
The miruvórë was the nectar of the [[Valar]] made from [[Yavanna]]'s flowers, poured during their festivals in [[Valinor]].<ref>{{RGEO|Namarie}}</ref> The Quenya word ''lisse-miruvóreva'' occurs in the "Lament" sung by [[Galadriel]] in "Farewell to Lórien"; being translated as "of the sweet mead''".<ref>{{FR|Farewell}}</ref>

The name ''miruvor'' refers to a reviving cordial of the [[Elves]] in [[Rivendell]], a liquor with the power to grant renewed vigour and strength. Miruvor was clear and colourless{{fact}}, with a pleasant fragrance. It was possibly a different substance, an imitation, to ''miruvórë'', and perhaps named after it.

[[Elrond]] gave a flask of the "Cordial of Imladris" to [[Gandalf]] before the [[Fellowship of the Ring|Company of the Ring]] departed on their southward journey. Gandalf used this drink to revitalize themselves on [[Caradhras]].<ref>{{FR|II3}}</ref>

Other [[races]], such as the [[Dúnedain]] and even the [[Orcs]] possessed drinks with similar properties, but [[ent-draught]] is the most potent of these cordials.

==Etymology==
''miruvor'' is [[Sindarin]], said to be a "form taken by borrowed [[Quenya]] word" ''miruvórë'', generally held to mean "precious juice" or "thought of as precious drink (and largely of honey)" (cf. root [[WOR]]).<ref name=PE17/> The Quenya form also appears as ''miruvórë'', explained as "a special wine or cordial".<ref name=WJ/> These form were derived from [[Valarin]] ''[[mirubhōze]]''.<ref name=PE17>{{PE|17}}, pp. 37-8</ref><ref name=WJ>{{WJ|AD1}}, p. 399</ref>
==Inspiration==
The invented word goes back to at least [[1915]]. In that early phase of the legendarium, [[Tolkien]] envisioned it as derived from real-life [[Gothic]] elements *''midu'' ("mead") + ''wopeis'' ("sweet") > miduwopi > miduwodi > misuwosi > Q. miruvore.<ref>{{PE|12}}, p. xi</ref>
{{references}}
[[Category:Drinks]]
[[Category:Sindarin nouns]]

Halbrand

2022-10-18T08:32:37Z

Trahald:

{{adaptation}}
{{men infobox
| name=Halbrand
| image=
| caption=
| pronun=
| othernames=
| titles=King of the [[Mordor|Southlands]]
| position=
| location=
| affiliation=
| language=
| birth=Late [[Second Age]]
| birthlocation=
| rule=
| death=
| deathlocation=
| age=
| notablefor=Identity used by another individual
| family=
| parentage=
| siblings=
| spouse=
| children=
| gender=Male
| height=
| hair=
| eyes=
| clothing=
| weapons=
| steed=
}}

'''Halbrand''' was the name of a man of the [[Second Age]] of [[Middle-earth]]. His character was invented for [[The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power|The Rings of Power]] television series by [[Amazon Studios]], where he was portrayed by [[Charlie Vickers]].<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9788618/fullcredits|articlename=Full Cast & Crew|dated=|website=IMDB|accessed=31 July 2022}}</ref>

== Etymology ==
Halbrand is a [[Sindarin]] name derived from ''[[Hall]]'' ("Tall") and ''Brand''{{fact}}.

{{references}}
[[Category:Men from adaptations]]
[[fi:Halbrand (televisiosarjan hahmo)]]

Halbrand

2022-10-18T08:32:22Z

Trahald: /* Etymology */

{{adaptation}}
{{men infobox
| name=Halbrand
| image=
| caption=
| pronun=
| othernames=
| titles=King of the [[Mordor|Southlands]]
| position=
| location=
| affiliation=
| language=
| birth=Late [[Second Age]]
| birthlocation=
| rule=
| death=
| deathlocation=
| age=
| notablefor=Identity used by another individual
| family=
| parentage=
| siblings=
| spouse=
| children=
| gender=Male
| height=
| hair=
| eyes=
| clothing=
| weapons=
| steed=
}}

'''Halbrand''' was the name of a man of the [[Second Age]] of [[Middle-earth]]. His character was invented for [[The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power|The Rings of Power]] television series by [[Amazon Studios]], where he was portrayed by [[Charlie Vickers]].<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=https://www.imdb.com/title/tt9788618/fullcredits|articlename=Full Cast & Crew|dated=|website=IMDB|accessed=31 July 2022}}</ref>

== Etymology ==
Halbrand is a [[Sindarin]] name derived from ''[[Hall]]'' ("Tall") and ''Brand''{{source}}.

{{references}}
[[Category:Men from adaptations]]
[[fi:Halbrand (televisiosarjan hahmo)]]

Hobbits

2022-09-23T02:59:37Z

Trahald: /* Inspiration */

{{sources}}
{{disambig-more|Hobbits|[[The Hobbit (disambiguation)]]}}
{{people infobox
| name=Hobbits
| image=[[File:Lukasz Siudzinsk - Hobbit.jpg|250px]]
| caption="[[:File:Lukasz Siudzinsk - Hobbit.jpg|Hobbit]]" by Lukasz Siudzinsk
| pronun=
| othernames=Banakil, Halflings, Holbytlan, Kuduk, Little People, Periannath
| origin=
| location=[[The Shire]], [[Buckland]], [[Bree-land]]
| affiliation=[[Host of the West (Arnor)|Host of the West]]
| rivalry=
| language=[[Hobbitish]] (a regional dialect of [[Westron]])
| members=[[Marcho]] and [[Blanco]], [[Sméagol]], [[Bandobras Took]], [[Bilbo Baggins]], [[Frodo Baggins]]
| lifespan=c. 96<ref name="LOTRProjectStats">{{webcite|author=Emil Johansson|articleurl=http://lotrproject.com/statistics/#lifeexpectancy|articlename=Lord of the Rings in Statistics|website=[http://lotrproject.com/ Lord of the Rings Project]|accessed=09-September-2012}}</ref>
| distinctions=[[Gift of Men|Mortality]], diminutive stature, furry feet
| height=2-4 ft or 0.6-1.2 m (often less than three feet in later days)
| hair=Typically curly brown, rarely blond (until the [[Fourth Age]]), and white and grey in later years
| skin=Nut-brown to White
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
{{quote|In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit.|''[[The Hobbit]]'', "[[An Unexpected Party]]"}}
'''Hobbits''' were a small race that typically dwelt underground, believed to be related to [[Men]]. They played little role in history, save during the [[War of the Ring]].

==Description and culture==
{{quote|There is more in you of good than you know, child of the kindly [[Eriador|West]]. Some courage and some wisdom, blended in measure. If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.|[[Thorin Oakenshield]] in ''[[The Hobbit]]'', "[[The Return Journey]]"}}

Hobbits were between two and four feet tall,<ref name=Concerning>{{FR|Hobbits}}</ref> with differences between male and female: about 3 feet 6 inches for males<ref>{{NM|P2vi}}, "Heights", p. 195</ref> and seldom exceeded 3 feet for female.<ref name=atani>{{PM|Atani}}</ref> They had short legs, slightly pointed ears<ref>{{L|27}}</ref> and furry feet with leathery soles, resulting in most never wearing shoes. Compared to the [[Dwarves]] they are a bit shorter and less stout or stocky. Early in their recorded history, Hobbits were divided in three kinds with different customs and temperament. The '''[[Stoors]]''' grew facial hair and had an affinity for water, boats and swimming and wore boots; the '''[[Fallohides]]''' were fair, tall and slim, an adventurous people, friendlier and more open to outsiders. Finally, the '''[[Harfoots]]''' were the most numerous and instituted the living in burrows. In later days the Harfoot traits became the "norm".

Hobbits had a life span somewhat longer than Men of non-[[Númenórean]] descent, averaging between 90 and 100 years. The time at which a young hobbit "came of age" was 33.<ref name=FRI1>{{FR|I1}}</ref> The two oldest-living recorded hobbits (except [[Gollum]]) were The [[Gerontius Took|Old Took]] (who reached the age of 130) and [[Bilbo Baggins]] (who surpassed him at 131).

By nature they were of gentle disposition, neither cruel nor vindictive.<ref>{{PM|XNotes}}, #55</ref> Slow to quarrel, they never had been warlike, and never fought among themselves, nor hunted for sport; by the late Third Age the Shire-hobbits knew of weapons only as trophies or useless trinkets. However they were skilled with all kind of tools, as well as arms when there was a need; they were keen-eyed and used the bow well, and also the stones, successfully throwed against trespassing beasts.

Throughout their history Hobbits had showed unparalleled skill, courage and also endurance and resistance in times of danger and terror. During their [[Wandering Days]] Hobbits demonstrated an easiness to adapt to the environments they visited and adopted the customs and languages of the peoples they were in contact with. In the Shire, they had settled with a closed and comfort-loving lifestyle; they were fond of an unadventurous bucolic life of farming, eating, smoking [[pipe-weed]], socializing and talking about genealogies. Hobbits also liked to drink ale in inns, and ate at least six meals a day when they could get them. Every [[Highday]] and after noon, Hobbits celebrated a small holiday with evening feasts. <ref name=cal>{{App|Calendars}}</ref>

However, their hidden potentials resurfaced in difficult times; in the [[Long Winter]], [[Gandalf]] admired their uncomplaining courage and pity for one another, thanks to which they survived.<ref>{{UT|Erebor}}</ref> Another example of Hobbitish hardiness and resistant nature, was [[Gollum]], who despite using [[the One Ring]] for years, did not transform into a [[Wraiths|Wraith]] under the Ring's evil power (unlike the [[Nazgûl|nine Mannish Kings]]).<ref>
{{webcite|author=Stan Brown|website=FAQ of the Rings|articleurl=http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/ringfaq.htm#Q1-GollumWraith |articlename=Why hadn’t Gollum turned into a wraith long ago?}}</ref> These surprising Hobbit traits also were tested and proven during the [[Quest of Erebor]] and, most notably, the [[War of the Ring]].

===Clans and families===
Hobbits were universally monogamous and "[[Wikipedia:Patrilineality|patrilinear]]" (family names descended in the male-line) and normally the titular family head was the eldest male, but his wife had an equal, but separate status. In the large powerful families (such as the [[Took Family|Tooks]]) the head of what we would call a clan was the eldest male of the most direct line of descent. If the master died first his titular headship of the clan was taken by his wife and, only after her death, by their son.

Chieftains and leaders of their clans and tribes were typically of Fallohide kind, as they were by nature more adventurous.

The custom in the "younger" families was that when the head had no male heir, the headship passed to the daughter's eldest son. In such cases the heir took the name of his mother’s family while retaining the father’s family name in second place; this was the case with [[Otho Sackville-Baggins]], who obtained headship of the Sackvilles through his mother [[Camellia Sackville|Camellia]].<ref name=L214/>

===Gift-giving===
The Hobbits generally exchanged gifts as a form of "payment" for services but also of thanksgiving in favors and friendships. According to an ancient custom, a hobbit baby, shortly after birth and its name-announcement, was given a gift by the head of the family, as a token of accepting it into the family (on the rare cases of adoptions, parents gave gifts to their new child). Gifts then became a means of recognizing family membership, and the head of the family ritually gave something, even if only a token ([[mathom]]), to a [[ribadyan|birthday celebrant]].

On its third birthday, a hobbit child gave presents to their parents, that typically was something that was personally found, or produced (made or grown). This may have been extended to other ages and relatives resulting to the celebrant both receiving and giving a gift. Birthdays had considerable social importance, and customs were regulated by fairly strict etiquette, usually reduced to formalities.<ref name=L214>{{L|214}}</ref>

==Origin==
[[File:Lidia Postma - Hobbits comparison.jpg|thumb|left|The three kinds of Hobbits. Arty by Lidia Postma]]
Hobbits were considered Men. Nearly all scholars agree that Men were closely related to Hobbits, far more closely than Men were to either [[Elves]] or [[Dwarves]]. It was thus commonly assumed that Hobbits were among the Younger [[Children of Ilúvatar]] and were the result of the same act of creation as Men. This would imply that Hobbits had the [[Gift of Men]] to pass entirely beyond [[Arda]].

It is supposed that Hobbits branched out from Men as a race in the [[Elder Days]], but they don't appear at all in the chronicles of the [[Elves]].<ref name=Concerning>{{FR|Hobbits}}</ref> Their exact origin is unknown but in their early days they could have been primitive and "savage".<ref name=atani/> Apparently they survived in [[Middle-earth]] for millennia far from importance and the knowledge of stronger races; they come into the records not earlier than the early [[Third Age]] where they were living in the [[Vales of Anduin]] in [[Rhovanion|Wilderland]], between [[Mirkwood]] and the [[Misty Mountains]]. They have lost the genealogical details of how they are related to the rest of mankind. While they stayed there, the [[Northmen]] knew them. Their descendants, the [[Rohirrim]], had that memory of the ''[[holbytla]]n'' and they remained an object of lore until they contacted them during the War of the Ring. Many old words and names in "[[Hobbitish]]" are cognates of words in [[Rohirric]], so much so that even someone without linguistic training could make out the relation ([[Meriadoc Brandybuck]] would later write an entire book devoted to the relationship, ''[[Old Words and Names in the Shire]]'').

==History==

[[File:Robin Wood - Mathom lore.jpg|thumb|''Mathom lore'' by Robin Wood]]
While situated in the Valley of the Anduin River the Hobbits lived close by the Northmen. Some time near the beginning of the [[Third Age]], they were uneasy because of the growing numbers of [[Easterlings|alien men]] from the [[East]] who passed the [[Greenwood]] and harassed the Northmen and no doubt they also sensed the rising [[Shadow]] of [[Dol Guldur]].<ref name=atani/> They took the arduous task of crossing the [[Misty Mountains]], beginning thus their '''[[Wandering Days]]'''. Some of the Stoors, however, returned to that place, and it is from these people that [[Gollum]] would come many years later.

The Hobbits took different routes in their journey westward, and eventually they came to a land between the River [[Baranduin]] (which they renamed ''Brandywine'') and the [[Weather Hills]]. Along the way they founded many settlements (most of them disappeared and were forgotten), and the divisions between the Hobbit-kinds began to blur. Only [[Bree]] and a few surrounding villages lasted to the end of the Third Age.

In the year {{TA|1601}}, two Fallohide brothers, [[Marcho]] and [[Blanco]], decided to cross the River Brandywine and settle on the other side. Large numbers of Hobbits followed them, and most of their former territory was depopulated. The new land that they found on the west bank of the Brandywine is called [[The Shire]].

Hobbits became first famous and a renowned part of the wider history during the [[Quest of Erebor]] ([[Bilbo Baggins]] was the first ever famous Hobbit) and later during the [[War of the Ring]]. In the later [[Ages]] they have dwindled and their numbers have diminished and although they still linger in the North-west of the Old World, they are rarely seen; they avoid the [[Big Folk]] with dismay, using their art of disappearing.<ref name=Concerning/>

==Some well-known Hobbits==
[[File:Anke Eißmann - Frodo and Bilbo.jpg|thumb|''Frodo and Bilbo'' by [[Anke Eißmann]]]]
* [[Bilbo Baggins]]
* [[Frodo Baggins]]
* [[Samwise Gamgee|Samwise "Sam" Gamgee]]
* [[Meriadoc Brandybuck|Meriadoc "Merry" Brandybuck]]
* [[Peregrin Took|Peregrin "Pippin" Took]]
* [[Fredegar Bolger|Fredegar "Fatty" Bolger]]
* [[Otho Sackville-Baggins|Otho]] and [[Lotho Sackville-Baggins]]
* [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]]
* [[Gerontius Took|Old Took]]
* [[Bandobras Took|Bullroarer Took]]
* [[Sméagol]] (who became the creature [[Gollum]])
* [[Déagol]]

Though in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' it is mentioned that [[Gandalf]] "was responsible for so many quiet lads and lasses going off into the Blue for mad adventures," no female Hobbits are depicted in [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s stories doing so; however Hobbit women do appear in his works, such as the formidable [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]] and Sam's wife [[Rose Cotton|Rose Cotton]].

== Etymology ==
:''This section explains the fictional etymology of the word in the linguistic context of Middle-earth; for the actual origin of the word see the section [[#Inspiration]] below''.
''Hobbit'' was derived from [[Old English]] ''[[holbytla]]'', "hole-dweller" which represents the [[Rohirric]] language.<ref>{{HM|RW}}, p. 144</ref> In a letter, Tolkien commented on the pronounciation of the word ''hobbit'': "I am sure many hobbits drop their ''h''s like most rural folk in England".<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Alina Dadlez (19 September 1962)]]" (letter); quoted in {{CG|RG}}, p. 1036</ref>

The relationship hobbit/holbytla parallels the original [[Westron]] ''[[Kuduk]]'' (Hobbit), derived from the actual Rohirric ''[[kûd-dûkan]]'' (holbytla, hole dweller). This name obviously derives from the times when the hobbits lived at the [[Vales of Anduin]] with the [[Northmen]].<ref name="Road">{{TT|III8}}</ref><ref name="Translation">{{App|F2}}</ref>

Hobbits were also called ''[[Halflings]]'' by the [[Dúnedain]], first when they still measured 2 [[ranga]]r tall; twice as high as a hobbit who would reach only 1 ranga. The word retained even when the later generations of Dúnedain became shorter. However, the term is slightly offensive to Hobbits, as to themselves they are not 'half' of anything, and certainly do not use the term to refer to themselves.{{fact}}

''Halfling'' represents a translation of [[Westron]] ''[[banakil]]''. In [[Quenya]] the word is ''[[perian|Perian(d-)]]'' pl. ''Periandi''<ref>{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/press/856-most_expensive_Tolkien_book_in_the_world.php|articlename=Most expensive Tolkien bok in the world|website=[http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/index.php TolkienLibrary.com]}}, dedication to [[Elaine Griffiths]]</ref> and in [[Sindarin]] ''[[Perian]]'' pl. ''Periannath''.<ref>{{RK|Cormallen}}</ref>

*''See also: [[Wikipedia:Hobbit (word)]]''

==Inspiration==
{{quote|I am in fact a Hobbit (in all but size). I like gardens, trees and unmechanized farmlands; I smoke a pipe, and like good plain food [...]; I like, and even dare to wear in these dull days, ornamental waistcoats. I am fond of mushrooms (out of a field); have a very simple sense of humour [...]; I go to bed late and get up late [...]. I do not travel much.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]]|[[Letter 213]]}}

The name 'Hobbit' was probably constructed meaningless as a spontaneous inspiration, without prior intent, but it would have been natural for him to see in it the prefix ''hob'' as in [[Hobgoblin]]. When later he began to work out the language relations further (see: [[Mannish]]) he decided that it could be a derived form of an [[Old English]] word such as ''[[holbytla]]''. Tolkien also claimed "that the only E. word that influenced the invention was ‘hole’; that granted the description of hobbits"<ref>{{L|319}}</ref>".

According to Tolkien, the word ''hobbit'' came first, and then he decided to write ''[[The Hobbit]]'' around it. As a university lecturer, he was in the process of correcting reports when he started scribbling on a blank piece of paper and wrote, "In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit", and the rest of the story sprang from that.<ref>[[Humphrey Carpenter]], ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien: A Biography]]'', p.172</ref> The idea of a little hole dwelling creature was introduced to Tolkien by one of his students in a story he had written.

It was revealed recently that the word pre-dated Tolkien's usage, though with a different meaning).<ref name="annot">{{HM|AH}}</ref> Tolkien's concept of hobbits, in turn, seems to have been inspired by Edward Wyke Smith's 1927 children's book ''[[Wikipedia:The Marvellous Land of Snergs|The Marvellous Land of Snergs]]'', and by Sinclair Lewis's 1922 novel ''[[Wikipedia:Babbitt (novel)|Babbitt]]''. Tolkien wrote to [[W.H. Auden]] that ''The Marvellous Land of Snergs'' "was probably an unconscious source-book for the Hobbits"<ref name=annot/> and he told an interviewer that the word ''hobbit'' "might have been associated with Sinclair Lewis's ''Babbitt''" who enjoys the comforts of his home.

The name ''hobbit'' had previously appeared in an obscure "[[Wikipedia:Denham Tracts|list of spirits]]" by Michael Denham, which includes several repetitions. There is no evidence to suggest Tolkien used this as a source — indeed he spent many years trying to find out whether he really did coin the word. Denham's "hobbit spirits" (which are never referenced anywhere except in the long list) have no obvious relation to Tolkien's Hobbits, other than the name (which may possibly imply hob- "small"): Tolkien's Hobbits are small humans, not spirits. Nonetheless, some few people have suggested that the reference in the Denham list should invalidate the trademark.

== In popular usage ==
"Hobbit" is a trademark owned by the [[Middle-earth Enterprises]], as some of names, places and artifacts included in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' and ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' by [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]. For this reason [[Dungeons and Dragons]] and other fantasy tend to refer to Hobbits and Hobbit-like races rather as '''Halflings''' (''hin'' in the Mystara universe, ''hurthlings'' in Ancient Domains of Mystery).

''[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_floresiensis Homo floresiensis]'', a possible species in the genus Homo (thus, related to humans) discovered in 2004, has been informally dubbed a "hobbit" by its discoverers due to its small size.

[[Tolkien fandom|Fans]] have noted that in depictions and adaptations such as [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]], Hobbits are shown with unusually large feet, a conception probably influenced by the widespread art of [[the Brothers Hildebrandt]]. However, Tolkien himself never mentioned that large feet was a general feature of Hobbits.<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_printable;post=365823;guest=38267446|articlename=Big Feet|dated=|website=[http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?guest=35804230 The One Ring Forums]|accessed=2 September 2012}}</ref>

{{references}}
[[Category:Hobbits| ]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/hobbits/hobbits]]
[[de:Hobbits]]
[[fi:Hobitit]]

Hobbits

2022-09-23T02:58:57Z

Trahald: /* Inspiration */

{{sources}}
{{disambig-more|Hobbits|[[The Hobbit (disambiguation)]]}}
{{people infobox
| name=Hobbits
| image=[[File:Lukasz Siudzinsk - Hobbit.jpg|250px]]
| caption="[[:File:Lukasz Siudzinsk - Hobbit.jpg|Hobbit]]" by Lukasz Siudzinsk
| pronun=
| othernames=Banakil, Halflings, Holbytlan, Kuduk, Little People, Periannath
| origin=
| location=[[The Shire]], [[Buckland]], [[Bree-land]]
| affiliation=[[Host of the West (Arnor)|Host of the West]]
| rivalry=
| language=[[Hobbitish]] (a regional dialect of [[Westron]])
| members=[[Marcho]] and [[Blanco]], [[Sméagol]], [[Bandobras Took]], [[Bilbo Baggins]], [[Frodo Baggins]]
| lifespan=c. 96<ref name="LOTRProjectStats">{{webcite|author=Emil Johansson|articleurl=http://lotrproject.com/statistics/#lifeexpectancy|articlename=Lord of the Rings in Statistics|website=[http://lotrproject.com/ Lord of the Rings Project]|accessed=09-September-2012}}</ref>
| distinctions=[[Gift of Men|Mortality]], diminutive stature, furry feet
| height=2-4 ft or 0.6-1.2 m (often less than three feet in later days)
| hair=Typically curly brown, rarely blond (until the [[Fourth Age]]), and white and grey in later years
| skin=Nut-brown to White
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
{{quote|In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit.|''[[The Hobbit]]'', "[[An Unexpected Party]]"}}
'''Hobbits''' were a small race that typically dwelt underground, believed to be related to [[Men]]. They played little role in history, save during the [[War of the Ring]].

==Description and culture==
{{quote|There is more in you of good than you know, child of the kindly [[Eriador|West]]. Some courage and some wisdom, blended in measure. If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.|[[Thorin Oakenshield]] in ''[[The Hobbit]]'', "[[The Return Journey]]"}}

Hobbits were between two and four feet tall,<ref name=Concerning>{{FR|Hobbits}}</ref> with differences between male and female: about 3 feet 6 inches for males<ref>{{NM|P2vi}}, "Heights", p. 195</ref> and seldom exceeded 3 feet for female.<ref name=atani>{{PM|Atani}}</ref> They had short legs, slightly pointed ears<ref>{{L|27}}</ref> and furry feet with leathery soles, resulting in most never wearing shoes. Compared to the [[Dwarves]] they are a bit shorter and less stout or stocky. Early in their recorded history, Hobbits were divided in three kinds with different customs and temperament. The '''[[Stoors]]''' grew facial hair and had an affinity for water, boats and swimming and wore boots; the '''[[Fallohides]]''' were fair, tall and slim, an adventurous people, friendlier and more open to outsiders. Finally, the '''[[Harfoots]]''' were the most numerous and instituted the living in burrows. In later days the Harfoot traits became the "norm".

Hobbits had a life span somewhat longer than Men of non-[[Númenórean]] descent, averaging between 90 and 100 years. The time at which a young hobbit "came of age" was 33.<ref name=FRI1>{{FR|I1}}</ref> The two oldest-living recorded hobbits (except [[Gollum]]) were The [[Gerontius Took|Old Took]] (who reached the age of 130) and [[Bilbo Baggins]] (who surpassed him at 131).

By nature they were of gentle disposition, neither cruel nor vindictive.<ref>{{PM|XNotes}}, #55</ref> Slow to quarrel, they never had been warlike, and never fought among themselves, nor hunted for sport; by the late Third Age the Shire-hobbits knew of weapons only as trophies or useless trinkets. However they were skilled with all kind of tools, as well as arms when there was a need; they were keen-eyed and used the bow well, and also the stones, successfully throwed against trespassing beasts.

Throughout their history Hobbits had showed unparalleled skill, courage and also endurance and resistance in times of danger and terror. During their [[Wandering Days]] Hobbits demonstrated an easiness to adapt to the environments they visited and adopted the customs and languages of the peoples they were in contact with. In the Shire, they had settled with a closed and comfort-loving lifestyle; they were fond of an unadventurous bucolic life of farming, eating, smoking [[pipe-weed]], socializing and talking about genealogies. Hobbits also liked to drink ale in inns, and ate at least six meals a day when they could get them. Every [[Highday]] and after noon, Hobbits celebrated a small holiday with evening feasts. <ref name=cal>{{App|Calendars}}</ref>

However, their hidden potentials resurfaced in difficult times; in the [[Long Winter]], [[Gandalf]] admired their uncomplaining courage and pity for one another, thanks to which they survived.<ref>{{UT|Erebor}}</ref> Another example of Hobbitish hardiness and resistant nature, was [[Gollum]], who despite using [[the One Ring]] for years, did not transform into a [[Wraiths|Wraith]] under the Ring's evil power (unlike the [[Nazgûl|nine Mannish Kings]]).<ref>
{{webcite|author=Stan Brown|website=FAQ of the Rings|articleurl=http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/ringfaq.htm#Q1-GollumWraith |articlename=Why hadn’t Gollum turned into a wraith long ago?}}</ref> These surprising Hobbit traits also were tested and proven during the [[Quest of Erebor]] and, most notably, the [[War of the Ring]].

===Clans and families===
Hobbits were universally monogamous and "[[Wikipedia:Patrilineality|patrilinear]]" (family names descended in the male-line) and normally the titular family head was the eldest male, but his wife had an equal, but separate status. In the large powerful families (such as the [[Took Family|Tooks]]) the head of what we would call a clan was the eldest male of the most direct line of descent. If the master died first his titular headship of the clan was taken by his wife and, only after her death, by their son.

Chieftains and leaders of their clans and tribes were typically of Fallohide kind, as they were by nature more adventurous.

The custom in the "younger" families was that when the head had no male heir, the headship passed to the daughter's eldest son. In such cases the heir took the name of his mother’s family while retaining the father’s family name in second place; this was the case with [[Otho Sackville-Baggins]], who obtained headship of the Sackvilles through his mother [[Camellia Sackville|Camellia]].<ref name=L214/>

===Gift-giving===
The Hobbits generally exchanged gifts as a form of "payment" for services but also of thanksgiving in favors and friendships. According to an ancient custom, a hobbit baby, shortly after birth and its name-announcement, was given a gift by the head of the family, as a token of accepting it into the family (on the rare cases of adoptions, parents gave gifts to their new child). Gifts then became a means of recognizing family membership, and the head of the family ritually gave something, even if only a token ([[mathom]]), to a [[ribadyan|birthday celebrant]].

On its third birthday, a hobbit child gave presents to their parents, that typically was something that was personally found, or produced (made or grown). This may have been extended to other ages and relatives resulting to the celebrant both receiving and giving a gift. Birthdays had considerable social importance, and customs were regulated by fairly strict etiquette, usually reduced to formalities.<ref name=L214>{{L|214}}</ref>

==Origin==
[[File:Lidia Postma - Hobbits comparison.jpg|thumb|left|The three kinds of Hobbits. Arty by Lidia Postma]]
Hobbits were considered Men. Nearly all scholars agree that Men were closely related to Hobbits, far more closely than Men were to either [[Elves]] or [[Dwarves]]. It was thus commonly assumed that Hobbits were among the Younger [[Children of Ilúvatar]] and were the result of the same act of creation as Men. This would imply that Hobbits had the [[Gift of Men]] to pass entirely beyond [[Arda]].

It is supposed that Hobbits branched out from Men as a race in the [[Elder Days]], but they don't appear at all in the chronicles of the [[Elves]].<ref name=Concerning>{{FR|Hobbits}}</ref> Their exact origin is unknown but in their early days they could have been primitive and "savage".<ref name=atani/> Apparently they survived in [[Middle-earth]] for millennia far from importance and the knowledge of stronger races; they come into the records not earlier than the early [[Third Age]] where they were living in the [[Vales of Anduin]] in [[Rhovanion|Wilderland]], between [[Mirkwood]] and the [[Misty Mountains]]. They have lost the genealogical details of how they are related to the rest of mankind. While they stayed there, the [[Northmen]] knew them. Their descendants, the [[Rohirrim]], had that memory of the ''[[holbytla]]n'' and they remained an object of lore until they contacted them during the War of the Ring. Many old words and names in "[[Hobbitish]]" are cognates of words in [[Rohirric]], so much so that even someone without linguistic training could make out the relation ([[Meriadoc Brandybuck]] would later write an entire book devoted to the relationship, ''[[Old Words and Names in the Shire]]'').

==History==

[[File:Robin Wood - Mathom lore.jpg|thumb|''Mathom lore'' by Robin Wood]]
While situated in the Valley of the Anduin River the Hobbits lived close by the Northmen. Some time near the beginning of the [[Third Age]], they were uneasy because of the growing numbers of [[Easterlings|alien men]] from the [[East]] who passed the [[Greenwood]] and harassed the Northmen and no doubt they also sensed the rising [[Shadow]] of [[Dol Guldur]].<ref name=atani/> They took the arduous task of crossing the [[Misty Mountains]], beginning thus their '''[[Wandering Days]]'''. Some of the Stoors, however, returned to that place, and it is from these people that [[Gollum]] would come many years later.

The Hobbits took different routes in their journey westward, and eventually they came to a land between the River [[Baranduin]] (which they renamed ''Brandywine'') and the [[Weather Hills]]. Along the way they founded many settlements (most of them disappeared and were forgotten), and the divisions between the Hobbit-kinds began to blur. Only [[Bree]] and a few surrounding villages lasted to the end of the Third Age.

In the year {{TA|1601}}, two Fallohide brothers, [[Marcho]] and [[Blanco]], decided to cross the River Brandywine and settle on the other side. Large numbers of Hobbits followed them, and most of their former territory was depopulated. The new land that they found on the west bank of the Brandywine is called [[The Shire]].

Hobbits became first famous and a renowned part of the wider history during the [[Quest of Erebor]] ([[Bilbo Baggins]] was the first ever famous Hobbit) and later during the [[War of the Ring]]. In the later [[Ages]] they have dwindled and their numbers have diminished and although they still linger in the North-west of the Old World, they are rarely seen; they avoid the [[Big Folk]] with dismay, using their art of disappearing.<ref name=Concerning/>

==Some well-known Hobbits==
[[File:Anke Eißmann - Frodo and Bilbo.jpg|thumb|''Frodo and Bilbo'' by [[Anke Eißmann]]]]
* [[Bilbo Baggins]]
* [[Frodo Baggins]]
* [[Samwise Gamgee|Samwise "Sam" Gamgee]]
* [[Meriadoc Brandybuck|Meriadoc "Merry" Brandybuck]]
* [[Peregrin Took|Peregrin "Pippin" Took]]
* [[Fredegar Bolger|Fredegar "Fatty" Bolger]]
* [[Otho Sackville-Baggins|Otho]] and [[Lotho Sackville-Baggins]]
* [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]]
* [[Gerontius Took|Old Took]]
* [[Bandobras Took|Bullroarer Took]]
* [[Sméagol]] (who became the creature [[Gollum]])
* [[Déagol]]

Though in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' it is mentioned that [[Gandalf]] "was responsible for so many quiet lads and lasses going off into the Blue for mad adventures," no female Hobbits are depicted in [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s stories doing so; however Hobbit women do appear in his works, such as the formidable [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]] and Sam's wife [[Rose Cotton|Rose Cotton]].

== Etymology ==
:''This section explains the fictional etymology of the word in the linguistic context of Middle-earth; for the actual origin of the word see the section [[#Inspiration]] below''.
''Hobbit'' was derived from [[Old English]] ''[[holbytla]]'', "hole-dweller" which represents the [[Rohirric]] language.<ref>{{HM|RW}}, p. 144</ref> In a letter, Tolkien commented on the pronounciation of the word ''hobbit'': "I am sure many hobbits drop their ''h''s like most rural folk in England".<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Alina Dadlez (19 September 1962)]]" (letter); quoted in {{CG|RG}}, p. 1036</ref>

The relationship hobbit/holbytla parallels the original [[Westron]] ''[[Kuduk]]'' (Hobbit), derived from the actual Rohirric ''[[kûd-dûkan]]'' (holbytla, hole dweller). This name obviously derives from the times when the hobbits lived at the [[Vales of Anduin]] with the [[Northmen]].<ref name="Road">{{TT|III8}}</ref><ref name="Translation">{{App|F2}}</ref>

Hobbits were also called ''[[Halflings]]'' by the [[Dúnedain]], first when they still measured 2 [[ranga]]r tall; twice as high as a hobbit who would reach only 1 ranga. The word retained even when the later generations of Dúnedain became shorter. However, the term is slightly offensive to Hobbits, as to themselves they are not 'half' of anything, and certainly do not use the term to refer to themselves.{{fact}}

''Halfling'' represents a translation of [[Westron]] ''[[banakil]]''. In [[Quenya]] the word is ''[[perian|Perian(d-)]]'' pl. ''Periandi''<ref>{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/press/856-most_expensive_Tolkien_book_in_the_world.php|articlename=Most expensive Tolkien bok in the world|website=[http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/index.php TolkienLibrary.com]}}, dedication to [[Elaine Griffiths]]</ref> and in [[Sindarin]] ''[[Perian]]'' pl. ''Periannath''.<ref>{{RK|Cormallen}}</ref>

*''See also: [[Wikipedia:Hobbit (word)]]''

==Inspiration==
{{quote|I am in fact a Hobbit (in all but size). I like gardens, trees and unmechanized farmlands; I smoke a pipe, and like good plain food [...]; I like, and even dare to wear in these dull days, ornamental waistcoats. I am fond of mushrooms (out of a field); have a very simple sense of humour [...]; I go to bed late and get up late [...]. I do not travel much.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]]|[[Letter 213]]}}

The name 'Hobbit' was probably constructed meaningless as a spontaneous inspiration, without prior intent, but it would have been natural for him to see in it the prefix ''hob'' as in [[Hobgolbin]]. When later he began to work out the language relations further (see: [[Mannish]]) he decided that it could be a derived form of an [[Old English]] word such as ''[[holbytla]]''. Tolkien also claimed "that the only E. word that influenced the invention was ‘hole’; that granted the description of hobbits"<ref>{{L|319}}</ref>".

According to Tolkien, the word ''hobbit'' came first, and then he decided to write ''[[The Hobbit]]'' around it. As a university lecturer, he was in the process of correcting reports when he started scribbling on a blank piece of paper and wrote, "In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit", and the rest of the story sprang from that.<ref>[[Humphrey Carpenter]], ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien: A Biography]]'', p.172</ref> The idea of a little hole dwelling creature was introduced to Tolkien by one of his students in a story he had written.

It was revealed recently that the word pre-dated Tolkien's usage, though with a different meaning).<ref name="annot">{{HM|AH}}</ref> Tolkien's concept of hobbits, in turn, seems to have been inspired by Edward Wyke Smith's 1927 children's book ''[[Wikipedia:The Marvellous Land of Snergs|The Marvellous Land of Snergs]]'', and by Sinclair Lewis's 1922 novel ''[[Wikipedia:Babbitt (novel)|Babbitt]]''. Tolkien wrote to [[W.H. Auden]] that ''The Marvellous Land of Snergs'' "was probably an unconscious source-book for the Hobbits"<ref name=annot/> and he told an interviewer that the word ''hobbit'' "might have been associated with Sinclair Lewis's ''Babbitt''" who enjoys the comforts of his home.

The name ''hobbit'' had previously appeared in an obscure "[[Wikipedia:Denham Tracts|list of spirits]]" by Michael Denham, which includes several repetitions. There is no evidence to suggest Tolkien used this as a source — indeed he spent many years trying to find out whether he really did coin the word. Denham's "hobbit spirits" (which are never referenced anywhere except in the long list) have no obvious relation to Tolkien's Hobbits, other than the name (which may possibly imply hob- "small"): Tolkien's Hobbits are small humans, not spirits. Nonetheless, some few people have suggested that the reference in the Denham list should invalidate the trademark.

== In popular usage ==
"Hobbit" is a trademark owned by the [[Middle-earth Enterprises]], as some of names, places and artifacts included in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' and ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' by [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]. For this reason [[Dungeons and Dragons]] and other fantasy tend to refer to Hobbits and Hobbit-like races rather as '''Halflings''' (''hin'' in the Mystara universe, ''hurthlings'' in Ancient Domains of Mystery).

''[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_floresiensis Homo floresiensis]'', a possible species in the genus Homo (thus, related to humans) discovered in 2004, has been informally dubbed a "hobbit" by its discoverers due to its small size.

[[Tolkien fandom|Fans]] have noted that in depictions and adaptations such as [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]], Hobbits are shown with unusually large feet, a conception probably influenced by the widespread art of [[the Brothers Hildebrandt]]. However, Tolkien himself never mentioned that large feet was a general feature of Hobbits.<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_printable;post=365823;guest=38267446|articlename=Big Feet|dated=|website=[http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?guest=35804230 The One Ring Forums]|accessed=2 September 2012}}</ref>

{{references}}
[[Category:Hobbits| ]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/hobbits/hobbits]]
[[de:Hobbits]]
[[fi:Hobitit]]

Talk:Hobbits

2022-09-23T02:27:34Z

Trahald: /* The prefix "Hob" */

==Do we know anything about [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] funerals?==

As I like to know as it seem I don't find it menthioned in most sources that I read, save for some fan fiction that I had read. Also about burial grounds too. So do you what to dicussed about this topic or not? Do you find it interesting and mysterious? Thanks. {{unsigned|70.242.13.70}}

:They buried the dead together in a pit after the [[Battle of Bywater]]. No other funeral practises are known, but other mass graves are not very likely. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:11, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

== Hobbit feet, size ==

The main article posits that the Lord of the rings movies and other representations show hobbit feet as being larger in proportion to the rest of the body than men's feet. And it says the Tolkien's writings say nothing about this. I don't recall the movies making a point about the feet being bigger, such as in any commentary from characters. Perhaps it is mere accident that we can see that the feet are bigger on hobbits; after all, they chose to do hobbit feet by adding appliances to people's feet. Were they not something like shoes? If that's the case, as opposed to just adding fur to the top of the actors' feet with glue, then naturally the movie feet would wind up being bigger in all respects! But that would be an accident of makeup, not something for anyone to take real notice of. (For myself, I don't remember watching the movies and thinking that the feet on the hobbits look particularly big, anyway.)

And if the relative size of the feet in the referenced representations is merely an accident, and not especially noticeable, unless you're looking for it, then I contend that the main article should not say anything about it. I suppose that if this is something people are commenting on, for whatever definition of "people", then the article might mention it while at the same time discounting it as I just have. something like the following: "Some people note the relative largeness of hobbit feet in the Lord of the rings movies and other visual representations, but Tolkien never mentioned the size of hobbits' feet in any writing or speech; therefore, the relative size of such representations can and should be completely ignored, as relates to Canon."

I myself am not a regular frequenter of this site, and am unlikely to check back at any particular point, or follow up this discussion. But it seems such an obvious point to me, that it was worth throwing out for discussion amongst the regulars. Have a great day, folks! {{unsigned|184.58.130.163}}

==Changing main picture==

This article needs a new main picture! How about:
*[[:File:Henning Janssen - Hobbit Marching Band.jpg|File:Henning Janssen - Hobbit Marching Band.jpg]]
'''''or'''''
*[[:File:Frithjof Spangenberg - Bilbo's Birthday.jpg|File:Frithjof Spangenberg - Bilbo's Birthday.jpg]]
? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 20:36, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

:What about [[:File:Inger Edelfeldt - A Long Expected Party.jpg|Inger Edelfeldt - A Long Expected Party.jpg]]? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 21:19, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

::It's very appropriate, indeed! +1 on Edelfeldt.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 21:34, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

== Where does it say hobbits' exact skin tone? ==

This article says hobbit skin is nut-brown to white. I was wondering where it says that.—SingingOrc

== The prefix "Hob" ==
Under "Inspiration", it currently suggests a connection with German ''hob'' meaning ''small''. Where does this come from? I can't find it in any dictionary accessible to me.
''Hobgoblin'' is among the list of examples, but Tolkien made it clear that ''Hobgoblin'' is for the ''larger'' kind<ref>{{H|Preface}}</ref>, not smaller!

Per OED hob- in hobgoblin is from Hob:
"1. A familiar or rustic variation of the Christian name Robert or Robin. Hence formerly a generic name for: A rustic, a clown".
"2. = Robin Goodfellow or Puck; a hobgoblin, sprite, elf"

-- [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 03:46, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

I'll remove it for now. The text was present from the first version but it seems it was based on a misunderstanding of the element hob-. It's probably not ''German'' and we can't infer the meaning ''small'' from Tolkien's ''hobgoblin''. The other two examples (''hobbledehoy, hobyah'') are even more vague in meaning and etymology. I don't think you can extract ''hob'' from them.
-- [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] ([[User talk:Trahald|talk]]) 02:27, 23 September 2022 (UTC)

Noldor

2022-09-22T11:02:57Z

Trahald: adds source

{{sources}}{{people infobox
| name=Noldor
| image=[[File:Jenny Dolfen - The Coming of Fingolfin.jpg|250px]]
| caption="The Coming of Fingolfin" by [[Jenny Dolfen]]
| pronun=[[Quenya|Q]], {{IPA|[ˈnoldor]}}/{{IPA|[ˈŋoldor]}}
| othernames=''Tatyar'' ([[Quenya|Q]]), ''Golodhrim'' ([[Sindarin|S]]), ''Nómin'' ([[Taliska|T]]), ''Golug'' ([[Black Speech|BS]]), Deep Elves, Loremasters
| location=[[Tirion]], [[Formenos]], [[Nevrast]], [[Hithlum]], [[Gondolin]], [[Nargothrond]], [[Dorthonion]], [[East Beleriand]], [[Lindon]], [[Eregion]], [[Lothlórien]], [[Imladris]]
| affiliation=[[Union of Maedhros]], [[Host of the West]], [[Last Alliance]], [[Gwaith-i-Mirdain]], [[White Council]]
| rivalry=
| language=[[Quenya]], [[Sindarin]], [[Westron]]
| members=[[Finwë]], [[Fëanor]], [[Fingolfin]], [[Finarfin]], [[Maedhros]], [[Fingon]], [[Turgon]], [[Finrod]], [[Galadriel]], [[Gil-galad]], [[Celebrimbor]]
| lifespan=[[Immortal]]
| distinctions=Great skill with metal and gems, deep knowledge, great warriors
| height=Typically 7 feet<ref>{{PM|Atani}}</ref>
| hair=Dark (very dark-brown or black), sometimes red (in the case of [[Míriel]] even silver
| skin=Fair
| clothing=
| weapons=Swords and shields
}}
{{quote|Next came the Noldor, a name of wisdom, the people of [[Finwë]]. They are the Deep Elves, the friends of [[Aulë]]; and they are renowned in song, for they fought and laboured long and grievously in the northern lands of old.|''[[Quenta Silmarillion]]'', "[[Of the Coming of the Elves and the Captivity of Melkor]]"}}
The '''Noldor''' or '''Ñoldor''' were those of the second clan of the [[Elves]] who came to [[Aman]].
They were highly skilled in crafts and gained much knowledge, which they passed on to [[Men]] after their [[Exile of the Noldor|Exile]]. Their [[King of the Noldor|King]] was originally [[Finwë]], but he was slain by [[Morgoth]], leading his son [[Fëanor]] to avenge him and the theft of his [[Silmarils|jewels]] by making war upon Morgoth in [[Middle-earth]]. The war of the Noldor against Morgoth comprises many of the tales of the [[First Age]].

==Origins==
According to legend, the clan was founded by [[Tata]], the second Elf to awake at [[Cuiviénen]]. With him were his spouse Tatië and their 54 companions, and this clan became known as the '''''Tatyar'''''. [[Finwë]], the first Ñoldo to come to [[Valinor]] with [[Oromë]], became their King, and led most of them to Valinor. Out of the original 56 Tatyar who awoke at Cuiviénen, 28 remained at the place of their awakening, becoming [[Avari]], while the other original 28 and their offspring continued on their [[Great Journey]].

==History==
===Elder Days===
====In Valinor====
[[File:Konstantin Zahariev - A Noldorin Prince.jpg|thumb|''A Noldorin Prince'' by Konstantin Zahariev]]
The Noldor were accounted the greatest of the Elves and all the peoples in [[Middle-earth]] in lore and crafts. In Valinor, their knowledge and skill became great, and they had always a strong desire for more knowledge and skill in art, surpassing even their teachers in many things. The Noldor had also a love for words, and were changeful in speech, endeavouring to find suitable names for all things. They were beloved of [[Aulë]] the Smith, and were the first to discover and carve gems. Their chief dwelling-place was the city of [[Tirion]] upon [[Túna]].<ref name=Eldamar>{{S|5}}</ref> Among the wisest of the Noldor was [[Rúmil (elf of Tirion)|Rúmil]], creator of the first writing system and author of many books of lore.<ref name=Unchaining>{{S|6}}</ref> [[Fëanor]], son of Finwë and [[Míriel]], was the greatest of their craftsmen, "mightiest in skill of word and of hand",<ref name=Eldamar/> and creator of the [[Silmarils]].<ref name=Silmarils>{{S|7}}</ref>

[[Melkor]] harboured a hatred for the Elves, despising their joy and blaming them for his downfall, and he sought to deceive them by feigning friendship. The Noldor, eager for knowledge, listened to him most readily of the kindreds. So he went often among them, offering counsel, and the Noldor hearkened to him.<ref name=Unchaining/> During this time, Fëanor created the Silmarils, and Melkor, desiring them greatly, sought ever to spread ideas and rumours among the Noldor. But amid his seemingly good advice, Melkor sowed lies to turn one House of the Noldor against another, and in the end the peace in Tirion was poisoned. After threatening his half-brother [[Fingolfin]], believing falsely that Fingolfin intended to usurp the throne, Fëanor was banished from Tirion by the [[Valar]]. With him went his [[Sons of Fëanor|seven sons]], and his father Finwë, King of the Noldor. Fingolfin remained behind as the ruler of the Noldor of Tirion.<ref name=Silmarils/>

But Melkor had yet other designs to accomplish. Soon after, with the aid of [[Ungoliant]], he destroyed the [[Two Trees]],<ref>{{S|8}}</ref> and coming to [[Formenos]] he killed Finwë, stole the Silmarils, and departed from Aman. Fëanor, driven by grief and desiring vengeance, rebelled against the Valar by coming back into Tirion and making a speech before the Noldor, in which he persuaded them to leave Valinor, follow Melkor to [[Middle-earth]], and wage war against him for the recovery of the Silmarils. He swore a terrible [[Oath of Fëanor|oath]], as did his [[Sons of Fëanor|sons]], to pursue Melkor and reclaim the Silmarils at all costs. Fëanor then claimed the kingship of the Noldor since his father was dead. Although the greater part of the Noldor still held Fingolfin as their leader, they followed Fëanor into [[Exile of the Noldor|Exile]].<ref name=Exile>{{S|9}}</ref>

====Exile====
{{main|Exile of the Noldor}}
Fëanor led the Noldor from Tirion, his host in the front, followed by the hosts of Fingolfin and [[Finarfin]]. He led them to Alqualondë, seeking to persuade the Teleri to join with the Noldor in rebellion. But the Teleri did not wish to depart with the Noldor, nor aid them with the providing of ships. Angered, Fëanor assembled his host, and they took the ships by force, committing the first [[Kinslaying at Alqualondë|kinslaying]]. The host of Fingolfin, coming upon the battle and mistakenly believing the Teleri had attacked the Noldor, joined in the struggle, and many of the Teleri were slain. Taking the ships, the Noldor continued their journey northwards. A messenger from the Valar came later and delivered the [[Doom of Mandos]], pronouncing judgement on the Noldor for the Kinslaying and rebellion and warning that if they proceeded their oath would betray them, and moreover they would be slain or tormented by grief. At this, some of the Noldor who had no hand in the Kinslaying, including [[Finarfin]] son of Finwë and [[Indis]], returned to Valinor, and the Valar forgave them. Other Noldor led by Fingolfin remained determined to leave Valinor for Middle-earth, not desiring to be separated from their kin and fearing the Valar's judgement, for some among them had participated in the kinslaying. Among those that continued were [[Fingon]], [[Turgon]], [[Finrod]], and [[Galadriel]].<ref name=Exile/>

The Noldor suffered greatly during the cold journey, and began to mutter against Fëanor. Fearing treachery, Fëanor took his sons and those he deemed loyal to him, departing in the ships and crossing the sea to Middle-earth. He left behind those led by Fingolfin, his half-brother. Upon his arrival in Middle-earth, Fëanor had the ships burned. When the Noldor led by Fingolfin discovered their betrayal, they went farther north and crossed the sea at the treacherous [[Helcaraxë]], at the cost of many lives.<ref name=Exile/>

====In Middle-earth====
=====Arrival=====
Fëanor's company encamped in the region of [[Mithrim]] and was soon attacked by the host of Morgoth. The battle became known as a [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]], and was a great victory for the Noldor. But Fëanor rode too far from his host during the battle, pursuing the remnant of the [[Orcs]] in a vengeful mood. Several [[Balrogs|Balrogs]], including their Lord [[Gothmog (balrog)|Gothmog]], issued from [[Angband]] and fought him. Despite battling valiantly, Fëanor was mortally wounded and would have been captured and taken to Angband had it not been for the swift arrival of his sons. However, Fëanor died whilst being carried back to his own people.<ref name=Return>{{S|13}}</ref>

Because Fëanor had taken the ships and left the Noldor led by his half-brother on the west side of the sea, much enmity remained between the Houses of the Noldor. The feud was at last settled when [[Fingon]], son of Fingolfin, saved [[Maedhros]], Fëanor's son, from Morgoth's imprisonment. Maedhros was due to succeed Fëanor, but he regretted his part in the Kinslaying and waived his claim to the kingship of the Noldor to his uncle Fingolfin, who became the first [[High King of the Noldor]] in Middle-earth. The [[House of Fëanor]] became known as ''the Dispossessed'' after this.<ref name=Return/>

=====Kingdom of the Noldor=====
[[File:Mysilvergreen - King Fingon and his lords.jpg|thumb|''King Fingon and his lords'' by [[:Category:Images by Mysilvergreen|Mysilvergreen]]]]
In [[Beleriand]], the Noldor made alliance with the [[Sindar]]<ref name=Realms>{{S|14}}</ref> and later with the [[Edain]].<ref>{{S|17}}</ref> Fingolfin reigned long in the land of [[Hithlum]], and his younger son [[Turgon]] later ruled in his Hidden City of [[Gondolin]]. The Sons of Fëanor, under Maedhros, ruled the lands of [[East Beleriand]], while [[Finrod Felagund]], Finarfin's son, was the [[King of Nargothrond]].<ref name=Realms/>

Fingolfin's reign was marked by warfare against Morgoth and in {{FA|60}}, after their victory in [[Dagor Aglareb]], the Noldor [[Siege of Angband|besieged Angband]], the fortress of Morgoth.<ref>{{GA|78}}</ref> Yet in {{FA|455}},<ref>{{GA|145}}</ref> the Siege was broken by Morgoth in the [[Dagor Bragollach]], and many of the Noldor were slain or scattered. Fingolfin rode in despair to Angband and challenged Morgoth to [[Fall of Fingolfin|single combat]]. He dealt Morgoth seven wounds but perished, and was succeeded by his eldest son [[Fingon]], who became the second [[High King of the Noldor]].<ref>{{S|18}}</ref>

=====Demise=====
In {{FA|472}},<ref>{{GA|219}}</ref> Maedhros [[Union of Maedhros|organised]] an attack on Morgoth and this led to the [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]], the Battle of Unnumbered Tears. Betrayed by the new-come [[Easterlings]], the forces of the Noldor, Sindar and Edain were utterly defeated. Fingon the Valiant was slain; he was succeeded by his brother [[Turgon]] as the third [[High King of the Noldor]].<ref name=Nirnaeth>{{S|20}}</ref>

Morgoth scattered the remaining forces of the [[Sons of Fëanor]], and in {{FA|495}}, [[Nargothrond]] was also defeated.<ref>{{GA|275}}</ref> Turgon had withdrawn to Gondolin which was kept hidden from both Morgoth and other Elves.<ref name=Nirnaeth/> In {{FA|510}}, Gondolin was betrayed by [[Maeglin]] and [[Fall of Gondolin|sacked]].<ref>{{WJ|Years}}, p. 351</ref> During the attack, Turgon was killed; however, many of his [[Exiles of Gondolin|people escaped]] and found their way to the [[Mouths of Sirion]]. Turgon was the last surviving male descendant of Fingolfin, so [[Gil-galad]], great-grandson of Finarfin, became the fourth and last [[High King of the Noldor]] in Middle-earth.<ref>{{S|23}}</ref>

Finally, the [[Host of the West]] came down to Middle-earth and in {{FA|545}} to {{FA|583|n}}, the [[War of Wrath]] was fought and Morgoth was cast into the Void.<ref name=End>{{WJ|Years}}, p. 346</ref><ref>{{S|24}}</ref> As a result of the cataclysmic war, Beleriand sank into the sea, except for a part of [[Ossiriand]] (Lindon),<ref>{{S|Akallabeth}}</ref> and a few [[Tol Morwen|islands]].<ref>{{S|22}}</ref> The defeat of Morgoth marked the end of the [[First Age]] and the start of the [[Second Age|Second]].<ref name=End/>

===Second Age===
Most of the Noldor sailed back to [[Tol Eressea]] at the end of the First Age; but some, like [[Galadriel]] daughter of Finarfin, or [[Celebrimbor]], grandson of Fëanor, refused the pardon of the Valar and remained in Middle-earth. Gil-galad, last heir of the kings of the Noldor in exile, and acknowledged as "High King of the Elves of the West",<ref name=SA>{{App|B}}</ref> founded a new kingdom at Lindon, and ruled throughout the Second Age, longer than any of his predecessors.

[[Gil-galad]]'s people were mainly Noldor<ref>{{PM|XNotes}}, Note 65</ref> (especially from [[Gondolin]], but also from the [[House of Finarfin|Houses of Finarfin]] and [[House of Fëanor|Fëanor]]); early in the [[Second Age]], most of the Noldor that remained in [[Middle-earth]] lived in Lindon.<ref name=SA/> During this time, the few [[Exiles]] that remained also lived in Lindon.<ref>{{PM|Languages}}</ref>

In {{SA|750}}, some Noldor learned that [[mithril]] was found in [[Moria]] under the [[Misty Mountains]], so they went to [[Eregion]]. Because of their legacy as craftsmen, they were less unfriendly to the [[Dwarves]] than the Sindar. They became the [[Gwaith-i-Mírdain]] under [[Celebrimbor]] and formed the closest friendship ever between Elves and Dwarves.<ref name=SA/> Although war soon befell Eriador along with Celebrimbor's death, remnants of Eregion, including many Noldor, either followed Elrond to establish Imladris or fled to [[Lothlórien]].

Gil-galad perished in the War of the Alliance at the end of the Second Age, and so ended the High Kingship of the Noldor. He fathered no children; however, the line of the High-elven kings, including the High Kingship of the Noldor, was alone preserved in the descendants of [[Elros]] and [[Elrond]].<ref>{{App|A1i}}</ref>

===Later history===
After the fall of [[Gil-galad]] (during the time of the [[Kings of Arnor]]), there was still a remnant of the Noldor who dwelt at the [[Grey Havens]] of further inland in Lindon who constituted the largest population of Noldor remaining in [[Middle-earth]].<ref name=eriador>{{App|Eriador}}</ref> However, in Eriador, the chief dwelling of the Noldor was Imladris.<ref name=rings>{{S|Rings}}</ref>

In the late [[Third Age]], the Noldor in Middle-earth were greatly diminished, as most had passed over the Sea.<ref>{{L|347}}</ref><ref>{{FR|I2}}</ref> If any remained in the early [[Fourth Age]], they were few.<ref name=eriador/>

After the [[Dominion of Men]] was taken up by [[Aragorn II Elessar]], the last of the Noldor set sail from [[Mithlond]] and left Middle-earth forever.<ref name=rings/>

==Rulers==
{{main|King of the Noldor}}

;In Valinor:
The first two kings were not distinguished as being ''in Valinor'', since the entire population of the Noldor lived in Valinor at that time.

# [[Finwë]], first King of the Noldor.
# [[Fëanor]], first son of Finwë; claimed the title after his father's death.
::[[Finarfin]], third son of Finwë, remained in [[Aman]] after the [[Exile of the Noldor]] and ruled the remnant of his people in [[Tirion]], although he never officialy claimed this title.

;In Middle-earth:
::[[Fëanor]] nominally ruled in [[Middle-earth]] for a few months before his fall in the [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]], although he never established a realm.
# [[Fingolfin]], second son of Finwë; held to be the first '''[[High King of the Noldor]]''' by the majority of the Noldor after Maedhros son of Fëanor gave up his claims.
# [[Fingon]], first son of Fingolfin.
# [[Turgon]], second son of Fingolfin.
# [[Gil-galad]], great-grandson of Finarfin.

==Characteristics==
The Noldor were the Second Clan of the Elves in both order and size, the other clans being the [[Vanyar]], a smaller group, and the [[Teleri]], a much larger one. The Noldor typically had grey eyes and dark hair, save for the members of the golden-haired [[House of Finarfin]].<ref>{{App|F2}}</ref><ref>{{PE|17}}, entry Q ''noldo'', p. 125</ref>

From their beginning the Noldor (meaning "Those who Know") were always distinguished, by their knowledge of the things that are and were in this world, and by their desire to learn more.<ref>{{BL|Introduction}}</ref> They were the most skillful of these Clans, and were specially loved by [[Aulë]], from whom they learned many things, although less than they wanted to know. Their skills included the developing of their language, the building of great towers and halls, and gem extraction.<ref name>{{MR|P3I5}}, p. 176 (see also the commentary on §40, p. 181)</ref> One of their most famous artefacts were the crystallic [[Fëanorian lamps]]; the craft to make them was lost to Middle-earth when they left.

The Noldor were the proudest of the Elves; in the words of the [[Sindar]], they came to Middle-earth because "they needed room to quarrel in". It was this pride that Melkor used to turn the Houses of [[House of Fëanor|Fëanor]] and [[House of Fingolfin|Fingolfin]] against each other. The pride of the Noldor also led to their [[Fall of the Noldor|Fall]] and [[Exile of the Noldor|Exile]] (and their continued quarrels in Middle-earth, as noted by the Sindar).

Of the three clans of the [[Eldar]] they are also the people who most favours swords and shields as their weapons.<ref>{{LR|Quenta}}, p. 215 footnote to §29</ref><ref>{{LR|Quenta}}, p. 228 footnote to §49</ref>

==Etymology==
The singular form of the [[Quenya]] noun is '''''[[Noldo]]''''' and the adjective is '''''Noldorin'''''.

''noldo'' is derived from the [[Elvish]] [[Sundocarme|root]] [[NGOL]].<ref name=WJC>{{WJ|C}}, p. 383</ref>

==Other names==
The Noldor were called '''''[[Golodhrim]]''''' (pron. {{IPA|[ɡoˈloðrim]}}) or '''''Gódhellim''''' ({{IPA|[ɡoˈðelːim]}}) by [[Sindarin]]-speakers and '''''Goldoi''''' by [[Falmari]] of [[Tol Eressëa]];<ref>{{S|Appendix}}, ''golodh''</ref> they are also known as ''Deep Elves'' ("deep" as in "wise, learned"). Additionally, the Sindarin singular '''''[[Golodh]]''''' ({{IPA|[ˈɡoloð]}}) could be pluralized '''[[Golodhrim]]''', '''''[[Gelydh]]''''' ({{IPA|[ˈɡelyð]}}, later {{IPA|[ˈɡelið]}}) or more archaicly '''''[[Gœlydh]]''''' ({{IPA|[ˈɡølyð]}}).{{fact}}<ref>{{S|Index}}, ''Golodhrim''</ref>

The Noldor were known as the "'''Deep-elves'''".<ref>{{H|Flies}}</ref> Other names used for the Noldor included the Wise, the Golden, the Valiant, the Sword-elves, the Elves of the Earth, the Foes of Melkor, the Skilled of Hand, the Jewel-wrights, the Companions of Men, and the Followers of Finwë.<ref>{{MR|P3I3}}, p. 164</ref> It is also told that the Noldor were often called the Lispers by other native speakers of Quenya (such as the [[Vanyar]]), since they retained the medial "th" in their speech.<ref>{{PE|19}}, p. 34</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
{{Main|Gnomes}}
In the earliest versions of Tolkien's [[Legendarium]], the Noldor were called ''''Noldoli'''' or ''''[[Gnomes]]''''. They were still called ''Gnomes'' in early editions of ''[[The Hobbit]]''. They were also the ones who spoke the language that later became [[Sindarin]] (then called ''Gnomish'' or ''Noldorin'').

The spelling ''Ñoldor'' rather than ''Noldor'' was used by Tolkien in his later writings (the character ''ñ'' signifying the velar nasal, the sound found in the English word "si'''ng'''"), but even in earlier versions the name ''Ñoldo'' came from a [[Primitive Quendian]] stem *ñgolodō, which led to ''Ñoldo'' in [[Quenya]] and ''Golodh'' in [[Sindarin]].

The family tree given above is correct in the placement of [[Orodreth]] and [[Gil-galad]]: Orodreth was [[Angrod]]'s son, and [[Gil-galad]] was Orodreth's son, thus the grandson of [[Angrod]] and great-grandson of [[Finarfin]], and brother to [[Finduilas]]. These are wrongly placed in the published ''Silmarillion''. (See Orodreth and Gil-galad articles for details). [[Argon]], the third son of [[Fingolfin]], does not appear in the published ''Silmarillion'' at all.

==See also==
* [[Quenya]]
* [[Exile of the Noldor]]
* [[Kinslaying at Alqualondë]]
* [[Fall of the Noldor]]
* [[Doom of Mandos]]

{{references}}
{{elves}}
[[Category:Elven peoples]]
[[Category:Noldor| ]]
[[Category:Quenya demonyms]]
[[de:Noldor]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/elfes/noldor]]
[[fi:Noldor]]

Caranthir

2022-09-22T10:54:43Z

Trahald: adds source

{{noldor infobox
| name=Caranthir
| image=[[File:Elena Kukanova - Caranthir.jpeg|250px]]
| caption="Caranthir" by [[Elena Kukanova]]
| pronun=
| othernames="the Dark" ''Morifinwë'' ([[Quenya|Q]], [[Father-name|fn]]), ''Carnistir'' ([[Quenya|Q]], [[Amilessë|mn]])
| titles=Lord of Targelion
| position=
| location=[[Eldamar]], [[Thargelion]] ([[Dor Caranthir]])
| affiliation=[[Oath of Fëanor]], [[Union of Maedhros]]
| language=[[Quenya]] and [[Sindarin]]
| birth=Between {{YT|1190}} and {{YT|1362|n}}
| birthlocation=[[Tirion]]
| rule={{FA|7}} - {{FA|455|n}}
| death={{FA|506}}
| deathlocation=[[Second Kinslaying]]: [[Menegroth]]
| age=
| notablefor=
| house=[[House of Fëanor]]
| parentage=[[Fëanor]] & [[Nerdanel]]
| siblings=[[Maedhros]], [[Maglor]], [[Celegorm]], [[Curufin]], [[Amrod]] and [[Amras]]
| spouse=Unnamed<ref>{{PM|XNotes}}, p. 318 (note 7)</ref>
| children=
| gender=Male
| height=Tall
| hair=Dark
| eyes=
| clothing=
| weapons=
| steed=
}}
'''Caranthir''', the fourth of the [[Sons of Fëanor]], was also the harshest and the quickest to anger. He was known as "Caranthir the Dark".

== History ==
[[File:Marya Filatova - The one who stays - 2.jpg|thumb|left|The Wife of Caranthir. Art by [[Marya Filatova]]|125px]]
As with the other [[Sons of Fëanor]], Caranthir was bound by the [[Oath of Fëanor]] to recover his [[Fëanor|father]]'s [[Silmarils]], which had been stolen by the Dark Lord [[Morgoth]]. This oath brought the [[Noldor]] to [[Middle-earth]] near the end of the [[First Age]].<ref>{{S|Flight}}</ref> [[Angrod]] of the [[House of Finarfin]] was the first messenger of the Noldor to come to King [[Thingol]] who gave his permission to the Noldor to dwell in some free lands, but not in [[Doriath]], as he considered himself Lord of Beleriand. Maedhros laughed at Thingol's claims, remarking that Thingol had merely given them lands in which he had no power. But Caranthir despised the children of [[Finarfin]], and spoke in anger against Angrod, saying that he ought not to have been the spokesperson of the Noldor. Maedhros rebuked him, but division between Noldor increased after the outburst.<ref name=Return>{{S|Return}}</ref>

The people of Caranthir went to the furthermost [[East Beleriand]], reaching [[Ered Luin]], and there they became the first of Noldor to encounter the [[Dwarves]]. Caranthir disliked the Dwarves for their unloveliness, but though there was little love between the two peoples, they allied against their common enemy: Morgoth. The alliance brought great profit, for all the trading that came to Beleriand from the Dwarves went first through Caranthir's hands, and he gained great wealth.<ref name=Return>{{S|Return}}</ref> Caranthir's realm was in [[Thargelion]], and was sometimes called ''[[Dor Caranthir]]'' ("Land of Caranthir"). His abode was on the shores of [[Helevorn|Lake Helevorn]].<ref>{{S|Beleriand}}</ref>

In {{FA|375}}, Caranthir rescued [[Haleth]] and her people, the [[Haladin]], when they were [[Battle of the Gelion-Ascar Stockade|besieged]] by [[Orcs]]. At last recognizing the valour of [[Men]], he offered the Haladin a fiefdom in his lands to the North. However, Haleth's heart was proud, and wanting her people to serve no lord she thanked him but removed to the [[Forest of Brethil]].<ref>{{S|West}}</ref>

In the [[Dagor Bragollach]], Caranthir was forced to retreat and joined the remnant of his people to the scattered folk of [[Amrod]] and [[Amras]]. They fled to the south and maintained a watch upon [[Amon Ereb]], aided by the [[Laegil]].<ref name=Fingolfin>{{S|Fingolfin}}</ref>

In {{FA|463}}, the [[Easterlings|Easterling]] [[Ulfang]] led his people over the [[Blue Mountains]], and they allied themselves with [[Maedhros]]. They swore allegiance to Caranthir, whom they followed,<ref name=Fingolfin></ref> and were given land in [[Lothlann]].<ref>{{WJ|One}}</ref>

In {{FA|472}}, the disaster of the [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]] ("Battle of Unnumbered Tears") occurred, caused by the betrayal of the people of Ulfang, and the sons of Fëanor were scattered.<ref>{{S|Fifth}}</ref>

In {{FA|505}}, he perished along with his brothers [[Celegorm]] and [[Curufin]] during the [[Second Kinslaying]], the attack by the Sons of Fëanor on [[Menegroth]] in an attempt to recover a Silmaril from King [[Dior|Dior Eluchíl]] of Doriath.<ref>{{S|22}}</ref>

== Etymology ==
{{Pronounce|Caranthir.mp3|Ardamir}}
''Caranthir'' is the [[Sindarized]] version of his name ''Carnistir'' ("Red-face"), being the compound of ''[[caran]]'' + ''thir''.<ref>{{VT|41b}}, p. 10</ref>

==Other names==
Caranthir's [[father-name]] was '''''Morifinwë''''' ("Dark [[Finwë]]"), as he was black-haired as his grandfather. The short version of the name was '''''Moryo'''''.<ref name=Feanor>{{PM|Feanor}}, p. 353</ref>

His [[Amilessë|mother-name]] was '''''Carnistir''''' ("Red-face"). Although he was not a redhead like his mother (but dark brown haired), he had her ruddy complexion.<ref name=Feanor></ref>

== Genealogy ==
<div style="overflow-x: scroll; overflow-y: hidden; border: 1px solid #AAAAAA; padding: 3px; background: #EEEEEE;">
{{familytree/start}}
{{familytree| MHT | | MIR |y| FIN |y| IND | | | | | | | | | | | | |MHT=[[Mahtan]] ''b. {{YT}}''| MIR=[[Míriel]] ''d. {{YT|1170}}''|FIN=[[Finwë]] ''d. {{YT|1495}}''|IND=[[Indis]] ''b. {{YT}}''}}
{{familytree| |!| | | | | |!| | | |)|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|.| | | |}}
{{familytree| NRD |~|y|~| FEA | | FDS | | FNG | | IRM | | FRF | | |NRD=[[Nerdanel]] ''b. {{YT}}''|FEA=[[Fëanor]] ''{{YT|1169}} - {{YT|1497|n}}''|FDS=[[Findis]] ''b. {{YT}}''|FNG=[[Fingolfin]] ''{{YT|1190}} - {{FA|456}}''|IRM=[[Írimë]] ''b. {{YT}}''|FRF=[[Finarfin]] ''b. {{YT|1230}}''}}
{{familytree| |,|-|-|^|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|v|-|-|-|.| |}}
{{familytree| MDH | | MAG | | CEL | | CAR | | CUR | | AMD | | AMR |MDH=[[Maedhros]] ''d. {{FA|587}}''|MAG=[[Maglor]] ''b. {{YT}}''|CEL=[[Celegorm]] ''d. {{FA|506}}''|CAR='''CARANTHIR''' ''d. {{FA|506}}''|CUR=[[Curufin]] ''d. {{FA|506}}''|AMD=[[Amrod]] ''d. {{FA|538}}''|AMR=[[Amras]] ''d. {{FA|538}}''}}
{{familytree| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |!| | | | | | | | | |}}
{{familytree| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | CLB | | | | | | | | |CLB=[[Celebrimbor]] ''d. {{SA|1697}}''}}
{{familytree/end}}
</div>

== Other versions of the legendarium ==
In ''[[The Book of Lost Tales Part Two]]'', within the chapter called "[[The Nauglafring]]", he was called '''''Cranthor''''', while in the early version of the ''[[Quenta Silmarillion (Lost Road)|Quenta Silmarillion]]'', found in ''[[The Lost Road and Other Writings]]'', he was named '''''Cranthir'''''.

{{references}}
[[Category:Characters in The Book of Lost Tales]]
[[Category:Characters in The Silmarillion]]
[[Category:First Age characters]]
[[Category:Noldor]]
[[Category:Rulers in Beleriand]]
[[Category:Sindarin names]]
[[Category:Sons of Fëanor]]
[[de:Caranthir]]
[[fr:encyclo:personnages:elfes:noldor:caranthir]]
[[fi:Caranthir]]

Talk:Hobbits

2022-08-11T03:47:26Z

Trahald: /* The prefix "Hob" */

==Do we know anything about [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] funerals?==

As I like to know as it seem I don't find it menthioned in most sources that I read, save for some fan fiction that I had read. Also about burial grounds too. So do you what to dicussed about this topic or not? Do you find it interesting and mysterious? Thanks. {{unsigned|70.242.13.70}}

:They buried the dead together in a pit after the [[Battle of Bywater]]. No other funeral practises are known, but other mass graves are not very likely. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:11, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

== Hobbit feet, size ==

The main article posits that the Lord of the rings movies and other representations show hobbit feet as being larger in proportion to the rest of the body than men's feet. And it says the Tolkien's writings say nothing about this. I don't recall the movies making a point about the feet being bigger, such as in any commentary from characters. Perhaps it is mere accident that we can see that the feet are bigger on hobbits; after all, they chose to do hobbit feet by adding appliances to people's feet. Were they not something like shoes? If that's the case, as opposed to just adding fur to the top of the actors' feet with glue, then naturally the movie feet would wind up being bigger in all respects! But that would be an accident of makeup, not something for anyone to take real notice of. (For myself, I don't remember watching the movies and thinking that the feet on the hobbits look particularly big, anyway.)

And if the relative size of the feet in the referenced representations is merely an accident, and not especially noticeable, unless you're looking for it, then I contend that the main article should not say anything about it. I suppose that if this is something people are commenting on, for whatever definition of "people", then the article might mention it while at the same time discounting it as I just have. something like the following: "Some people note the relative largeness of hobbit feet in the Lord of the rings movies and other visual representations, but Tolkien never mentioned the size of hobbits' feet in any writing or speech; therefore, the relative size of such representations can and should be completely ignored, as relates to Canon."

I myself am not a regular frequenter of this site, and am unlikely to check back at any particular point, or follow up this discussion. But it seems such an obvious point to me, that it was worth throwing out for discussion amongst the regulars. Have a great day, folks! {{unsigned|184.58.130.163}}

==Changing main picture==

This article needs a new main picture! How about:
*[[:File:Henning Janssen - Hobbit Marching Band.jpg|File:Henning Janssen - Hobbit Marching Band.jpg]]
'''''or'''''
*[[:File:Frithjof Spangenberg - Bilbo's Birthday.jpg|File:Frithjof Spangenberg - Bilbo's Birthday.jpg]]
? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 20:36, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

:What about [[:File:Inger Edelfeldt - A Long Expected Party.jpg|Inger Edelfeldt - A Long Expected Party.jpg]]? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 21:19, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

::It's very appropriate, indeed! +1 on Edelfeldt.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 21:34, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

== Where does it say hobbits' exact skin tone? ==

This article says hobbit skin is nut-brown to white. I was wondering where it says that.—SingingOrc

== The prefix "Hob" ==
Under "Inspiration", it currently suggests a connection with German ''hob'' meaning ''small''. Where does this come from? I can't find it in any dictionary accessible to me.
''Hobgoblin'' is among the list of examples, but Tolkien made it clear that ''Hobgoblin'' is for the ''larger'' kind, not smaller!

Per OED hob- in hobgoblin is from Hob:

"1. A familiar or rustic variation of the Christian name Robert or Robin. Hence formerly a generic name for: A rustic, a clown".

"2. = Robin Goodfellow or Puck; a hobgoblin, sprite, elf"

--[[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 03:46, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

Talk:Hobbits

2022-08-11T03:46:20Z

Trahald: Need to fact check the part about "German" _hob_

==Do we know anything about [[Hobbits|Hobbit]] funerals?==

As I like to know as it seem I don't find it menthioned in most sources that I read, save for some fan fiction that I had read. Also about burial grounds too. So do you what to dicussed about this topic or not? Do you find it interesting and mysterious? Thanks. {{unsigned|70.242.13.70}}

:They buried the dead together in a pit after the [[Battle of Bywater]]. No other funeral practises are known, but other mass graves are not very likely. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 07:11, 27 August 2008 (UTC)

== Hobbit feet, size ==

The main article posits that the Lord of the rings movies and other representations show hobbit feet as being larger in proportion to the rest of the body than men's feet. And it says the Tolkien's writings say nothing about this. I don't recall the movies making a point about the feet being bigger, such as in any commentary from characters. Perhaps it is mere accident that we can see that the feet are bigger on hobbits; after all, they chose to do hobbit feet by adding appliances to people's feet. Were they not something like shoes? If that's the case, as opposed to just adding fur to the top of the actors' feet with glue, then naturally the movie feet would wind up being bigger in all respects! But that would be an accident of makeup, not something for anyone to take real notice of. (For myself, I don't remember watching the movies and thinking that the feet on the hobbits look particularly big, anyway.)

And if the relative size of the feet in the referenced representations is merely an accident, and not especially noticeable, unless you're looking for it, then I contend that the main article should not say anything about it. I suppose that if this is something people are commenting on, for whatever definition of "people", then the article might mention it while at the same time discounting it as I just have. something like the following: "Some people note the relative largeness of hobbit feet in the Lord of the rings movies and other visual representations, but Tolkien never mentioned the size of hobbits' feet in any writing or speech; therefore, the relative size of such representations can and should be completely ignored, as relates to Canon."

I myself am not a regular frequenter of this site, and am unlikely to check back at any particular point, or follow up this discussion. But it seems such an obvious point to me, that it was worth throwing out for discussion amongst the regulars. Have a great day, folks! {{unsigned|184.58.130.163}}

==Changing main picture==

This article needs a new main picture! How about:
*[[:File:Henning Janssen - Hobbit Marching Band.jpg|File:Henning Janssen - Hobbit Marching Band.jpg]]
'''''or'''''
*[[:File:Frithjof Spangenberg - Bilbo's Birthday.jpg|File:Frithjof Spangenberg - Bilbo's Birthday.jpg]]
? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 20:36, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

:What about [[:File:Inger Edelfeldt - A Long Expected Party.jpg|Inger Edelfeldt - A Long Expected Party.jpg]]? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 21:19, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

::It's very appropriate, indeed! +1 on Edelfeldt.--[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 21:34, 25 August 2013 (UTC)

== Where does it say hobbits' exact skin tone? ==

This article says hobbit skin is nut-brown to white. I was wondering where it says that.—SingingOrc

== The prefix "Hob" ==
Under "Inspiration", it currently suggests a connection with German ''hob'' meaning ''small''. Where does this come from? I can't find it in any dictionary accessible to me.
Hobgoblin is among the list of examples, but Tolkien made it clear that _Hobgoblin_ is for the ''larger'' kind.

Per OED hob- in hobgoblin is from Hob:

"1. A familiar or rustic variation of the Christian name Robert or Robin. Hence formerly a generic name for: A rustic, a clown".

"2. = Robin Goodfellow or Puck; a hobgoblin, sprite, elf"

--[[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 03:46, 11 August 2022 (UTC)

Hobbits

2022-08-11T03:29:44Z

Trahald: /* Inspiration */ fact check

{{sources}}
{{disambig-more|Hobbits|[[The Hobbit (disambiguation)]]}}
{{people infobox
| name=Hobbits
| image=[[File:Lukasz Siudzinsk - Hobbit.jpg|250px]]
| caption="[[:File:Lukasz Siudzinsk - Hobbit.jpg|Hobbit]]" by Lukasz Siudzinsk
| pronun=
| othernames=Banakil, Halflings, Holbytlan, Kuduk, Little People, Periannath
| origin=
| location=[[The Shire]], [[Buckland]], [[Bree-land]]
| affiliation=[[Host of the West (Arnor)|Host of the West]]
| rivalry=
| language=[[Hobbitish]] (a regional dialect of [[Westron]])
| members=[[Marcho]] and [[Blanco]], [[Sméagol]], [[Bandobras Took]], [[Bilbo Baggins]], [[Frodo Baggins]]
| lifespan=c. 96<ref name="LOTRProjectStats">{{webcite|author=Emil Johansson|articleurl=http://lotrproject.com/statistics/#lifeexpectancy|articlename=Lord of the Rings in Statistics|website=[http://lotrproject.com/ Lord of the Rings Project]|accessed=09-September-2012}}</ref>
| distinctions=[[Gift of Men|Mortality]], diminutive stature, furry feet
| height=2-4 ft or 0.6-1.2 m (often less than three feet in later days)
| hair=Typically curly brown, rarely blond (until the [[Fourth Age]]), and white and grey in later years
| skin=Nut-brown to White
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
{{quote|In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit.|''[[The Hobbit]]'', "[[An Unexpected Party]]"}}
'''Hobbits''' were a small race that typically dwelt underground, believed to be related to [[Men]]. They played little role in history, save during the [[War of the Ring]].

==Description and culture==
{{quote|There is more in you of good than you know, child of the kindly [[Eriador|West]]. Some courage and some wisdom, blended in measure. If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world.|[[Thorin Oakenshield]] in ''[[The Hobbit]]'', "[[The Return Journey]]"}}

Hobbits were between two and four feet tall,<ref name=Concerning>{{FR|Hobbits}}</ref> with differences between male and female: about 3 feet 6 inches for males<ref>{{NM|P2vi}}, "Heights", p. 195</ref> and seldom exceeded 3 feet for female.<ref name=atani>{{PM|Atani}}</ref> They had short legs, slightly pointed ears<ref>{{L|27}}</ref> and furry feet with leathery soles, resulting in most never wearing shoes. Compared to the [[Dwarves]] they are a bit shorter and less stout or stocky. Early in their recorded history, Hobbits were divided in three kinds with different customs and temperament. The '''[[Stoors]]''' grew facial hair and had an affinity for water, boats and swimming and wore boots; the '''[[Fallohides]]''' were fair, tall and slim, an adventurous people, friendlier and more open to outsiders. Finally, the '''[[Harfoots]]''' were the most numerous and instituted the living in burrows. In later days the Harfoot traits became the "norm".

Hobbits had a life span somewhat longer than Men of non-[[Númenórean]] descent, averaging between 90 and 100 years. The time at which a young hobbit "came of age" was 33.<ref name=FRI1>{{FR|I1}}</ref> The two oldest-living recorded hobbits (except [[Gollum]]) were The [[Gerontius Took|Old Took]] (who reached the age of 130) and [[Bilbo Baggins]] (who surpassed him at 131).

By nature they were of gentle disposition, neither cruel nor vindictive.<ref>{{PM|XNotes}}, #55</ref> Slow to quarrel, they never had been warlike, and never fought among themselves, nor hunted for sport; by the late Third Age the Shire-hobbits knew of weapons only as trophies or useless trinkets. However they were skilled with all kind of tools, as well as arms when there was a need; they were keen-eyed and used the bow well, and also the stones, successfully throwed against trespassing beasts.

Throughout their history Hobbits had showed unparalleled skill, courage and also endurance and resistance in times of danger and terror. During their [[Wandering Days]] Hobbits demonstrated an easiness to adapt to the environments they visited and adopted the customs and languages of the peoples they were in contact with. In the Shire, they had settled with a closed and comfort-loving lifestyle; they were fond of an unadventurous bucolic life of farming, eating, smoking [[pipe-weed]], socializing and talking about genealogies. Hobbits also liked to drink ale in inns, and ate at least six meals a day when they could get them. Every [[Highday]] and after noon, Hobbits celebrated a small holiday with evening feasts. <ref name=cal>{{App|Calendars}}</ref>

However, their hidden potentials resurfaced in difficult times; in the [[Long Winter]], [[Gandalf]] admired their uncomplaining courage and pity for one another, thanks to which they survived.<ref>{{UT|Erebor}}</ref> Another example of Hobbitish hardiness and resistant nature, was [[Gollum]], who despite using [[the One Ring]] for years, did not transform into a [[Wraiths|Wraith]] under the Ring's evil power (unlike the [[Nazgûl|nine Mannish Kings]]).<ref>
{{webcite|author=Stan Brown|website=FAQ of the Rings|articleurl=http://oakroadsystems.com/genl/ringfaq.htm#Q1-GollumWraith |articlename=Why hadn’t Gollum turned into a wraith long ago?}}</ref> These surprising Hobbit traits also were tested and proven during the [[Quest of Erebor]] and, most notably, the [[War of the Ring]].

===Clans and families===
Hobbits were universally monogamous and "[[Wikipedia:Patrilineality|patrilinear]]" (family names descended in the male-line) and normally the titular family head was the eldest male, but his wife had an equal, but separate status. In the large powerful families (such as the [[Took Family|Tooks]]) the head of what we would call a clan was the eldest male of the most direct line of descent. If the master died first his titular headship of the clan was taken by his wife and, only after her death, by their son.

Chieftains and leaders of their clans and tribes were typically of Fallohide kind, as they were by nature more adventurous.

The custom in the "younger" families was that when the head had no male heir, the headship passed to the daughter's eldest son. In such cases the heir took the name of his mother’s family while retaining the father’s family name in second place; this was the case with [[Otho Sackville-Baggins]], who obtained headship of the Sackvilles through his mother [[Camellia Sackville|Camellia]].<ref name=L214/>

===Gift-giving===
The Hobbits generally exchanged gifts as a form of "payment" for services but also of thanksgiving in favors and friendships. According to an ancient custom, a hobbit baby, shortly after birth and its name-announcement, was given a gift by the head of the family, as a token of accepting it into the family (on the rare cases of adoptions, parents gave gifts to their new child). Gifts then became a means of recognizing family membership, and the head of the family ritually gave something, even if only a token ([[mathom]]), to a [[ribadyan|birthday celebrant]].

On its third birthday, a hobbit child gave presents to their parents, that typically was something that was personally found, or produced (made or grown). This may have been extended to other ages and relatives resulting to the celebrant both receiving and giving a gift. Birthdays had considerable social importance, and customs were regulated by fairly strict etiquette, usually reduced to formalities.<ref name=L214>{{L|214}}</ref>

==Origin==
[[File:Lidia Postma - Hobbits comparison.jpg|thumb|left|The three kinds of Hobbits. Arty by Lidia Postma]]
Hobbits were considered Men. Nearly all scholars agree that Men were closely related to Hobbits, far more closely than Men were to either [[Elves]] or [[Dwarves]]. It was thus commonly assumed that Hobbits were among the Younger [[Children of Ilúvatar]] and were the result of the same act of creation as Men. This would imply that Hobbits had the [[Gift of Men]] to pass entirely beyond [[Arda]].

It is supposed that Hobbits branched out from Men as a race in the [[Elder Days]], but they don't appear at all in the chronicles of the [[Elves]].<ref name=Concerning>{{FR|Hobbits}}</ref> Their exact origin is unknown but in their early days they could have been primitive and "savage".<ref name=atani/> Apparently they survived in [[Middle-earth]] for millennia far from importance and the knowledge of stronger races; they come into the records not earlier than the early [[Third Age]] where they were living in the [[Vales of Anduin]] in [[Rhovanion|Wilderland]], between [[Mirkwood]] and the [[Misty Mountains]]. They have lost the genealogical details of how they are related to the rest of mankind. While they stayed there, the [[Northmen]] knew them. Their descendants, the [[Rohirrim]], had that memory of the ''[[holbytla]]n'' and they remained an object of lore until they contacted them during the War of the Ring. Many old words and names in "[[Hobbitish]]" are cognates of words in [[Rohirric]], so much so that even someone without linguistic training could make out the relation ([[Meriadoc Brandybuck]] would later write an entire book devoted to the relationship, ''[[Old Words and Names in the Shire]]'').

==History==

[[File:Robin Wood - Mathom lore.jpg|thumb|''Mathom lore'' by Robin Wood]]
While situated in the Valley of the Anduin River the Hobbits lived close by the Northmen. Some time near the beginning of the [[Third Age]], they were uneasy because of the growing numbers of [[Easterlings|alien men]] from the [[East]] who passed the [[Greenwood]] and harassed the Northmen and no doubt they also sensed the rising [[Shadow]] of [[Dol Guldur]].<ref name=atani/> They took the arduous task of crossing the [[Misty Mountains]], beginning thus their '''[[Wandering Days]]'''. Some of the Stoors, however, returned to that place, and it is from these people that [[Gollum]] would come many years later.

The Hobbits took different routes in their journey westward, and eventually they came to a land between the River [[Baranduin]] (which they renamed ''Brandywine'') and the [[Weather Hills]]. Along the way they founded many settlements (most of them disappeared and were forgotten), and the divisions between the Hobbit-kinds began to blur. Only [[Bree]] and a few surrounding villages lasted to the end of the Third Age.

In the year {{TA|1601}}, two Fallohide brothers, [[Marcho]] and [[Blanco]], decided to cross the River Brandywine and settle on the other side. Large numbers of Hobbits followed them, and most of their former territory was depopulated. The new land that they found on the west bank of the Brandywine is called [[The Shire]].

Hobbits became first famous and a renowned part of the wider history during the [[Quest of Erebor]] ([[Bilbo Baggins]] was the first ever famous Hobbit) and later during the [[War of the Ring]]. In the later [[Ages]] they have dwindled and their numbers have diminished and although they still linger in the North-west of the Old World, they are rarely seen; they avoid the [[Big Folk]] with dismay, using their art of disappearing.<ref name=Concerning/>

==Some well-known Hobbits==
[[File:Anke Eißmann - Frodo and Bilbo.jpg|thumb|''Frodo and Bilbo'' by [[Anke Eißmann]]]]
* [[Bilbo Baggins]]
* [[Frodo Baggins]]
* [[Samwise Gamgee|Samwise "Sam" Gamgee]]
* [[Meriadoc Brandybuck|Meriadoc "Merry" Brandybuck]]
* [[Peregrin Took|Peregrin "Pippin" Took]]
* [[Fredegar Bolger|Fredegar "Fatty" Bolger]]
* [[Otho Sackville-Baggins|Otho]] and [[Lotho Sackville-Baggins]]
* [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]]
* [[Gerontius Took|Old Took]]
* [[Bandobras Took|Bullroarer Took]]
* [[Sméagol]] (who became the creature [[Gollum]])
* [[Déagol]]

Though in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' it is mentioned that [[Gandalf]] "was responsible for so many quiet lads and lasses going off into the Blue for mad adventures," no female Hobbits are depicted in [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]]'s stories doing so; however Hobbit women do appear in his works, such as the formidable [[Lobelia Sackville-Baggins]] and Sam's wife [[Rose Cotton|Rose Cotton]].

== Etymology ==
:''This section explains the fictional etymology of the word in the linguistic context of Middle-earth; for the actual origin of the word see the section [[#Inspiration]] below''.
''Hobbit'' was derived from [[Old English]] ''[[holbytla]]'', "hole-dweller" which represents the [[Rohirric]] language.<ref>{{HM|RW}}, p. 144</ref> In a letter, Tolkien commented on the pronounciation of the word ''hobbit'': "I am sure many hobbits drop their ''h''s like most rural folk in England".<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Alina Dadlez (19 September 1962)]]" (letter); quoted in {{CG|RG}}, p. 1036</ref>

The relationship hobbit/holbytla parallels the original [[Westron]] ''[[Kuduk]]'' (Hobbit), derived from the actual Rohirric ''[[kûd-dûkan]]'' (holbytla, hole dweller). This name obviously derives from the times when the hobbits lived at the [[Vales of Anduin]] with the [[Northmen]].<ref name="Road">{{TT|III8}}</ref><ref name="Translation">{{App|F2}}</ref>

Hobbits were also called ''[[Halflings]]'' by the [[Dúnedain]], first when they still measured 2 [[ranga]]r tall; twice as high as a hobbit who would reach only 1 ranga. The word retained even when the later generations of Dúnedain became shorter. However, the term is slightly offensive to Hobbits, as to themselves they are not 'half' of anything, and certainly do not use the term to refer to themselves.{{fact}}

''Halfling'' represents a translation of [[Westron]] ''[[banakil]]''. In [[Quenya]] the word is ''[[perian|Perian(d-)]]'' pl. ''Periandi''<ref>{{webcite|articleurl=http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/press/856-most_expensive_Tolkien_book_in_the_world.php|articlename=Most expensive Tolkien bok in the world|website=[http://www.tolkienlibrary.com/index.php TolkienLibrary.com]}}, dedication to [[Elaine Griffiths]]</ref> and in [[Sindarin]] ''[[Perian]]'' pl. ''Periannath''.<ref>{{RK|Cormallen}}</ref>

*''See also: [[Wikipedia:Hobbit (word)]]''

==Inspiration==
{{quote|I am in fact a Hobbit (in all but size). I like gardens, trees and unmechanized farmlands; I smoke a pipe, and like good plain food [...]; I like, and even dare to wear in these dull days, ornamental waistcoats. I am fond of mushrooms (out of a field); have a very simple sense of humour [...]; I go to bed late and get up late [...]. I do not travel much.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]]|[[Letter 213]]}}

Tolkien's etymology for 'Hobbit' is interesting as well: the word was obviously constructed meaningless as a spontaneous inspiration, without prior intent, but it would have been natural for him to see in it the German prefix ''hob'' meaning ''small''{{fact}} (e.g. ''[[hobgoblin]]'', ''hobbledehoy'' and ''hobyah''). However this prefix dates back "only" to the 13th century, too late by Tolkien's standards; thence when later he began to work out the language relations further (see: [[Mannish]]) he decided that it could be a derived form of an [[Old English]] word such as ''[[holbytla]]''.

According to Tolkien, the word ''hobbit'' came first, and then he decided to write ''[[The Hobbit]]'' around it. As a university lecturer, he was in the process of correcting reports when he started scribbling on a blank piece of paper and wrote, "In a hole in the ground there lived a hobbit", and the rest of the story sprang from that.<ref>[[Humphrey Carpenter]], ''[[J.R.R. Tolkien: A Biography]]'', p.172</ref> The idea of a little hole dwelling creature was introduced to Tolkien by one of his students in a story he had written.

It was revealed recently that the word pre-dated Tolkien's usage, though with a different meaning).<ref name="annot">{{HM|AH}}</ref> Tolkien's concept of hobbits, in turn, seems to have been inspired by Edward Wyke Smith's 1927 children's book ''[[Wikipedia:The Marvellous Land of Snergs|The Marvellous Land of Snergs]]'', and by Sinclair Lewis's 1922 novel ''[[Wikipedia:Babbitt (novel)|Babbitt]]''. Tolkien wrote to [[W.H. Auden]] that ''The Marvellous Land of Snergs'' "was probably an unconscious source-book for the Hobbits"<ref name=annot/> and he told an interviewer that the word ''hobbit'' "might have been associated with Sinclair Lewis's ''Babbitt''" who enjoys the comforts of his home.

The name ''hobbit'' had previously appeared in an obscure "[[Wikipedia:Denham Tracts|list of spirits]]" by Michael Denham, which includes several repetitions. There is no evidence to suggest Tolkien used this as a source — indeed he spent many years trying to find out whether he really did coin the word. Denham's "hobbit spirits" (which are never referenced anywhere except in the long list) have no obvious relation to Tolkien's Hobbits, other than the name (which may possibly imply hob- "small"): Tolkien's Hobbits are small humans, not spirits. Nonetheless, some few people have suggested that the reference in the Denham list should invalidate the trademark.

== In popular usage ==
"Hobbit" is a trademark owned by the [[Middle-earth Enterprises]], as some of names, places and artifacts included in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' and ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' by [[J.R.R. Tolkien]]. For this reason [[Dungeons and Dragons]] and other fantasy tend to refer to Hobbits and Hobbit-like races rather as '''Halflings''' (''hin'' in the Mystara universe, ''hurthlings'' in Ancient Domains of Mystery).

''[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homo_floresiensis Homo floresiensis]'', a possible species in the genus Homo (thus, related to humans) discovered in 2004, has been informally dubbed a "hobbit" by its discoverers due to its small size.

[[Tolkien fandom|Fans]] have noted that in depictions and adaptations such as [[The Lord of the Rings (film series)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (film series)]], Hobbits are shown with unusually large feet, a conception probably influenced by the widespread art of [[the Brothers Hildebrandt]]. However, Tolkien himself never mentioned that large feet was a general feature of Hobbits.<ref>{{webcite|author=|articleurl=http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_printable;post=365823;guest=38267446|articlename=Big Feet|dated=|website=[http://newboards.theonering.net/forum/gforum/perl/gforum.cgi?guest=35804230 The One Ring Forums]|accessed=2 September 2012}}</ref>

{{references}}
[[Category:Hobbits| ]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/hobbits/hobbits]]
[[de:Hobbits]]
[[fi:Hobitit]]

Battle of the Pelennor Fields

2021-05-18T11:36:25Z

Trahald: /* Opposing Forces */

{{disambig-more|Battle of the Pelennor Fields|[[Battle of the Pelennor Fields (disambiguation)]]}}
{{cleanup}}{{sources}}
{{battle
|image=[[File:Per Sjögren - The Battle of the Pelennor Fields.jpg|300px]]
|name=Battle of the Pelennor Fields
|conflict=[[War of the Ring]]
|date=[[15 March]] {{TA|3019}}
|place=[[Minas Tirith]] and [[Pelennor Fields]], [[Gondor]]
|result=Victory of Gondor and Rohan
|side1=[[Gondor]], [[Rohan]]
|side2= [[Mordor]], [[Harad]], [[Rhûn]], [[Khand]]
|commanders1=*[[Denethor]] †
*[[Gandalf]]
*[[Imrahil]]
*[[Hirluin]] †
*[[Théoden]] †
*[[Grimbold]] †
*[[Forlong]] †
*[[Éomer]]
*[[Aragorn]]
| commanders2=*The [[Witch-king]] of [[Angmar]] †
*[[Gothmog (Lieutenant of Morgul)|Gothmog]]
| forces1= ~3,000 defenders of Minas Tirith 6,000 Rohirrim reinforcements Unknown Gondor reinforcements
| forces2=Unknown total strength, but vast numerical superiority to Gondor's forces
*18,000 Haradrim
| casual1=Severe, including [[Théoden|King Théoden]] of [[Rohan]]
| casual2=Near-total, including a chieftain of the [[Haradrim]] and the [[Witch-king]] of [[Angmar]]
}}
{{wotr}}
The '''Battle of the Pelennor Fields''' was the greatest battle of the [[War of the Ring]], and indeed the largest of the entire [[Third Age]].

==History==
===Prelude===
{{seealso|Siege of Gondor}}
After the fall of [[Osgiliath]] there was no longer a barrier against the forces of [[Mordor]], which moved onto the [[Pelennor Fields]] on [[15 March]] {{TA|3019}} as the [[The Darkness|Great Darkness]] blotted out the sun. Almost all of Minas Tirith's civilian population was evacuated prior to the siege, and were sent southward to Gondor's southern fiefdoms.<ref>{{RK|V1}}</ref>

===Opposing Forces===

Mordor's troops consisted of some 18,000 [[Haradrim]],<ref name="Rohirrim">{{RK|V5}}</ref> several Haradrim war [[Oliphaunts]], unknown number of [[Easterlings]], and tens of thousands of [[Orcs]]{{fact}}. This army was the largest that had been fielded in over 3,000 years, so massive that "an army [of such size] had never issued from that vale since the days of Isildur’s might; no host so fell and strong in arms had yet assailed the fords of Anduin; and yet it was but one and not the greatest of the hosts that Mordor now sent forth."<ref>{{TT|IV8}}</ref>

The defenders' numbers were considerably less. The city was initially garrisoned by the [[Guards of the Citadel]], who numbered three companies (possibly more),<REf>{{RK|V1}}</ref> totaling probably several hundred men. Less than 3,000 men from southern [[Gondor]] answered their call for aid before the siege commenced, including 200 "well-armed" men from Forlong, 700 men-at-arms plus "a company of knights" from Imrahil, 300 foot from Ringlo Vale, 500 bowmen from Duinhir, 300 men from Pinnath Gelin, "a few grim hillmen without a captain" from Lamedon, "a line" of "hunters and herdsmen and men of little villages, scantily equipped" from Anfalas, and 100 "fisher-folk" from Ethin.<ref>{{RK|V1}}</ref> The Rohirrim relief force numbered 6,000.<ref name="Rohirrim"/>

===Battle===
Mordor's hosts set fire to the plains and farms outside of the city and hewed apart anyone they found, living or dead. The Orcs began digging trenches and setting up siege equipment and catapults. These were out of range of the city's defenses, as was the city out of theirs. Some of the defenders laughed and mocked this effort, one even claiming that Sauron himself could not break through Minas Tirith's walls.<ref name="Siege">{{RK|V4}}</ref>

Their laughter turned to peril and fear, however, when Mordor's massive catapults flung their shot extremely high, well over the city's walls and into the first level. Through Sauron's arts many projectiles detonated and burst into flame. Along with these the Orcs also launched the heads of Gondor's fallen soldiers and other men they had slain over the walls, causing despair among the defenders.<ref name="Siege" /> However, these machines still could not inflict serious harm to the immense first wall, so the great battering ram [[Grond (battering ram)|Grond]] (named after [[Morgoth]]'s [[Grond (Hammer of the Underworld)|weapon]] from the First Age) was put into action.

At midnight Grond rolled to the face of the city. The [[Witch-king]] cried out evil spells unto it, and it broke the mighty main gate in only three swings. The Witch-king rode into the city unchallenged, save by [[Gandalf]]. Before Gandalf's strength was put to the test, however, the cock crowed and the horns of [[Rohan]] were heard as around 6,000 of their riders joined the battle. Mordor's strategy for keeping Rohan out of the battle had failed twice, both through the defeat at Helm's Deep and the blockade in Anórien. Thus, the Witch-king was forced to ride out and attack them instead of fighting Gandalf and destroying the city.

King [[Théoden]]'s charge drove the Mordor forces from the northern half of the field, charging the Haradrim cavalry. He threw down a chieftain of the Haradrim and cut down his standardbearer who bore a Standard with a [[Black Serpent]].<ref>{{RK|V6}}</ref> Mordor's forces counter-attacked, however, and the Witch-king, having ridden out to fight Rohan's charge, set upon them and racked them with fear.
[[File:Laurent Alquier - Éowyn's Stand in the Pelennor Fields.jpg|thumb|left|''Éowyn's Stand in the Pelennor Fields'' by [[:Category:Images by Laurent Alquier|Laurent Alquier]]]]
When the Witch-king's fell flying beast attacked King Théoden of Rohan, the king's horse [[Snowmane]] lost control, and was hit by a black dart. Snowmane fell with the king atop him, and the horse landed on him, mortally wounding him. All around the King were his slain men, and any survivors fled from the Witch-king's terrifying visage. The fell beast raked its claws upon Snowmane's neck and readied to devour Théoden, but the warrior [[Dernhelm]], defending the king's body, stood tearful yet defiant, forbidding the Witch-king to defile the king's corpse. The Witch-king mocked him, telling him that no living man might hinder him. Éowyn threw off her disguise as Dernhelm and revealed herself as "no man at all". The Black Captain remained silent, as if he hesitated slightly due to [[Glorfindel]]'s prophecy, but heeded it no longer, ignoring the [[hobbits|Hobbit]] [[Meriadoc Brandybuck|Merry]] nearby and attacking Éowyn with great malice. She slew his fell beast, but the Witch-king rose from it, towering over her. With a violent cry, he threw his black mace upon her shield, splintering it and shattering her arm. She fell to her knees in bitter pain and he loomed over her, raising his mace to kill her. However, before he could do so, the Witch-king too fell; Merry had wounded him with a sword that had been forged centuries before during the war between [[Arnor]] and [[Angmar]] and which contained spells against the Witch-king. The spells finally found their target, for the Witch-king was distracted and possibly seriously weakened. Éowyn, with her last strength, drove her sword into the Witch-king's crown, her sword shattering and the Black Captain of Mordor slain, his spirit fading into a shrill voice on the wind. The [[Black Breath]] caused both Merry and Éowyn to become gravely ill, and Éowyn's ruined arm kept her from fighting any further that day. They were sent to the [[Houses of Healing]] in the city, and command of the Rohirrim then passed to Théoden's nephew and heir, Third Marshal Éomer. Though a the Witch-king's death was a demoralizing blow to Mordor's forces on the field, they held together, and Gothmog, Lieutenant of Minas Morgul, assumed command.

At the same time, [[Faramir]], son of [[Denethor]], Steward of Gondor, was also gravely wounded. Despairing at the visions of defeat that [[Sauron]] had sent him via his ''[[palantíri|palantír]]'', and believing Faramir to be beyond aid, Denethor prepared to burn himself and his son upon a funeral pyre.<ref>{{RK|V7}}</ref> Only the intervention of [[Peregrin Took]] and Gandalf saved Faramir, although Denethor immolated himself before they could prevent him.

Meanwhile, the battle turned against the Rohirrim. The Southrons charged with their Mûmakil and wherever they went horses went wild with fear or were trampled underfoot, and the forces of Mordor rallied around them like islands of defence that the Rohirrim cavalry could not overtake. Éomer, grim after the death of Théoden but shocked by the unexpected (seeming) death of his sister Éowyn, the last living member of his family, flew into a [[berserker]] rage and charged his cavalry headlong into the larger enemy forces. So great was the wrath of the outnumbered Rohirrim at the death of their King that they broke through the superior Mordor forces, hammering deep wedges into the Mordor legions' front lines. His fury betrayed him, however; the horses panicked at the sight of the towering Mûmakil, and the Haradrim retreated amongst them. Gothmog retaliated against Éomer's advance, sending fierce Variags, elite Haradrim warriors, and monstrous Troll-men against the Rohirrim, and they were set into despair. The cavalry of Rohan were cut off from the rest of their allies. Éomer and his forces retreated to the docks near the Harlond south of the city where he desperately circled up his men on a hill and prepared to fight to the death. When he saw enemy reinforcements sailing up the River [[Anduin]], he sang a solemn and sorrowful dirge, though laughed as he did, preparing to die defiantly as Rohan's final leader.
[[File:Anke Eißmann - The Black Serpent founders.jpg|right|thumb|''The Black Serpent founders'' by [[Anke Eißmann]]]]
One of the visions that Denethor had seen was of a fleet of enemy ships with black sails arriving at the landings to the south of the Pelennor in the Rammas, but what he had not seen was that they were actually manned by [[Aragorn]] and other [[Rangers of the North]], [[Gimli]], [[Legolas]], [[Elladan]], [[Elrohir]] and many reinforcements from southern fiefdoms of Gondor.<ref name="Debate">{{RK|V9}}</ref> As Aragorn's army drove north, a great part of Mordor's forces were pinned between Aragorn and Éomer's cavalry, and were "caught between the hammer and the anvil". Without the Witch-king's leadership, and with vast numbers encroaching them on all sides, many of Mordor's troops panicked and began to flee. Aragorn's army then linked with Éomer's, and with their aid the tide of battle was finally turned. Despite the Orcs engaging in a cowardly and disorganized retreat, many Easterlings and Haradrim held their ground and fought proudly to the death, delaying the Western host and allowing others to rout. The vicinity of the Rammas Echor was soon empty of Sauron's forces, and a brief respite was won until the [[Battle of the Morannon|final battle]] before the [[Morannon|Black Gate]].

=== Aftermath ===
There is no clearly stated final death toll for the Battle of Pelennor Fields. There is a definite figure for the army of the Rohirrim that came to Gondor's defence; it consisted of 6,000 riders,<ref name="Rohirrim"/> and a full 2,000 were killed in the battle,<ref name="Debate"/> including Théoden. Of the 6 to 7 thousand Gondorian defenders of Minas Tirith, and the large relief force of Gondor's southern provinces led by Aragorn, no definite figure remains. Two days after the battle, Aragorn led an army out to attack the Black Gate that consisted of 7,000 men (reduced to less than 6,000 by the time it reaches the Black Gate): 2,000 Rohirrim and 5,000 Gondorians. The size of Aragorn's relief force may have been over 5,000 or as little as 1,000: it is never stated. Éomer stated that many Rohirrim horses were killed or wounded and that, he could not "hope to lead even two thousands" and that it would be over half of his mounted force in the Last Debate. He sent three thousand riders with Elfhelm to attack the northern army in Anorien before the main army marched to the black gate. Forlong, Grimbold, Théoden, and Hirluin were slain in combat, and the near-defeat of Gondor led Steward Denethor to commit suicide during the siege. Minas Tirith itself suffered heavily in the siege, and its strongest gate was broken.

A grey rain fell over the city and the plains following the battle's end, putting out many fires much to the relief of its inhabitants, though most of the lower level was still a smouldering ruin. Despite their losses, the arrival of reinforcements from the southern fiefs allowed Gondor to maintain a larger garrison in the city after the Siege than it had at the outset. In all, though no exact number was given as to Gondor's casualties, it is said that "No few had fallen, renowned or nameless, captain or soldier; for it was a great battle and the full count of it no tale has told." The sight of so many slain brought the weary Merry to tears.

Although a victory, at the subsequent Last Debate, Gandalf counselled that militarily, Sauron would still defeat them. The Free Peoples had managed to destroy an army outnumbering them as much as 5 to 1, but lost nearly half of their own forces, including some of their greatest lords. Sauron had suffered a defeat, but he still had other legions and the force that attacked Minas Tirith, while substantial, was but a fraction of his total strength. Rohan and Gondor had been able to secure their flanks, eliminating the threat of Isengard and the Corsairs on the southern coasts, but Gandalf counselled that even with all of their forces concentrated in the main front near Minas Tirith, it would simply result in a war of attrition; either defensively or offensively, Sauron's might would prevail. Thus, it was agreed that it was impossible to achieve a conventional military victory through strength of arms, and instead to risk all on a last throw of the dice by Aragorn leading a diversionary attack on the Black Gate to aid Frodo's passage in Mordor.<ref name="Debate"/>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
The Battle was to happen in [[14 March]], but Tolkien decided that Aragorn would need more time to arrive. After briefly considering to put the [[Breaking of the Fellowship]] sooner, and giving also more time to [[Frodo]]/[[Sam]] and the "[[Hornburg]] ride", he decided to move the battle a day later.<ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. xlv</ref>

==Portrayal in adaptations==
'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]'':'''
:The battle is the major centrepiece of the last film, although some of the events described above are simplified or altered for cinematic purposes. The Gondorian forces from the kingdom's fiefs are absent, replaced only by the [[Rohirrim]]. These are joined by Aragorn leading the "[[Oathbreakers|Army of the Dead]]" (instead of the Gondorian reinforcements) at the very end of the battle. Importance is given to the charge of the [[Oliphaunts|Mûmakil]], the death of [[Théoden]], and the [[Witch-king]]'s demise at the hands of [[Éowyn]].

:The battle begins with [[Sauron]]'s forces marching on the city and firing a volley of severed [[Gondorians|Gondorian]] heads over the walls (as in the book). Seeing [[Mordor]]'s overwhelming army, [[Denethor]] despairs, and [[Gandalf]] assumes command of the defenders. Both Sauron's army and the defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] exchange fire by way of catapults and trebuchets. Many Orcs and a few dozen Gondorian soldiers were killed, whilst some catapults and siege towers were destroyed. Then the [[Nazgûl|Ringwraiths]], mounted on top of their [[fell beasts]], descended from the skies, spreading fear throughout the city and destroying many catapults. Meanwhile, [[Trolls]] bring forth the siege towers and engage the Gondorian troops and Gandalf in combat throughout the night. As the battle continues in the dark, the [[Orcs]] bring forth a giant battering ram named [[Grond (battering ram)|Grond]] and, with it, the [[Great Gate of Minas Tirith]] is shattered, allowing the Orcs, Trolls, and [[Wargs]] to invade the city. In the book, the populace was almost entirely evacuated before the battle. In the movie, the women and children remained, and many were slaughtered in the lower levels.

:By morning, the Gondorian soldiers had taken heavy casualties and retreated to the higher levels of Minas Tirith. There, Gandalf helps them to hold out until Théoden and six thousand Rohirrim arrive, decimating the invading Orcs and routing the Witch-king's right flank; however, [[Sauron]]'s reserves soon arrive with several [[Oliphaunts]], commanded by the [[Haradrim]], who turn the tide against the Rohirrim. Fortunately, [[Aragorn]] arrives later with the Army of the Dead (see [[Paths of the Dead]]), and they crush the remainder of Sauron's forces before entering Minas Tirith.

==See also==
*[[:Category:Images of the Battle of the Pelennor Fields|Images of the Battle of the Pelennor Fields]]
{{references}}
[[Category:Conflicts of the War of the Ring]]
[[de:Schlacht auf dem Pelennor]]
[[fr:encyclo:evenements:3a:guerres:bataille_des_champs_du_pelennor]]
[[fi:Pelennorin kenttien taistelu]]

Battle of the Pelennor Fields

2021-05-18T11:26:31Z

Trahald: /* Opposing Forces */ "the Rohirrim at their onset were thrice outnumbered by the Haradrim alone"

{{disambig-more|Battle of the Pelennor Fields|[[Battle of the Pelennor Fields (disambiguation)]]}}
{{cleanup}}{{sources}}
{{battle
|image=[[File:Per Sjögren - The Battle of the Pelennor Fields.jpg|300px]]
|name=Battle of the Pelennor Fields
|conflict=[[War of the Ring]]
|date=[[15 March]] {{TA|3019}}
|place=[[Minas Tirith]] and [[Pelennor Fields]], [[Gondor]]
|result=Victory of Gondor and Rohan
|side1=[[Gondor]], [[Rohan]]
|side2= [[Mordor]], [[Harad]], [[Rhûn]], [[Khand]]
|commanders1=*[[Denethor]] †
*[[Gandalf]]
*[[Imrahil]]
*[[Hirluin]] †
*[[Théoden]] †
*[[Grimbold]] †
*[[Forlong]] †
*[[Éomer]]
*[[Aragorn]]
| commanders2=*The [[Witch-king]] of [[Angmar]] †
*[[Gothmog (Lieutenant of Morgul)|Gothmog]]
| forces1= ~3,000 defenders of Minas Tirith 6,000 Rohirrim reinforcements Unknown Gondor reinforcements
| forces2=Unknown total strength, but vast numerical superiority to Gondor's forces
*18,000 Haradrim
| casual1=Severe, including [[Théoden|King Théoden]] of [[Rohan]]
| casual2=Near-total, including a chieftain of the [[Haradrim]] and the [[Witch-king]] of [[Angmar]]
}}
{{wotr}}
The '''Battle of the Pelennor Fields''' was the greatest battle of the [[War of the Ring]], and indeed the largest of the entire [[Third Age]].

==History==
===Prelude===
{{seealso|Siege of Gondor}}
After the fall of [[Osgiliath]] there was no longer a barrier against the forces of [[Mordor]], which moved onto the [[Pelennor Fields]] on [[15 March]] {{TA|3019}} as the [[The Darkness|Great Darkness]] blotted out the sun. Almost all of Minas Tirith's civilian population was evacuated prior to the siege, and were sent southward to Gondor's southern fiefdoms.<ref>{{RK|V1}}</ref>

===Opposing Forces===

Mordor's troops consisted of some 18,000 [[Haradrim]],<ref name="Rohirrim">{{RK|V5}}</ref> several Haradrim war [[Oliphaunts]], unknown number of [[Easterlings]], and tens of thousands of [[Orcs]]. This army was the largest that had been fielded in over 3,000 years, so massive that "an army [of such size] had never issued from that vale since the days of Isildur’s might; no host so fell and strong in arms had yet assailed the fords of Anduin; and yet it was but one and not the greatest of the hosts that Mordor now sent forth."<ref>{{TT|IV8}}</ref>

The defenders' numbers were considerably less. The city was initially garrisoned by the [[Guards of the Citadel]], who numbered three companies (possibly more),<REf>{{RK|V1}}</ref> totaling probably several hundred men. Less than 3,000 men from southern [[Gondor]] answered their call for aid before the siege commenced, including 200 "well-armed" men from Forlong, 700 men-at-arms plus "a company of knights" from Imrahil, 300 foot from Ringlo Vale, 500 bowmen from Duinhir, 300 men from Pinnath Gelin, "a few grim hillmen without a captain" from Lamedon, "a line" of "hunters and herdsmen and men of little villages, scantily equipped" from Anfalas, and 100 "fisher-folk" from Ethin.<ref>{{RK|V1}}</ref> The Rohirrim relief force numbered 6,000.<ref name="Rohirrim"/>

===Battle===
Mordor's hosts set fire to the plains and farms outside of the city and hewed apart anyone they found, living or dead. The Orcs began digging trenches and setting up siege equipment and catapults. These were out of range of the city's defenses, as was the city out of theirs. Some of the defenders laughed and mocked this effort, one even claiming that Sauron himself could not break through Minas Tirith's walls.<ref name="Siege">{{RK|V4}}</ref>

Their laughter turned to peril and fear, however, when Mordor's massive catapults flung their shot extremely high, well over the city's walls and into the first level. Through Sauron's arts many projectiles detonated and burst into flame. Along with these the Orcs also launched the heads of Gondor's fallen soldiers and other men they had slain over the walls, causing despair among the defenders.<ref name="Siege" /> However, these machines still could not inflict serious harm to the immense first wall, so the great battering ram [[Grond (battering ram)|Grond]] (named after [[Morgoth]]'s [[Grond (Hammer of the Underworld)|weapon]] from the First Age) was put into action.

At midnight Grond rolled to the face of the city. The [[Witch-king]] cried out evil spells unto it, and it broke the mighty main gate in only three swings. The Witch-king rode into the city unchallenged, save by [[Gandalf]]. Before Gandalf's strength was put to the test, however, the cock crowed and the horns of [[Rohan]] were heard as around 6,000 of their riders joined the battle. Mordor's strategy for keeping Rohan out of the battle had failed twice, both through the defeat at Helm's Deep and the blockade in Anórien. Thus, the Witch-king was forced to ride out and attack them instead of fighting Gandalf and destroying the city.

King [[Théoden]]'s charge drove the Mordor forces from the northern half of the field, charging the Haradrim cavalry. He threw down a chieftain of the Haradrim and cut down his standardbearer who bore a Standard with a [[Black Serpent]].<ref>{{RK|V6}}</ref> Mordor's forces counter-attacked, however, and the Witch-king, having ridden out to fight Rohan's charge, set upon them and racked them with fear.
[[File:Laurent Alquier - Éowyn's Stand in the Pelennor Fields.jpg|thumb|left|''Éowyn's Stand in the Pelennor Fields'' by [[:Category:Images by Laurent Alquier|Laurent Alquier]]]]
When the Witch-king's fell flying beast attacked King Théoden of Rohan, the king's horse [[Snowmane]] lost control, and was hit by a black dart. Snowmane fell with the king atop him, and the horse landed on him, mortally wounding him. All around the King were his slain men, and any survivors fled from the Witch-king's terrifying visage. The fell beast raked its claws upon Snowmane's neck and readied to devour Théoden, but the warrior [[Dernhelm]], defending the king's body, stood tearful yet defiant, forbidding the Witch-king to defile the king's corpse. The Witch-king mocked him, telling him that no living man might hinder him. Éowyn threw off her disguise as Dernhelm and revealed herself as "no man at all". The Black Captain remained silent, as if he hesitated slightly due to [[Glorfindel]]'s prophecy, but heeded it no longer, ignoring the [[hobbits|Hobbit]] [[Meriadoc Brandybuck|Merry]] nearby and attacking Éowyn with great malice. She slew his fell beast, but the Witch-king rose from it, towering over her. With a violent cry, he threw his black mace upon her shield, splintering it and shattering her arm. She fell to her knees in bitter pain and he loomed over her, raising his mace to kill her. However, before he could do so, the Witch-king too fell; Merry had wounded him with a sword that had been forged centuries before during the war between [[Arnor]] and [[Angmar]] and which contained spells against the Witch-king. The spells finally found their target, for the Witch-king was distracted and possibly seriously weakened. Éowyn, with her last strength, drove her sword into the Witch-king's crown, her sword shattering and the Black Captain of Mordor slain, his spirit fading into a shrill voice on the wind. The [[Black Breath]] caused both Merry and Éowyn to become gravely ill, and Éowyn's ruined arm kept her from fighting any further that day. They were sent to the [[Houses of Healing]] in the city, and command of the Rohirrim then passed to Théoden's nephew and heir, Third Marshal Éomer. Though a the Witch-king's death was a demoralizing blow to Mordor's forces on the field, they held together, and Gothmog, Lieutenant of Minas Morgul, assumed command.

At the same time, [[Faramir]], son of [[Denethor]], Steward of Gondor, was also gravely wounded. Despairing at the visions of defeat that [[Sauron]] had sent him via his ''[[palantíri|palantír]]'', and believing Faramir to be beyond aid, Denethor prepared to burn himself and his son upon a funeral pyre.<ref>{{RK|V7}}</ref> Only the intervention of [[Peregrin Took]] and Gandalf saved Faramir, although Denethor immolated himself before they could prevent him.

Meanwhile, the battle turned against the Rohirrim. The Southrons charged with their Mûmakil and wherever they went horses went wild with fear or were trampled underfoot, and the forces of Mordor rallied around them like islands of defence that the Rohirrim cavalry could not overtake. Éomer, grim after the death of Théoden but shocked by the unexpected (seeming) death of his sister Éowyn, the last living member of his family, flew into a [[berserker]] rage and charged his cavalry headlong into the larger enemy forces. So great was the wrath of the outnumbered Rohirrim at the death of their King that they broke through the superior Mordor forces, hammering deep wedges into the Mordor legions' front lines. His fury betrayed him, however; the horses panicked at the sight of the towering Mûmakil, and the Haradrim retreated amongst them. Gothmog retaliated against Éomer's advance, sending fierce Variags, elite Haradrim warriors, and monstrous Troll-men against the Rohirrim, and they were set into despair. The cavalry of Rohan were cut off from the rest of their allies. Éomer and his forces retreated to the docks near the Harlond south of the city where he desperately circled up his men on a hill and prepared to fight to the death. When he saw enemy reinforcements sailing up the River [[Anduin]], he sang a solemn and sorrowful dirge, though laughed as he did, preparing to die defiantly as Rohan's final leader.
[[File:Anke Eißmann - The Black Serpent founders.jpg|right|thumb|''The Black Serpent founders'' by [[Anke Eißmann]]]]
One of the visions that Denethor had seen was of a fleet of enemy ships with black sails arriving at the landings to the south of the Pelennor in the Rammas, but what he had not seen was that they were actually manned by [[Aragorn]] and other [[Rangers of the North]], [[Gimli]], [[Legolas]], [[Elladan]], [[Elrohir]] and many reinforcements from southern fiefdoms of Gondor.<ref name="Debate">{{RK|V9}}</ref> As Aragorn's army drove north, a great part of Mordor's forces were pinned between Aragorn and Éomer's cavalry, and were "caught between the hammer and the anvil". Without the Witch-king's leadership, and with vast numbers encroaching them on all sides, many of Mordor's troops panicked and began to flee. Aragorn's army then linked with Éomer's, and with their aid the tide of battle was finally turned. Despite the Orcs engaging in a cowardly and disorganized retreat, many Easterlings and Haradrim held their ground and fought proudly to the death, delaying the Western host and allowing others to rout. The vicinity of the Rammas Echor was soon empty of Sauron's forces, and a brief respite was won until the [[Battle of the Morannon|final battle]] before the [[Morannon|Black Gate]].

=== Aftermath ===
There is no clearly stated final death toll for the Battle of Pelennor Fields. There is a definite figure for the army of the Rohirrim that came to Gondor's defence; it consisted of 6,000 riders,<ref name="Rohirrim"/> and a full 2,000 were killed in the battle,<ref name="Debate"/> including Théoden. Of the 6 to 7 thousand Gondorian defenders of Minas Tirith, and the large relief force of Gondor's southern provinces led by Aragorn, no definite figure remains. Two days after the battle, Aragorn led an army out to attack the Black Gate that consisted of 7,000 men (reduced to less than 6,000 by the time it reaches the Black Gate): 2,000 Rohirrim and 5,000 Gondorians. The size of Aragorn's relief force may have been over 5,000 or as little as 1,000: it is never stated. Éomer stated that many Rohirrim horses were killed or wounded and that, he could not "hope to lead even two thousands" and that it would be over half of his mounted force in the Last Debate. He sent three thousand riders with Elfhelm to attack the northern army in Anorien before the main army marched to the black gate. Forlong, Grimbold, Théoden, and Hirluin were slain in combat, and the near-defeat of Gondor led Steward Denethor to commit suicide during the siege. Minas Tirith itself suffered heavily in the siege, and its strongest gate was broken.

A grey rain fell over the city and the plains following the battle's end, putting out many fires much to the relief of its inhabitants, though most of the lower level was still a smouldering ruin. Despite their losses, the arrival of reinforcements from the southern fiefs allowed Gondor to maintain a larger garrison in the city after the Siege than it had at the outset. In all, though no exact number was given as to Gondor's casualties, it is said that "No few had fallen, renowned or nameless, captain or soldier; for it was a great battle and the full count of it no tale has told." The sight of so many slain brought the weary Merry to tears.

Although a victory, at the subsequent Last Debate, Gandalf counselled that militarily, Sauron would still defeat them. The Free Peoples had managed to destroy an army outnumbering them as much as 5 to 1, but lost nearly half of their own forces, including some of their greatest lords. Sauron had suffered a defeat, but he still had other legions and the force that attacked Minas Tirith, while substantial, was but a fraction of his total strength. Rohan and Gondor had been able to secure their flanks, eliminating the threat of Isengard and the Corsairs on the southern coasts, but Gandalf counselled that even with all of their forces concentrated in the main front near Minas Tirith, it would simply result in a war of attrition; either defensively or offensively, Sauron's might would prevail. Thus, it was agreed that it was impossible to achieve a conventional military victory through strength of arms, and instead to risk all on a last throw of the dice by Aragorn leading a diversionary attack on the Black Gate to aid Frodo's passage in Mordor.<ref name="Debate"/>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
The Battle was to happen in [[14 March]], but Tolkien decided that Aragorn would need more time to arrive. After briefly considering to put the [[Breaking of the Fellowship]] sooner, and giving also more time to [[Frodo]]/[[Sam]] and the "[[Hornburg]] ride", he decided to move the battle a day later.<ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. xlv</ref>

==Portrayal in adaptations==
'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King]]'':'''
:The battle is the major centrepiece of the last film, although some of the events described above are simplified or altered for cinematic purposes. The Gondorian forces from the kingdom's fiefs are absent, replaced only by the [[Rohirrim]]. These are joined by Aragorn leading the "[[Oathbreakers|Army of the Dead]]" (instead of the Gondorian reinforcements) at the very end of the battle. Importance is given to the charge of the [[Oliphaunts|Mûmakil]], the death of [[Théoden]], and the [[Witch-king]]'s demise at the hands of [[Éowyn]].

:The battle begins with [[Sauron]]'s forces marching on the city and firing a volley of severed [[Gondorians|Gondorian]] heads over the walls (as in the book). Seeing [[Mordor]]'s overwhelming army, [[Denethor]] despairs, and [[Gandalf]] assumes command of the defenders. Both Sauron's army and the defenders of [[Minas Tirith]] exchange fire by way of catapults and trebuchets. Many Orcs and a few dozen Gondorian soldiers were killed, whilst some catapults and siege towers were destroyed. Then the [[Nazgûl|Ringwraiths]], mounted on top of their [[fell beasts]], descended from the skies, spreading fear throughout the city and destroying many catapults. Meanwhile, [[Trolls]] bring forth the siege towers and engage the Gondorian troops and Gandalf in combat throughout the night. As the battle continues in the dark, the [[Orcs]] bring forth a giant battering ram named [[Grond (battering ram)|Grond]] and, with it, the [[Great Gate of Minas Tirith]] is shattered, allowing the Orcs, Trolls, and [[Wargs]] to invade the city. In the book, the populace was almost entirely evacuated before the battle. In the movie, the women and children remained, and many were slaughtered in the lower levels.

:By morning, the Gondorian soldiers had taken heavy casualties and retreated to the higher levels of Minas Tirith. There, Gandalf helps them to hold out until Théoden and six thousand Rohirrim arrive, decimating the invading Orcs and routing the Witch-king's right flank; however, [[Sauron]]'s reserves soon arrive with several [[Oliphaunts]], commanded by the [[Haradrim]], who turn the tide against the Rohirrim. Fortunately, [[Aragorn]] arrives later with the Army of the Dead (see [[Paths of the Dead]]), and they crush the remainder of Sauron's forces before entering Minas Tirith.

==See also==
*[[:Category:Images of the Battle of the Pelennor Fields|Images of the Battle of the Pelennor Fields]]
{{references}}
[[Category:Conflicts of the War of the Ring]]
[[de:Schlacht auf dem Pelennor]]
[[fr:encyclo:evenements:3a:guerres:bataille_des_champs_du_pelennor]]
[[fi:Pelennorin kenttien taistelu]]

Talk:Orcs

2021-04-24T13:23:40Z

Trahald: /* Orc - Rohirric or Westron */

The following external links no longer work:

The Origin of the Orcs (htm version)
The Origin of the Orcs (doc version)
The Origin of the Orcs (pdf version)

I got: The webpage cannot be found {{unsigned|71.173.181.175}}

:I solved the problem by deleting it :). It was inappropriate anyway, and the whole article needs to be rewritten. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 10:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::Which article? [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:25, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::Oh this article. Too much work to be done by 1.5 persons (= I am doing 0.4 of your work and the rest 0.1 belongs to occasional contributors) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:27, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::::I won't be doing much either. Just got an angry email that there was a deadline last week. So I got to focus on that first -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::::That's my point... where can we find more contributors? :) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 17:55, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

I edited the "Orcs and Goblins" section heavily to remove unfounded comments about "goblins" being a Hobbitish term when it is, in fact, an English word. I also cut down on some unfounded claims in the "Controversy" section. [[User:Eldorion|Eldorion]]

There needs to be a serious section in this article about the culture and ethics of Orcs, and whether Orcs are ultimately free to choose good or evil. I've seen other wikis touch on this issue, but this article barely does. A lot of people (myself included) have never been thrilled about the whole "evil race" concept played completely straight. 
As an entirely personal belief (not something I would expect to put in the article), I think Orcs have the ability to live as good [[Avari]], and that it's the established traditions of Orc culture that inspire evil, and that Elves who do evil and ill-inspired acts (such as [[Fëanor]] and [[Sons of Fëanor|his sons]] along with [[Eöl]] and [[Maeglin]]) essentially make themselves Orcs, and that the difference of appearance between Elves and Orcs ("fair" vs. "ugly") is ultimately meaningless. The [[Silmarils]] knew the difference, and they burned evil and corruption when it touched them. I'm not sure Tolkien would completely disagree, as he once said, "We were all Orcs in the Great War." But I digress... - [[User:Gilgamesh|Gilgamesh]] 12:12, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

:I just (4/5/2011) summarized Letter 153 (a very long summary) for the Tolkien Gateway, wherein Tolkien dug very deeply into the metaphysics of Middle-earth. On the subject of Orcs, innate Free Will, their "evil race" status, and such, this letter probably gives Tolkien's "clearest" answers. -- Gamling 01:07, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

== Origin ==

I just would like to ask an question in regards to the origin of the orcs. First off I have no preferance either way, be it men or elves, but I would like to raise the point of time. Men awoke at the rising of the sun, so wouldn't this then pose a problem for Melkor when he made the orcs in the first war in Beleriand, for the sake of the elves.? Unless he can time shift and or travel. So then we are left with a rather interesting situation, any thoughts? {{unsigned|GaiusMarius}}

:Sorry, you've lost me? Do you mean that as Melkor created orcs in opposition to elves he had no "opposite" to men? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 14:09, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

: This is not an issue. In Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed (where Tolkien writes at length concerning the cosmology of Arda, and the origins of Orcs), Tolkien shifts the timeline to move the awakening of Men to be not long after that of Elves - during the Great March. This is actually done for other reasons, but serves to enable Men as a legitimate source for Orcs. Sorry for being anon, but I don't feel like signing up for an account. Find me as Túrin at lotrplaza.com if you want. {{unsignedAnon|24.176.44.61}}

: Sorry, but this is still a GREAT issue, not resolved by just simply changing the timeline. If men awoke at such an early time, it makes no sense that when the Noldor returned to Middle-Earth, Beleriand wasn't full of human kingdoms already, and that men had such a primitive culture. The episode of Finrod being the first Noldo to befriend men would make no sense, for example, neither his special bond with Beor's house (with all the consequences that would have in later tales). A major reworking of the legends would be needed just to fit this version of the origin of the orcs. {{unsignedAnon|95.22.52.196}}

::It is indeed an issue that this article makes the unequivocal statement it does. As pointed out above, Tolkien's changing ideas about the origins of orcs are discussed in Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed, and the article needs to mention these various ideas.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 22:48, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

==Etymology and Names==

JRRT notes the Nandorin word for orcs in PE17 (p. 54) '''''ūriƒ'''''. However, I'm uncertain about how to the render the last letter in the word - the original form of the letter is similar, but does not carry the small horizontal line. Is this a letter of its own, or merely a variant rendering of ƒ? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 01:24, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:There is the "[[wikipedia:Long s|long s]]" ''ſ'' (and [[wikipedia:Esh (letter)|the similar Esh]] ''ʃ''). Do these seem likely? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:41, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

::Many thanks, Mith! It's the Esh (''ʃ'') - could you please add it to the insert box? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 09:43, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:::Added both.--{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:07, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

== Orc - Rohirric or Westron ==

Quote: "This '''spelling''' was taken from Old English. The word seemed, in itself, very suitable to the creatures that I had in mind. But the Old English orc in meaning - so far as that is known - is not suitable. Also the spelling of what, in the later more organized linguistic situation, must have been a '''Common Speech''' form of a word or group of similar words should be ork."

Quote: "Orc. This is supposed to be the '''Common Speech''' name of these creatures at that time; it should therefore according to the system be translated into English, or the language of translation. It was translated 'goblin' in The Hobbit, except in one place; but this word, and other words of similar sense in other European languages (as far as I know), are not really suitable. The orc in The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, though of course partly made out of traditional features, is not really comparable in supposed origin, functions, and relation to the Elves. In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be '''retained'''."

Orc, or rather, the spelling of Orc is '''FROM''' Old English in reality, and the word itself was Westron in Middle-earth, '''NOT''' Rohirric, so I conclude.

It´s not like the other OE-for-Rohirric words in the LotR. Tolkien just '''retained''' this word from Westron, and where he did translate this 3rd age word, he translated it into Modern English.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 06:37, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

:I just found the quote for orc being (also?) Rohirric, "Orc is the form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the language of Rohan."
:I undid my previous edit, and I'm sorry for it, but still I think the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section need to be improved.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 07:25, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

::OK, good.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 13:01, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
::Note the word "races". Doesn't it imply not just in the language of Rohan? [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:22, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

Seems like I have to put more source to support my argument.

"Orc is not an English word. It occurs in one or two places but is usually translated goblin ... Orc is the hobbits' form of the name given at that time to these creatures, and it is not connected at all with our orc, ork..." --- The Hobbit

Still no one try to rewrite the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section?

This section as it appears to me at the latest revision still needs correction. Asserting Orc being Old English here alone may be missleading. The subject needs more elaboration, which has already been done in "Orc" (why is "Orc" not simply part of "Etymology" though). Anyway, I think this part should be replaced with stuff that actually supports the idea that goblin and Orc are synonyms. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 11:26, 24 April 2021 (UTC)
: My mistake, "Orc" IS a subsection of "Etymology". [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:18, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

== "Gong" redirect link ==
Since the [[Gongs]] have their own article, could it be possible to change the redirect link on [[Gong]] to lead to ''that'' page, instead? [[User:Bauglir100|Bauglir100]] 12:50, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:Done. Although whether Gongs needs a separate article needs to be established, but in the meantime we should be consistent in any case. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:08, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

== Removed something unsourced ==

I have removed the following:

"This was evidently mainly to avoid the form ''Orcish'', which would be naturally pronounced with the c as /s/ instead of /k/. (In [[Languages|Tolkien's languages]] the letter ''c'' was always pronounced /k/.) "

Proclaiming the Orcish should be pronounced with an /s/ is, I think, wrong. That may be the common pronunciation in Latin-derived English words, but Orc is supposed to be a Sindarin word and Tolkien can transliterate it however he likes. {{unsignedanon|58.174.17.138}}

== Etymology for orcs ==

The name of the species "Orc" did '''NOT''' derive from the Latin ''Orcus''. Orcus, as I have mentioned is Latin, and thus as alien to Middle-earth as would be Mandarin or Korean.

The word "Orc" derives from the Saxon ''Orcnéas'', and ''Orcdhyrs'' (both words for Ogres). {{unsignedanon|67.159.191.98}}

:You are right, according to Wikipedia article Tolkien doubted that Orc comes from Orcus. However Latin is not so alien to M-e (cf. [[Gerontius]]). [[User:Sage|Sage]] 10:01, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
::Latin and Italian names were especially common in the Took family... --Tik 19:45, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

==Orcs vs. Orks==

:Shouldn't the correct spelling be "Orks" instead of "Orcs"? At least, that's from Tolkien's latest writings<ref>{{MR|Myths}}</ref>

{{references}}

== More on etymology ==

An anonymous user removed this paragraph:
:<nowiki>However, it is also mentioned that the word ''Orc'' is Anglo-Saxon for "Foreigner, Monster, Demon" and was used to refer to the Normans invading the Anglish in 1066.<ref>"[http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1329539/ 1066 The Battle for Middle Earth]" 2009 (documentary)</ref></nowiki>
The justification was that the statement is wrong, because the AS word for "foreigner" was ''wealas''.

Now, I don't know the source of the information that orc was used in that context (the original paragraph cited a docudrama) but the word ''wealas'' does not overrule the existence of more words for "foreigner" in other colors; for instance, there are several words for "sword", "battle", "hero", "lord" etc. I agree that the statement needs a better citation. [[User:Sage|Sage]] 13:10, 18 June 2016 (UTC)

Talk:Orcs

2021-04-24T13:23:06Z

Trahald: /* Orc - Rohirric or Westron */

The following external links no longer work:

The Origin of the Orcs (htm version)
The Origin of the Orcs (doc version)
The Origin of the Orcs (pdf version)

I got: The webpage cannot be found {{unsigned|71.173.181.175}}

:I solved the problem by deleting it :). It was inappropriate anyway, and the whole article needs to be rewritten. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 10:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::Which article? [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:25, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::Oh this article. Too much work to be done by 1.5 persons (= I am doing 0.4 of your work and the rest 0.1 belongs to occasional contributors) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:27, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::::I won't be doing much either. Just got an angry email that there was a deadline last week. So I got to focus on that first -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::::That's my point... where can we find more contributors? :) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 17:55, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

I edited the "Orcs and Goblins" section heavily to remove unfounded comments about "goblins" being a Hobbitish term when it is, in fact, an English word. I also cut down on some unfounded claims in the "Controversy" section. [[User:Eldorion|Eldorion]]

There needs to be a serious section in this article about the culture and ethics of Orcs, and whether Orcs are ultimately free to choose good or evil. I've seen other wikis touch on this issue, but this article barely does. A lot of people (myself included) have never been thrilled about the whole "evil race" concept played completely straight. 
As an entirely personal belief (not something I would expect to put in the article), I think Orcs have the ability to live as good [[Avari]], and that it's the established traditions of Orc culture that inspire evil, and that Elves who do evil and ill-inspired acts (such as [[Fëanor]] and [[Sons of Fëanor|his sons]] along with [[Eöl]] and [[Maeglin]]) essentially make themselves Orcs, and that the difference of appearance between Elves and Orcs ("fair" vs. "ugly") is ultimately meaningless. The [[Silmarils]] knew the difference, and they burned evil and corruption when it touched them. I'm not sure Tolkien would completely disagree, as he once said, "We were all Orcs in the Great War." But I digress... - [[User:Gilgamesh|Gilgamesh]] 12:12, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

:I just (4/5/2011) summarized Letter 153 (a very long summary) for the Tolkien Gateway, wherein Tolkien dug very deeply into the metaphysics of Middle-earth. On the subject of Orcs, innate Free Will, their "evil race" status, and such, this letter probably gives Tolkien's "clearest" answers. -- Gamling 01:07, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

== Origin ==

I just would like to ask an question in regards to the origin of the orcs. First off I have no preferance either way, be it men or elves, but I would like to raise the point of time. Men awoke at the rising of the sun, so wouldn't this then pose a problem for Melkor when he made the orcs in the first war in Beleriand, for the sake of the elves.? Unless he can time shift and or travel. So then we are left with a rather interesting situation, any thoughts? {{unsigned|GaiusMarius}}

:Sorry, you've lost me? Do you mean that as Melkor created orcs in opposition to elves he had no "opposite" to men? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 14:09, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

: This is not an issue. In Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed (where Tolkien writes at length concerning the cosmology of Arda, and the origins of Orcs), Tolkien shifts the timeline to move the awakening of Men to be not long after that of Elves - during the Great March. This is actually done for other reasons, but serves to enable Men as a legitimate source for Orcs. Sorry for being anon, but I don't feel like signing up for an account. Find me as Túrin at lotrplaza.com if you want. {{unsignedAnon|24.176.44.61}}

: Sorry, but this is still a GREAT issue, not resolved by just simply changing the timeline. If men awoke at such an early time, it makes no sense that when the Noldor returned to Middle-Earth, Beleriand wasn't full of human kingdoms already, and that men had such a primitive culture. The episode of Finrod being the first Noldo to befriend men would make no sense, for example, neither his special bond with Beor's house (with all the consequences that would have in later tales). A major reworking of the legends would be needed just to fit this version of the origin of the orcs. {{unsignedAnon|95.22.52.196}}

::It is indeed an issue that this article makes the unequivocal statement it does. As pointed out above, Tolkien's changing ideas about the origins of orcs are discussed in Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed, and the article needs to mention these various ideas.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 22:48, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

==Etymology and Names==

JRRT notes the Nandorin word for orcs in PE17 (p. 54) '''''ūriƒ'''''. However, I'm uncertain about how to the render the last letter in the word - the original form of the letter is similar, but does not carry the small horizontal line. Is this a letter of its own, or merely a variant rendering of ƒ? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 01:24, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:There is the "[[wikipedia:Long s|long s]]" ''ſ'' (and [[wikipedia:Esh (letter)|the similar Esh]] ''ʃ''). Do these seem likely? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:41, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

::Many thanks, Mith! It's the Esh (''ʃ'') - could you please add it to the insert box? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 09:43, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:::Added both.--{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:07, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

== Orc - Rohirric or Westron ==

Quote: "This '''spelling''' was taken from Old English. The word seemed, in itself, very suitable to the creatures that I had in mind. But the Old English orc in meaning - so far as that is known - is not suitable. Also the spelling of what, in the later more organized linguistic situation, must have been a '''Common Speech''' form of a word or group of similar words should be ork."

Quote: "Orc. This is supposed to be the '''Common Speech''' name of these creatures at that time; it should therefore according to the system be translated into English, or the language of translation. It was translated 'goblin' in The Hobbit, except in one place; but this word, and other words of similar sense in other European languages (as far as I know), are not really suitable. The orc in The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, though of course partly made out of traditional features, is not really comparable in supposed origin, functions, and relation to the Elves. In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be '''retained'''."

Orc, or rather, the spelling of Orc is '''FROM''' Old English in reality, and the word itself was Westron in Middle-earth, '''NOT''' Rohirric, so I conclude.

It´s not like the other OE-for-Rohirric words in the LotR. Tolkien just '''retained''' this word from Westron, and where he did translate this 3rd age word, he translated it into Modern English.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 06:37, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

:I just found the quote for orc being (also?) Rohirric, "Orc is the form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the language of Rohan."
:I undid my previous edit, and I'm sorry for it, but still I think the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section need to be improved.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 07:25, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

::OK, good.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 13:01, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
::Note the word "races". Doesn't it imply not just in the languages of Rohan? [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:22, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

Seems like I have to put more source to support my argument.

"Orc is not an English word. It occurs in one or two places but is usually translated goblin ... Orc is the hobbits' form of the name given at that time to these creatures, and it is not connected at all with our orc, ork..." --- The Hobbit

Still no one try to rewrite the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section?

This section as it appears to me at the latest revision still needs correction. Asserting Orc being Old English here alone may be missleading. The subject needs more elaboration, which has already been done in "Orc" (why is "Orc" not simply part of "Etymology" though). Anyway, I think this part should be replaced with stuff that actually supports the idea that goblin and Orc are synonyms. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 11:26, 24 April 2021 (UTC)
: My mistake, "Orc" IS a subsection of "Etymology". [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:18, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

== "Gong" redirect link ==
Since the [[Gongs]] have their own article, could it be possible to change the redirect link on [[Gong]] to lead to ''that'' page, instead? [[User:Bauglir100|Bauglir100]] 12:50, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:Done. Although whether Gongs needs a separate article needs to be established, but in the meantime we should be consistent in any case. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:08, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

== Removed something unsourced ==

I have removed the following:

"This was evidently mainly to avoid the form ''Orcish'', which would be naturally pronounced with the c as /s/ instead of /k/. (In [[Languages|Tolkien's languages]] the letter ''c'' was always pronounced /k/.) "

Proclaiming the Orcish should be pronounced with an /s/ is, I think, wrong. That may be the common pronunciation in Latin-derived English words, but Orc is supposed to be a Sindarin word and Tolkien can transliterate it however he likes. {{unsignedanon|58.174.17.138}}

== Etymology for orcs ==

The name of the species "Orc" did '''NOT''' derive from the Latin ''Orcus''. Orcus, as I have mentioned is Latin, and thus as alien to Middle-earth as would be Mandarin or Korean.

The word "Orc" derives from the Saxon ''Orcnéas'', and ''Orcdhyrs'' (both words for Ogres). {{unsignedanon|67.159.191.98}}

:You are right, according to Wikipedia article Tolkien doubted that Orc comes from Orcus. However Latin is not so alien to M-e (cf. [[Gerontius]]). [[User:Sage|Sage]] 10:01, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
::Latin and Italian names were especially common in the Took family... --Tik 19:45, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

==Orcs vs. Orks==

:Shouldn't the correct spelling be "Orks" instead of "Orcs"? At least, that's from Tolkien's latest writings<ref>{{MR|Myths}}</ref>

{{references}}

== More on etymology ==

An anonymous user removed this paragraph:
:<nowiki>However, it is also mentioned that the word ''Orc'' is Anglo-Saxon for "Foreigner, Monster, Demon" and was used to refer to the Normans invading the Anglish in 1066.<ref>"[http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1329539/ 1066 The Battle for Middle Earth]" 2009 (documentary)</ref></nowiki>
The justification was that the statement is wrong, because the AS word for "foreigner" was ''wealas''.

Now, I don't know the source of the information that orc was used in that context (the original paragraph cited a docudrama) but the word ''wealas'' does not overrule the existence of more words for "foreigner" in other colors; for instance, there are several words for "sword", "battle", "hero", "lord" etc. I agree that the statement needs a better citation. [[User:Sage|Sage]] 13:10, 18 June 2016 (UTC)

Talk:Orcs

2021-04-24T13:22:07Z

Trahald: /* Orc - Rohirric or Westron */

The following external links no longer work:

The Origin of the Orcs (htm version)
The Origin of the Orcs (doc version)
The Origin of the Orcs (pdf version)

I got: The webpage cannot be found {{unsigned|71.173.181.175}}

:I solved the problem by deleting it :). It was inappropriate anyway, and the whole article needs to be rewritten. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 10:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::Which article? [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:25, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::Oh this article. Too much work to be done by 1.5 persons (= I am doing 0.4 of your work and the rest 0.1 belongs to occasional contributors) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:27, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::::I won't be doing much either. Just got an angry email that there was a deadline last week. So I got to focus on that first -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::::That's my point... where can we find more contributors? :) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 17:55, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

I edited the "Orcs and Goblins" section heavily to remove unfounded comments about "goblins" being a Hobbitish term when it is, in fact, an English word. I also cut down on some unfounded claims in the "Controversy" section. [[User:Eldorion|Eldorion]]

There needs to be a serious section in this article about the culture and ethics of Orcs, and whether Orcs are ultimately free to choose good or evil. I've seen other wikis touch on this issue, but this article barely does. A lot of people (myself included) have never been thrilled about the whole "evil race" concept played completely straight. 
As an entirely personal belief (not something I would expect to put in the article), I think Orcs have the ability to live as good [[Avari]], and that it's the established traditions of Orc culture that inspire evil, and that Elves who do evil and ill-inspired acts (such as [[Fëanor]] and [[Sons of Fëanor|his sons]] along with [[Eöl]] and [[Maeglin]]) essentially make themselves Orcs, and that the difference of appearance between Elves and Orcs ("fair" vs. "ugly") is ultimately meaningless. The [[Silmarils]] knew the difference, and they burned evil and corruption when it touched them. I'm not sure Tolkien would completely disagree, as he once said, "We were all Orcs in the Great War." But I digress... - [[User:Gilgamesh|Gilgamesh]] 12:12, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

:I just (4/5/2011) summarized Letter 153 (a very long summary) for the Tolkien Gateway, wherein Tolkien dug very deeply into the metaphysics of Middle-earth. On the subject of Orcs, innate Free Will, their "evil race" status, and such, this letter probably gives Tolkien's "clearest" answers. -- Gamling 01:07, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

== Origin ==

I just would like to ask an question in regards to the origin of the orcs. First off I have no preferance either way, be it men or elves, but I would like to raise the point of time. Men awoke at the rising of the sun, so wouldn't this then pose a problem for Melkor when he made the orcs in the first war in Beleriand, for the sake of the elves.? Unless he can time shift and or travel. So then we are left with a rather interesting situation, any thoughts? {{unsigned|GaiusMarius}}

:Sorry, you've lost me? Do you mean that as Melkor created orcs in opposition to elves he had no "opposite" to men? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 14:09, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

: This is not an issue. In Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed (where Tolkien writes at length concerning the cosmology of Arda, and the origins of Orcs), Tolkien shifts the timeline to move the awakening of Men to be not long after that of Elves - during the Great March. This is actually done for other reasons, but serves to enable Men as a legitimate source for Orcs. Sorry for being anon, but I don't feel like signing up for an account. Find me as Túrin at lotrplaza.com if you want. {{unsignedAnon|24.176.44.61}}

: Sorry, but this is still a GREAT issue, not resolved by just simply changing the timeline. If men awoke at such an early time, it makes no sense that when the Noldor returned to Middle-Earth, Beleriand wasn't full of human kingdoms already, and that men had such a primitive culture. The episode of Finrod being the first Noldo to befriend men would make no sense, for example, neither his special bond with Beor's house (with all the consequences that would have in later tales). A major reworking of the legends would be needed just to fit this version of the origin of the orcs. {{unsignedAnon|95.22.52.196}}

::It is indeed an issue that this article makes the unequivocal statement it does. As pointed out above, Tolkien's changing ideas about the origins of orcs are discussed in Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed, and the article needs to mention these various ideas.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 22:48, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

==Etymology and Names==

JRRT notes the Nandorin word for orcs in PE17 (p. 54) '''''ūriƒ'''''. However, I'm uncertain about how to the render the last letter in the word - the original form of the letter is similar, but does not carry the small horizontal line. Is this a letter of its own, or merely a variant rendering of ƒ? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 01:24, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:There is the "[[wikipedia:Long s|long s]]" ''ſ'' (and [[wikipedia:Esh (letter)|the similar Esh]] ''ʃ''). Do these seem likely? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:41, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

::Many thanks, Mith! It's the Esh (''ʃ'') - could you please add it to the insert box? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 09:43, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:::Added both.--{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:07, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

== Orc - Rohirric or Westron ==

Quote: "This '''spelling''' was taken from Old English. The word seemed, in itself, very suitable to the creatures that I had in mind. But the Old English orc in meaning - so far as that is known - is not suitable. Also the spelling of what, in the later more organized linguistic situation, must have been a '''Common Speech''' form of a word or group of similar words should be ork."

Quote: "Orc. This is supposed to be the '''Common Speech''' name of these creatures at that time; it should therefore according to the system be translated into English, or the language of translation. It was translated 'goblin' in The Hobbit, except in one place; but this word, and other words of similar sense in other European languages (as far as I know), are not really suitable. The orc in The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, though of course partly made out of traditional features, is not really comparable in supposed origin, functions, and relation to the Elves. In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be '''retained'''."

Orc, or rather, the spelling of Orc is '''FROM''' Old English in reality, and the word itself was Westron in Middle-earth, '''NOT''' Rohirric, so I conclude.

It´s not like the other OE-for-Rohirric words in the LotR. Tolkien just '''retained''' this word from Westron, and where he did translate this 3rd age word, he translated it into Modern English.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 06:37, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

:I just found the quote for orc being (also?) Rohirric, "Orc is the form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the language of Rohan."
:I undid my previous edit, and I'm sorry for it, but still I think the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section need to be improved.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 07:25, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

::OK, good.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 13:01, 23 November 2011 (UTC)
:::Note the word "races", doesn't it imply not just in the languages of Rohan? [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:22, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

Seems like I have to put more source to support my argument.

"Orc is not an English word. It occurs in one or two places but is usually translated goblin ... Orc is the hobbits' form of the name given at that time to these creatures, and it is not connected at all with our orc, ork..." --- The Hobbit

Still no one try to rewrite the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section?

This section as it appears to me at the latest revision still needs correction. Asserting Orc being Old English here alone may be missleading. The subject needs more elaboration, which has already been done in "Orc" (why is "Orc" not simply part of "Etymology" though). Anyway, I think this part should be replaced with stuff that actually supports the idea that goblin and Orc are synonyms. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 11:26, 24 April 2021 (UTC)
: My mistake, "Orc" IS a subsection of "Etymology". [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:18, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

== "Gong" redirect link ==
Since the [[Gongs]] have their own article, could it be possible to change the redirect link on [[Gong]] to lead to ''that'' page, instead? [[User:Bauglir100|Bauglir100]] 12:50, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:Done. Although whether Gongs needs a separate article needs to be established, but in the meantime we should be consistent in any case. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:08, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

== Removed something unsourced ==

I have removed the following:

"This was evidently mainly to avoid the form ''Orcish'', which would be naturally pronounced with the c as /s/ instead of /k/. (In [[Languages|Tolkien's languages]] the letter ''c'' was always pronounced /k/.) "

Proclaiming the Orcish should be pronounced with an /s/ is, I think, wrong. That may be the common pronunciation in Latin-derived English words, but Orc is supposed to be a Sindarin word and Tolkien can transliterate it however he likes. {{unsignedanon|58.174.17.138}}

== Etymology for orcs ==

The name of the species "Orc" did '''NOT''' derive from the Latin ''Orcus''. Orcus, as I have mentioned is Latin, and thus as alien to Middle-earth as would be Mandarin or Korean.

The word "Orc" derives from the Saxon ''Orcnéas'', and ''Orcdhyrs'' (both words for Ogres). {{unsignedanon|67.159.191.98}}

:You are right, according to Wikipedia article Tolkien doubted that Orc comes from Orcus. However Latin is not so alien to M-e (cf. [[Gerontius]]). [[User:Sage|Sage]] 10:01, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
::Latin and Italian names were especially common in the Took family... --Tik 19:45, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

==Orcs vs. Orks==

:Shouldn't the correct spelling be "Orks" instead of "Orcs"? At least, that's from Tolkien's latest writings<ref>{{MR|Myths}}</ref>

{{references}}

== More on etymology ==

An anonymous user removed this paragraph:
:<nowiki>However, it is also mentioned that the word ''Orc'' is Anglo-Saxon for "Foreigner, Monster, Demon" and was used to refer to the Normans invading the Anglish in 1066.<ref>"[http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1329539/ 1066 The Battle for Middle Earth]" 2009 (documentary)</ref></nowiki>
The justification was that the statement is wrong, because the AS word for "foreigner" was ''wealas''.

Now, I don't know the source of the information that orc was used in that context (the original paragraph cited a docudrama) but the word ''wealas'' does not overrule the existence of more words for "foreigner" in other colors; for instance, there are several words for "sword", "battle", "hero", "lord" etc. I agree that the statement needs a better citation. [[User:Sage|Sage]] 13:10, 18 June 2016 (UTC)

Talk:Orcs

2021-04-24T13:18:06Z

Trahald: /* Orc - Rohirric or Westron */

The following external links no longer work:

The Origin of the Orcs (htm version)
The Origin of the Orcs (doc version)
The Origin of the Orcs (pdf version)

I got: The webpage cannot be found {{unsigned|71.173.181.175}}

:I solved the problem by deleting it :). It was inappropriate anyway, and the whole article needs to be rewritten. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 10:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::Which article? [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:25, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::Oh this article. Too much work to be done by 1.5 persons (= I am doing 0.4 of your work and the rest 0.1 belongs to occasional contributors) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:27, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::::I won't be doing much either. Just got an angry email that there was a deadline last week. So I got to focus on that first -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::::That's my point... where can we find more contributors? :) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 17:55, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

I edited the "Orcs and Goblins" section heavily to remove unfounded comments about "goblins" being a Hobbitish term when it is, in fact, an English word. I also cut down on some unfounded claims in the "Controversy" section. [[User:Eldorion|Eldorion]]

There needs to be a serious section in this article about the culture and ethics of Orcs, and whether Orcs are ultimately free to choose good or evil. I've seen other wikis touch on this issue, but this article barely does. A lot of people (myself included) have never been thrilled about the whole "evil race" concept played completely straight. 
As an entirely personal belief (not something I would expect to put in the article), I think Orcs have the ability to live as good [[Avari]], and that it's the established traditions of Orc culture that inspire evil, and that Elves who do evil and ill-inspired acts (such as [[Fëanor]] and [[Sons of Fëanor|his sons]] along with [[Eöl]] and [[Maeglin]]) essentially make themselves Orcs, and that the difference of appearance between Elves and Orcs ("fair" vs. "ugly") is ultimately meaningless. The [[Silmarils]] knew the difference, and they burned evil and corruption when it touched them. I'm not sure Tolkien would completely disagree, as he once said, "We were all Orcs in the Great War." But I digress... - [[User:Gilgamesh|Gilgamesh]] 12:12, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

:I just (4/5/2011) summarized Letter 153 (a very long summary) for the Tolkien Gateway, wherein Tolkien dug very deeply into the metaphysics of Middle-earth. On the subject of Orcs, innate Free Will, their "evil race" status, and such, this letter probably gives Tolkien's "clearest" answers. -- Gamling 01:07, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

== Origin ==

I just would like to ask an question in regards to the origin of the orcs. First off I have no preferance either way, be it men or elves, but I would like to raise the point of time. Men awoke at the rising of the sun, so wouldn't this then pose a problem for Melkor when he made the orcs in the first war in Beleriand, for the sake of the elves.? Unless he can time shift and or travel. So then we are left with a rather interesting situation, any thoughts? {{unsigned|GaiusMarius}}

:Sorry, you've lost me? Do you mean that as Melkor created orcs in opposition to elves he had no "opposite" to men? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 14:09, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

: This is not an issue. In Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed (where Tolkien writes at length concerning the cosmology of Arda, and the origins of Orcs), Tolkien shifts the timeline to move the awakening of Men to be not long after that of Elves - during the Great March. This is actually done for other reasons, but serves to enable Men as a legitimate source for Orcs. Sorry for being anon, but I don't feel like signing up for an account. Find me as Túrin at lotrplaza.com if you want. {{unsignedAnon|24.176.44.61}}

: Sorry, but this is still a GREAT issue, not resolved by just simply changing the timeline. If men awoke at such an early time, it makes no sense that when the Noldor returned to Middle-Earth, Beleriand wasn't full of human kingdoms already, and that men had such a primitive culture. The episode of Finrod being the first Noldo to befriend men would make no sense, for example, neither his special bond with Beor's house (with all the consequences that would have in later tales). A major reworking of the legends would be needed just to fit this version of the origin of the orcs. {{unsignedAnon|95.22.52.196}}

::It is indeed an issue that this article makes the unequivocal statement it does. As pointed out above, Tolkien's changing ideas about the origins of orcs are discussed in Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed, and the article needs to mention these various ideas.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 22:48, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

==Etymology and Names==

JRRT notes the Nandorin word for orcs in PE17 (p. 54) '''''ūriƒ'''''. However, I'm uncertain about how to the render the last letter in the word - the original form of the letter is similar, but does not carry the small horizontal line. Is this a letter of its own, or merely a variant rendering of ƒ? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 01:24, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:There is the "[[wikipedia:Long s|long s]]" ''ſ'' (and [[wikipedia:Esh (letter)|the similar Esh]] ''ʃ''). Do these seem likely? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:41, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

::Many thanks, Mith! It's the Esh (''ʃ'') - could you please add it to the insert box? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 09:43, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:::Added both.--{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:07, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

== Orc - Rohirric or Westron ==

Quote: "This '''spelling''' was taken from Old English. The word seemed, in itself, very suitable to the creatures that I had in mind. But the Old English orc in meaning - so far as that is known - is not suitable. Also the spelling of what, in the later more organized linguistic situation, must have been a '''Common Speech''' form of a word or group of similar words should be ork."

Quote: "Orc. This is supposed to be the '''Common Speech''' name of these creatures at that time; it should therefore according to the system be translated into English, or the language of translation. It was translated 'goblin' in The Hobbit, except in one place; but this word, and other words of similar sense in other European languages (as far as I know), are not really suitable. The orc in The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, though of course partly made out of traditional features, is not really comparable in supposed origin, functions, and relation to the Elves. In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be '''retained'''."

Orc, or rather, the spelling of Orc is '''FROM''' Old English in reality, and the word itself was Westron in Middle-earth, '''NOT''' Rohirric, so I conclude.

It´s not like the other OE-for-Rohirric words in the LotR. Tolkien just '''retained''' this word from Westron, and where he did translate this 3rd age word, he translated it into Modern English.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 06:37, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

:I just found the quote for orc being (also?) Rohirric, "Orc is the form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the language of Rohan."
:I undid my previous edit, and I'm sorry for it, but still I think the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section need to be improved.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 07:25, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

::OK, good.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 13:01, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Seems like I have to put more source to support my argument.

"Orc is not an English word. It occurs in one or two places but is usually translated goblin ... Orc is the hobbits' form of the name given at that time to these creatures, and it is not connected at all with our orc, ork..." --- The Hobbit

Still no one try to rewrite the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section?

This section as it appears to me at the latest revision still needs correction. Asserting Orc being Old English here alone may be missleading. The subject needs more elaboration, which has already been done in "Orc" (why is "Orc" not simply part of "Etymology" though). Anyway, I think this part should be replaced with stuff that actually supports the idea that goblin and Orc are synonyms. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 11:26, 24 April 2021 (UTC)
: My mistake, "Orc" IS a subsection of "Etymology". [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 13:18, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

== "Gong" redirect link ==
Since the [[Gongs]] have their own article, could it be possible to change the redirect link on [[Gong]] to lead to ''that'' page, instead? [[User:Bauglir100|Bauglir100]] 12:50, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:Done. Although whether Gongs needs a separate article needs to be established, but in the meantime we should be consistent in any case. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:08, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

== Removed something unsourced ==

I have removed the following:

"This was evidently mainly to avoid the form ''Orcish'', which would be naturally pronounced with the c as /s/ instead of /k/. (In [[Languages|Tolkien's languages]] the letter ''c'' was always pronounced /k/.) "

Proclaiming the Orcish should be pronounced with an /s/ is, I think, wrong. That may be the common pronunciation in Latin-derived English words, but Orc is supposed to be a Sindarin word and Tolkien can transliterate it however he likes. {{unsignedanon|58.174.17.138}}

== Etymology for orcs ==

The name of the species "Orc" did '''NOT''' derive from the Latin ''Orcus''. Orcus, as I have mentioned is Latin, and thus as alien to Middle-earth as would be Mandarin or Korean.

The word "Orc" derives from the Saxon ''Orcnéas'', and ''Orcdhyrs'' (both words for Ogres). {{unsignedanon|67.159.191.98}}

:You are right, according to Wikipedia article Tolkien doubted that Orc comes from Orcus. However Latin is not so alien to M-e (cf. [[Gerontius]]). [[User:Sage|Sage]] 10:01, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
::Latin and Italian names were especially common in the Took family... --Tik 19:45, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

==Orcs vs. Orks==

:Shouldn't the correct spelling be "Orks" instead of "Orcs"? At least, that's from Tolkien's latest writings<ref>{{MR|Myths}}</ref>

{{references}}

== More on etymology ==

An anonymous user removed this paragraph:
:<nowiki>However, it is also mentioned that the word ''Orc'' is Anglo-Saxon for "Foreigner, Monster, Demon" and was used to refer to the Normans invading the Anglish in 1066.<ref>"[http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1329539/ 1066 The Battle for Middle Earth]" 2009 (documentary)</ref></nowiki>
The justification was that the statement is wrong, because the AS word for "foreigner" was ''wealas''.

Now, I don't know the source of the information that orc was used in that context (the original paragraph cited a docudrama) but the word ''wealas'' does not overrule the existence of more words for "foreigner" in other colors; for instance, there are several words for "sword", "battle", "hero", "lord" etc. I agree that the statement needs a better citation. [[User:Sage|Sage]] 13:10, 18 June 2016 (UTC)

Talk:Orcs

2021-04-24T11:26:00Z

Trahald: /* Orc - Rohirric or Westron */

The following external links no longer work:

The Origin of the Orcs (htm version)
The Origin of the Orcs (doc version)
The Origin of the Orcs (pdf version)

I got: The webpage cannot be found {{unsigned|71.173.181.175}}

:I solved the problem by deleting it :). It was inappropriate anyway, and the whole article needs to be rewritten. -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 10:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::Which article? [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:25, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::Oh this article. Too much work to be done by 1.5 persons (= I am doing 0.4 of your work and the rest 0.1 belongs to occasional contributors) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 12:27, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
::::I won't be doing much either. Just got an angry email that there was a deadline last week. So I got to focus on that first -- {{User:Ederchil/sig}} 12:51, 26 March 2009 (UTC)
:::::That's my point... where can we find more contributors? :) [[User:Sage|Sage]] 17:55, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

I edited the "Orcs and Goblins" section heavily to remove unfounded comments about "goblins" being a Hobbitish term when it is, in fact, an English word. I also cut down on some unfounded claims in the "Controversy" section. [[User:Eldorion|Eldorion]]

There needs to be a serious section in this article about the culture and ethics of Orcs, and whether Orcs are ultimately free to choose good or evil. I've seen other wikis touch on this issue, but this article barely does. A lot of people (myself included) have never been thrilled about the whole "evil race" concept played completely straight. 
As an entirely personal belief (not something I would expect to put in the article), I think Orcs have the ability to live as good [[Avari]], and that it's the established traditions of Orc culture that inspire evil, and that Elves who do evil and ill-inspired acts (such as [[Fëanor]] and [[Sons of Fëanor|his sons]] along with [[Eöl]] and [[Maeglin]]) essentially make themselves Orcs, and that the difference of appearance between Elves and Orcs ("fair" vs. "ugly") is ultimately meaningless. The [[Silmarils]] knew the difference, and they burned evil and corruption when it touched them. I'm not sure Tolkien would completely disagree, as he once said, "We were all Orcs in the Great War." But I digress... - [[User:Gilgamesh|Gilgamesh]] 12:12, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

:I just (4/5/2011) summarized Letter 153 (a very long summary) for the Tolkien Gateway, wherein Tolkien dug very deeply into the metaphysics of Middle-earth. On the subject of Orcs, innate Free Will, their "evil race" status, and such, this letter probably gives Tolkien's "clearest" answers. -- Gamling 01:07, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

== Origin ==

I just would like to ask an question in regards to the origin of the orcs. First off I have no preferance either way, be it men or elves, but I would like to raise the point of time. Men awoke at the rising of the sun, so wouldn't this then pose a problem for Melkor when he made the orcs in the first war in Beleriand, for the sake of the elves.? Unless he can time shift and or travel. So then we are left with a rather interesting situation, any thoughts? {{unsigned|GaiusMarius}}

:Sorry, you've lost me? Do you mean that as Melkor created orcs in opposition to elves he had no "opposite" to men? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 14:09, 6 April 2011 (UTC)

: This is not an issue. In Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed (where Tolkien writes at length concerning the cosmology of Arda, and the origins of Orcs), Tolkien shifts the timeline to move the awakening of Men to be not long after that of Elves - during the Great March. This is actually done for other reasons, but serves to enable Men as a legitimate source for Orcs. Sorry for being anon, but I don't feel like signing up for an account. Find me as Túrin at lotrplaza.com if you want. {{unsignedAnon|24.176.44.61}}

: Sorry, but this is still a GREAT issue, not resolved by just simply changing the timeline. If men awoke at such an early time, it makes no sense that when the Noldor returned to Middle-Earth, Beleriand wasn't full of human kingdoms already, and that men had such a primitive culture. The episode of Finrod being the first Noldo to befriend men would make no sense, for example, neither his special bond with Beor's house (with all the consequences that would have in later tales). A major reworking of the legends would be needed just to fit this version of the origin of the orcs. {{unsignedAnon|95.22.52.196}}

::It is indeed an issue that this article makes the unequivocal statement it does. As pointed out above, Tolkien's changing ideas about the origins of orcs are discussed in Morgoth's Ring, Myths Transformed, and the article needs to mention these various ideas.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 22:48, 21 October 2013 (UTC)

==Etymology and Names==

JRRT notes the Nandorin word for orcs in PE17 (p. 54) '''''ūriƒ'''''. However, I'm uncertain about how to the render the last letter in the word - the original form of the letter is similar, but does not carry the small horizontal line. Is this a letter of its own, or merely a variant rendering of ƒ? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 01:24, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:There is the "[[wikipedia:Long s|long s]]" ''ſ'' (and [[wikipedia:Esh (letter)|the similar Esh]] ''ʃ''). Do these seem likely? --{{User:Mith/sig}} 09:41, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

::Many thanks, Mith! It's the Esh (''ʃ'') - could you please add it to the insert box? --[[User:Morgan|Morgan]] 09:43, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

:::Added both.--{{User:Mith/sig}} 10:07, 3 July 2011 (UTC)

== Orc - Rohirric or Westron ==

Quote: "This '''spelling''' was taken from Old English. The word seemed, in itself, very suitable to the creatures that I had in mind. But the Old English orc in meaning - so far as that is known - is not suitable. Also the spelling of what, in the later more organized linguistic situation, must have been a '''Common Speech''' form of a word or group of similar words should be ork."

Quote: "Orc. This is supposed to be the '''Common Speech''' name of these creatures at that time; it should therefore according to the system be translated into English, or the language of translation. It was translated 'goblin' in The Hobbit, except in one place; but this word, and other words of similar sense in other European languages (as far as I know), are not really suitable. The orc in The Lord of the Rings and The Silmarillion, though of course partly made out of traditional features, is not really comparable in supposed origin, functions, and relation to the Elves. In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be '''retained'''."

Orc, or rather, the spelling of Orc is '''FROM''' Old English in reality, and the word itself was Westron in Middle-earth, '''NOT''' Rohirric, so I conclude.

It´s not like the other OE-for-Rohirric words in the LotR. Tolkien just '''retained''' this word from Westron, and where he did translate this 3rd age word, he translated it into Modern English.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 06:37, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

:I just found the quote for orc being (also?) Rohirric, "Orc is the form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the language of Rohan."
:I undid my previous edit, and I'm sorry for it, but still I think the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section need to be improved.--[[User:SUM EGO|SUM EGO]] 07:25, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

::OK, good.--{{User:KingAragorn/sig}} 13:01, 23 November 2011 (UTC)

Seems like I have to put more source to support my argument.

"Orc is not an English word. It occurs in one or two places but is usually translated goblin ... Orc is the hobbits' form of the name given at that time to these creatures, and it is not connected at all with our orc, ork..." --- The Hobbit

Still no one try to rewrite the '''Orcs and Goblins''' section?

This section as it appears to me at the latest revision still needs correction. Asserting Orc being Old English here alone may be missleading. The subject needs more elaboration, which has already been done in "Orc" (why is "Orc" not simply part of "Etymology" though). Anyway, I think this part should be replaced with stuff that actually supports the idea that goblin and Orc are synonyms. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 11:26, 24 April 2021 (UTC)

== "Gong" redirect link ==
Since the [[Gongs]] have their own article, could it be possible to change the redirect link on [[Gong]] to lead to ''that'' page, instead? [[User:Bauglir100|Bauglir100]] 12:50, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

:Done. Although whether Gongs needs a separate article needs to be established, but in the meantime we should be consistent in any case. --{{User:Mith/sig}} 13:08, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

== Removed something unsourced ==

I have removed the following:

"This was evidently mainly to avoid the form ''Orcish'', which would be naturally pronounced with the c as /s/ instead of /k/. (In [[Languages|Tolkien's languages]] the letter ''c'' was always pronounced /k/.) "

Proclaiming the Orcish should be pronounced with an /s/ is, I think, wrong. That may be the common pronunciation in Latin-derived English words, but Orc is supposed to be a Sindarin word and Tolkien can transliterate it however he likes. {{unsignedanon|58.174.17.138}}

== Etymology for orcs ==

The name of the species "Orc" did '''NOT''' derive from the Latin ''Orcus''. Orcus, as I have mentioned is Latin, and thus as alien to Middle-earth as would be Mandarin or Korean.

The word "Orc" derives from the Saxon ''Orcnéas'', and ''Orcdhyrs'' (both words for Ogres). {{unsignedanon|67.159.191.98}}

:You are right, according to Wikipedia article Tolkien doubted that Orc comes from Orcus. However Latin is not so alien to M-e (cf. [[Gerontius]]). [[User:Sage|Sage]] 10:01, 13 March 2015 (UTC)
::Latin and Italian names were especially common in the Took family... --Tik 19:45, 13 March 2015 (UTC)

==Orcs vs. Orks==

:Shouldn't the correct spelling be "Orks" instead of "Orcs"? At least, that's from Tolkien's latest writings<ref>{{MR|Myths}}</ref>

{{references}}

== More on etymology ==

An anonymous user removed this paragraph:
:<nowiki>However, it is also mentioned that the word ''Orc'' is Anglo-Saxon for "Foreigner, Monster, Demon" and was used to refer to the Normans invading the Anglish in 1066.<ref>"[http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1329539/ 1066 The Battle for Middle Earth]" 2009 (documentary)</ref></nowiki>
The justification was that the statement is wrong, because the AS word for "foreigner" was ''wealas''.

Now, I don't know the source of the information that orc was used in that context (the original paragraph cited a docudrama) but the word ''wealas'' does not overrule the existence of more words for "foreigner" in other colors; for instance, there are several words for "sword", "battle", "hero", "lord" etc. I agree that the statement needs a better citation. [[User:Sage|Sage]] 13:10, 18 June 2016 (UTC)

Orcs

2021-04-22T02:50:20Z

Trahald: /* Orc */

{{rewrite}}{{sources}}
{{race infobox
| name=Orcs
| image=[[File:John Howe - In Mordor.jpg|250px]]
| caption="In Mordor" by [[John Howe]]
| pronun=
| othernames=Goblins, [[Glamhoth]], [[Yrch]]
| origin=Obscure, but apparently bred from [[Elves]] or [[Men]]
| location=[[Utumno]], [[Angband]], [[Mordor]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]], [[Mount Gundabad]], [[High Pass]], [[Dol Guldur]], [[Isengard]]
| affiliation=[[Morgoth]], [[Sauron]]
| rivalry=[[Elves]], [[Men]], [[Dwarves]]
| language=[[Black Speech]]; numerous [[Orkish]] languages; [[Westron]]
| people=[[Uruk-hai]], [[Goblin-men]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Hobgoblins]], [[Orcs of Mordor|Mordor Orcs]], [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains|Misty Mountain Orcs]]
| members=[[Othrod]], [[Azog]], [[Bolg]], [[Gorbag]], [[Great Goblin]], [[Grishnákh]]
| lifespan=Unknown
| distinctions=Evil footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Evil]]; preferred darkness
| height=Short<ref>{{FR|II5}} The "huge" orc-chieftain is described as "almost man high"</ref>
| hair=
| skin=Sallow, green, brown, grey, black, swarthy
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
'''Orcs''' (also called '''[[Orcs#Orcs and goblins|Goblins]]''') were the footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Dark Lords]] - [[Morgoth]] and [[Sauron]].

==History==
===Origins and early years===
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}
The Orcs were bred by [[Melkor]] in mockery of the [[Elves]], sometime during the [[The Darkness#The Great Darkness|Great Darkness]].<ref>{{S|3}}</ref><ref>{{TT|III4}}</ref> How this was done is unclear, as the Dark Lord did not possess the power to create life, only to corrupt it. It is unknown whether corrupted Elves, [[Men]] or other creatures were used to achieve this.

[[File:John Howe - Orc Swordsman.jpg|thumb|200px|right|''Orc Swordsman'' by [[John Howe]]]]

It is unclear exactly when Orcs were created, but it certainly happened before the [[Battle of the Powers]] in his stronghold of Utumno. Whether the Orcs were at this time a capable fighting force against the host of Valinor is not known. But at least some of them survived this war, probably hidden in the deep vaults of [[Angband]], and multiplied, waiting for their master.

They first came out of Angband in {{YT|1330}}, passing over the mountains to [[Beleriand]] with other dark creatures.<ref>{{GA|26-27}}</ref>

When Melkor (now known as [[Morgoth]]) returned to Middle-earth, he created new hordes of Orcs and invaded [[Beleriand]], where the [[First Battle of Beleriand]] took place. Orcs also fought in [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]].

===First Age===
Orcs appear in the [[First Age]] as the core force of [[Morgoth]]. Hundreds of thousands of Orcs were bred in [[Angband]] to participate in the [[Battles of Beleriand]], which lasted 587 years.

Orcs first appear in the [[First Age]] in the [[Battle of the Lammoth]], where they were defeated by [[Fingolfin]] and his [[Noldor]]. Orcs participated in battles such as the [[Dagor Aglareb]], [[Dagor Bragollach]], [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]], [[Fall of the Falas]], and finally in the [[War of Wrath]], where they were almost extinguished. Those that survived the defeat fled eastwards and hid probably in the Mountains of [[Angmar]] and the [[Ered Mithrin]].

===Second Age===
Around the year {{SA|1000}} Sauron reappeared, took the land of [[Mordor]] as his realm and started the construction of [[Barad-dûr]]. It is likely that most of his servants were Orcs at this time that he had gathered under his command. Still for a long time Sauron's foul servants did not play an important role, for the Dark Lord had chosen a more subtle way to overthrow the free people by creating the [[Rings of Power]].

During the [[War of the Elves and Sauron]], in {{SA|1700}}, Orcs formed the main power of Sauron's host. Despite the immeasurable number of Orcs, Sauron was defeated by the united hosts of Elves and [[Númenóreans]]. Still Sauron was powerful east of the [[Misty Mountains]] and the Orcs that inhabited the mountains and the eastern lands multiplied.

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]] started a war against the [[Dwarves]], resulting in the [[First Sack of Gundabad]] and its occupation by the Orcs. Finally, Orcs were the core force of [[Sauron]] during the [[War of the Last Alliance]], and fought in great battles such as the [[Battle of Dagorlad]] and the [[Siege of Barad-dûr]].

===Third Age===
[[File:Richard Sullivan - Orc.jpg|thumb|left|''Orc'' by [[:Category:Images by Richard Sullivan|Richard Sullivan]]]]
During the [[Third Age]], Orcs were the standard troops of [[Sauron]] (both in [[Mordor]] and in [[Dol Guldur]]), and his great servants - such as the [[Witch-king]] and [[Saruman]].

In [[Angmar]], Orcs fought for the Witch-king in the [[Angmar War]]. Years later, they invaded [[Eriador]] under the leadership of the [[Necromancer]].

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]], one of the few (more or less) independent Orcish societies, and their leader [[Azog]] started out the [[War of the Dwarves and Orcs]], and after their defeat they retreated in their caves. They appeared again in {{TA|2941}}, when the [[Battle of Five Armies]] took place, suffering yet another terrible loss.

In his efforts to hinder the people of [[Rohan]], Saruman began to gather Orcs from the Mountains for his army in [[Isengard]], experimenting on them to fashion himself greater soldiers such as [[Half-orcs]], [[Goblin-men]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

The [[Orcs of Mordor]] fought in major battles during the [[War of the Ring]], such as the [[Battle of the Pelennor Fields]], but the majority of [[Mordor]]'s forces were destroyed or scattered at the [[Battle of the Morannon]]. Sporadic fighting in the following weeks led to the Orcs finally being driven out of the western end of Mordor, though it is unclear how many Orcs Sauron had in his armies, and it is also unclear how many survived after his defeat.

The Orcs in [[Dol Guldur]] remained in [[Mirkwood]] until the [[Fall of Dol Guldur]], one of the last battles of the War of the Ring.

===Fourth Age and beyond===
The fate of the Orcs after the Third Age is unknown. Though many of Sauron's Orcs fought on and were slain in the weeks following the Battle of the Morannon, the true number of Sauron's hosts is unclear, as are the numbers of Orcs not within Mordor that may still inhabit the rest of Middle-earth. It is at least known that the Orcs of Moria either fled or were slain by the Fourth Age, as it is mentioned that the Dwarves managed to retake Moria and the mines within it.

==Characteristics==

===Culture===
It is certain all Orcs were dependent on the Dark Lords in various ways: after the War of Wrath, the Orcs were confused and dismayed without Morgoth, and were easily scattered by their enemies. In the millennia after his defeat and banishment from Arda, they were without a leader and degenerated into small, quarrelsome tribes hiding in wild places, such as the [[Misty Mountains]] and the [[Mountains of Angmar]]. Orcs remained a threat to travelers and isolated settlements, and when united could pose a great regional threat, but they could never amount to the force they were under Morgoth. Only when Sauron returned to power did they begin to reclaim their old power. The same happened after Sauron's defeat by the [[Last Alliance of Elves and Men]]: only under the Witch-King's command, and when Sauron returned as the Necromancer of [[Mirkwood]], did the Orcs become a real danger for all of Middle-earth again. Orcs were warlike and often cruel, fighting with reckless ferocity and delighting in the slaughter and torture of their foes; many had a cowardly nature however, and were often regarded as inferior, though far more expendable, than the soldiers of Men, Elves, and Dwarves. It is said that Sauron, at the height of his power, had greater control over the Orcs than Morgoth had, though this was because he had not yet spent himself in dominating others as well as due to a lesser threat posed by his adversaries than those of his predecessor. Orcs also proved themselves adept at taming and riding [[Wolves]] and even [[Wargs]], an abillity harnessed by the Dark Lords for their armies.

===Lifespan===
It is unknown if the Orcs were immortal like the Elves. There is, in any case, a hint for a long lifespan in the story of two of the most famous Orc-chieftains: [[Azog]] and [[Bolg]]. Bolg, being the son of Azog, was the chieftain of the Orcs who attacked Erebor in the Battle of Five Armies in {{TA|2941}}. Azog himself was killed in the Battle of Azanulbizar in {{TA|2799}}, so Bolg was at least 150 years old.

===Appearance===
Orcs were described as smaller in stature than Men on average, strong but crooked in frame and bow-legged. One "huge orc-chieftain" was described as "almost Man-high", but some must have been of a similar size to Hobbits (Frodo and Sam succeeded in disguising themselves as Orcs in Mordor). Their overall appearance varied: they had long arms and fanged mouths; Tolkien describes them as "swart" or "sallow", although one in Mordor is "black-skinned" and others are described generally as "black" (possibly not a reference to skin colour).

===Kinds of orcs===
The Fellowship usually encountered the large soldier-Orcs bred for war, and sometimes the "snaga" variety which were more geared towards being labourers. Another type is referred to as "snufflers", smaller, black-skinned Orcs with wide nostrils, who excelled in tracking. Despite the smaller size, one snuffler was able to skillfully kill a soldier-orc when they got into a disagreement.<ref name="Cirith">{{RK|VI1}}</ref>

*[[Snaga]]
*[[Snufflers]]
*[[Orcs of Mordor]]
*[[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]]
*[[Half-orcs]] (and [[Goblin-men]])
*[[Uruk-hai]]
*[[Hobgoblins]]

[[File:Darek Zabrocki - Goblins.jpg|thumb|250px|''Goblins'' by [[:Category:Images by Darek Zabrocki|Darek Zabrocki]]]]

===Orcs and goblins===
The term ''goblin'' was used primarily in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' but also in ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' where it is used synonymously with "Orc".<ref>{{TT|III1}}</ref><ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. 24</ref>

"Goblin" is an English word, whereas "Orc" is Old English, the language used by Tolkien to represent Rohirric.<ref>{{App|F1iv}}</ref> Thus, there is no difference between Orcs and Goblins.

==Etymology==
{{quote|The word as far as I am concerned actually derived from [[Old English]] ''orc'', demon, but only because of its phonetic suitability.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]] in [[Letter 144]]}}
===Orc===
The word '''''Orc''''' is said to be the "''form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the [[Rohirric|language of Rohan]]''".<ref name=App|F1iv/>

In his late, post-''Lord of the Rings'' writings, Tolkien preferred the spelling '''''Ork'''''.<ref>{{HM|PM}}</ref>

It also is "supposed to be the CS[Common Speech] name of these creatures at that time"<ref>"Nomenclature in the Lord of the Rings" in {{HM|RC}}</ref>.

The statement may be ambiguous due to Tolkien's use of the term Common Speech for both Westron and English. But Tolkien continued to say "It should therefore according to the system be translated into E[English]. or the LT[Langauge of Translation]. It was translated 'goblin' in The H.[Hobbit]"<ref>"Nomenclature in the Lord of the Rings" in {{HM|RC}}</ref>. This may suggest it is a genuine Westron word, which Tolkien kept untranslated because he liked the sound of it: "In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be retained."<ref>"Nomenclature in the Lord of the Rings" in {{HM|RC}}</ref>

Fictionally, it is then possibly derived from 'orch', the [[Sindarin]] word for Orc. The original sense of the word seems to be "bogey", "bogeyman", that is, something that provokes fear, as seen in the Quenya cognate ''urko'', pl. ''urqui''.<ref>{{HM|WJ}} Quendi and Eldar</ref>

Tolkien derived the word ''orc'' from [[Old English]] believing it refers to a kind of evil spirits,<ref name=L144/> which in turn is thought to derive from Latin ''Orcus'' "Hades", although Tolkien doubted this etymology.<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Gene Wolfe]]" (letter)</ref> He also thought it survives in the modern language for sea-beasts,<ref>{{HM|N}}, p. 762</ref> such as the [[Wikipedia:Orca Whale|Orca Whale]].

''Orc'' is an [[Old English]] word that refers mainly to a kind of metal cup (from Latin ''Urceus'').<ref group="note">The word ''Orc'' occurs twice in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]''.</ref> However, in an 11th century glossary, this entry was conflated with another entry which refers to evil giants such as ''[[Wikipedia:Jötunn|þyrs]]'' and other monsters, also glossed in Latin as ''Orcus''. This merge of the two entries made many philologists of the previous centuries, like Tolkien, to believe that ''Orc'' was an actual Old English word that refers to any kind of evil creature from the underworld.<ref>Bosworth and Toller's ''An Anglo-Saxon Dictionary'' (1898), corrected in later editions</ref>

The word ''Orcnéas'' is once found only in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]'' (lines 112-113) and is cited as an example of the word "Orc" in Old English text. Actually its meaning is not clear, and it is thought to refer to corpses (''néas'') from the Underworld.

==="Orcs" in Tolkien's languages===
Tolkien said that one of the reason of choosing "Orc" over "Goblin" was the similarity with his fictional languages.<ref name=WJAC>{{WJ|AC}}, pp. 389-91</ref> Indeed most [[Elvish]], [[Mannish]] and other words for Orc, are similar to the English word.

The basic [[Primitive Quendian]] [[Sundocarme|root]], from which the words for Orc derive, is [[RUKU]] (said to refer to any "bogey" that scared the Elves)<ref name=WJAC/>:

*[[Quenya]] '''''orco'''''<ref name=PE17_47/> (pl. '''''Orkor'''''<ref>{{GA|27}}, p. 12</ref><ref>{{HM|MR}}, pp. 74, 194</ref>); [[Exilic Quenya]] '''''urko''''' (pl. '''''orkor''''' and '''''orqui''''')<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Sindarin]]: '''''orch'''''/'''''Orch''''' (pl. '''''yrch'''''/'''''Yrch''''', class pl. '''''Orchoth'''''/'''''orchoth'''''<ref group="note">''Orchoth'' is likely a compound of ''orch'' + ''[[hoth]]''.</ref>)<ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144/><ref name=PE17_52-4/><ref name=PE17_47/><ref name=App|F1iv/>; '''''[[glamhoth]]'''''
*[[Nandorin]]: '''''ūriʃ'''''<ref name=PE17_52-4>{{PE|17}}, pp. 52-4</ref>

*[[Adûnaic]]: '''''urku''''', '''''urkhu'''''<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Westron]]: '''''orka'''''<ref name=PE17_47>{{PE|17}}, p. 47</ref>, possibly '''orc''' <ref>"Nomenclature in the Lord of the Rings" in {{HM|RC}}</ref>
*[[Black Speech]]: '''''[[Uruk-hai#Etymology|uruk]]'''''<ref name=App|F1iv>{{App|F1iv}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144>{{L|144}}</ref><ref name=PE17_47/>
*[[Khuzdul]]: '''''Rukhs''''' (pl. '''''Rakhās'''''), possibly derived from an unknown [[Avarin]] word of the same meaning<ref name=WJAC/><ref group="note">''Rukhs'' appears to contain the radical R-Kh-S.</ref>
*[[Drúadan language]]: '''''gorgûn''''' ("orc-folk"; the form ''gorgûn'' is perhaps plural of an unknown singular form)<ref name=PE17_99>{{PE|17}}, p. 99</ref><ref>{{RK|V5}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/>

In the earliest versions of [[Qenya]], Tolkien had words such as "'''Ork (orq-)''' pl. '''Orqi''' and fem. "'''orqindi'''".{{fact}}

In [[Noldorin]], the earlier version of Sindarin, the word for Orc is the same: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'').<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref><ref>{{MR|P3I7}}, p. 195</ref><ref>{{MC|Secret}}, p. 217</ref> The [[Gnomish]] word for "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin" is said to be '''''Gong'''''.<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

*''See also: [[Entish]] ''[[burárum]]''

===Goblin===
''[[Wiktionary:goblin|Goblin]]'' is a folk word which according to ''The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Current English'' is probably derived from the Anglo-French ''[[Wiktionary:gobelin|gobelin]]'' a diminutive of ''gobel'' (cf. ''[[Wiktionary:kobold|kobold]]''). William D.B. Loos notes that ''goblin'' is a Romance-derived word, unlike other Germanic words preferred by [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]].<ref>William D.B. Loos, [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/EnemyMisc.html#Orcs Enemies and Miscellaneous: What was the relationship between Orcs and Goblins?] at [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/ The Tolkien Frequently Asked Questions List] (accessed 3 July 2011)</ref>

==="Goblin" in Tolkien's languages===
In the [[The Etymologies|''Etymologies'']], the Elvish names used to translate "goblin" derive from root [[RUKU#Other versions|ÓROK]] and are:<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref>

*[[Quenya]]: '''''orko''''' (pl. '''''orqi''''')
*[[Noldorin]]: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'', archaic ''yrchy''<ref>{{VT|46a}}, p. 7</ref>)
*[[Nandorin|Danian]]: '''''urc''''' (pl. '''''yrc''''')
*[[Doriathrin]]: '''''urch''''' (pl. '''''urchin''''')

In an early linguistic writing, Tolkien translated the [[Gnomish]] word ''Gong'' as "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin."<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}

==Controversy==
Tolkien's Orcs have been a subject of criticism of [[racism]]. Tolkien described Orcs as "squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types".<ref>{{L|210}}</ref>

==Other writings==
In ''[[The Father Christmas Letters]]'', goblins appear as the enemies of [[Father Christmas]] and the [[Red Elves]].

==Portrayal in adaptations==
===Orcs===
{{stub}}<gallery>File: The Lord of the Rings (1978 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (1978 film)]]
File:The Return of the King (1980 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Return of the King (1980 film)|''The Return of the King'' (1980 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings- The Treason of Isengard - Ork.jpg|Concept art of an orc in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Treason of Isengard]]''
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Orc3.jpg|An Orc in [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''.</gallery>

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Orc-kind is a genus that includes the species of Orcs, Goblins, [[Hobgoblins]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Boggarts]], [[Bugans]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

:Orcs are very common in Middle-earth. They are about the size of a man with a hunchback, though some of the sub-races are of larger or smaller stature.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Orcs are first seen in [[Fornost]], where they immediately attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] as they near the citadel.<ref name=Main>[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]], Chapter 1: Fornost, ''Main Gate''</ref> ''Orc warriors'' are stronger then normal Orcs. Some Orcs have been taught [[Magic|sorcery]] by [[Agandaûr]], these are known as ''Orc Sorcerers''.

===Goblins===
<gallery>File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1977 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Goblins1.jpg|Goblins in the pits of [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''
File:The Hobbit - An Unexpected Journey - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in ''[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]''</gallery>

'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War of the Ring]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2006: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-earth II]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Goblins are a separate race and can be found in [[Evendim]], [[the Shire]], [[Ered Luin]], [[Bree-land]], [[Lone-lands]], [[North Downs]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]] and [[Moria]]. They are small in stature; a little shorter than [[Hobbits]]. In contrast, Orcs are about the size of [[Men]]. Goblins are also weaker than the orcs.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Goblins first appear in [[Fornost Erain]], where they attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] immediately when they reach the city.<ref name=Main></ref> Goblins are weaker than Orcs.

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:Goblins are again made clearly distinct from Orcs in the film series. They are lesser relatives of Orcs; they are smaller (the very large Great Goblin notwithstanding), less powerful, and generally have pale, diseased skin, riddled with warts.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:A band of "Goblin mercenaries" appear on [[Ravenhill]] during the [[Battle of Five Armies]], but are taken care of by the Dwarves without much trouble.

==See also==
*[[Gongs]]
*[[:Category:Images of Goblins|Images of Goblins]]

{{references|note}}
[[Category:Orcs| ]]
[[Category:Races]]
[[Category:Servants of Melkor]]
[[Category:Servants of Saruman]]
[[Category:Servants of Sauron]]
[[de:Orks]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/orques/orques]]
[[fi:Örkit]]

Orcs

2021-04-22T02:49:15Z

Trahald: /* "Orcs" in Tolkien's languages */

{{rewrite}}{{sources}}
{{race infobox
| name=Orcs
| image=[[File:John Howe - In Mordor.jpg|250px]]
| caption="In Mordor" by [[John Howe]]
| pronun=
| othernames=Goblins, [[Glamhoth]], [[Yrch]]
| origin=Obscure, but apparently bred from [[Elves]] or [[Men]]
| location=[[Utumno]], [[Angband]], [[Mordor]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]], [[Mount Gundabad]], [[High Pass]], [[Dol Guldur]], [[Isengard]]
| affiliation=[[Morgoth]], [[Sauron]]
| rivalry=[[Elves]], [[Men]], [[Dwarves]]
| language=[[Black Speech]]; numerous [[Orkish]] languages; [[Westron]]
| people=[[Uruk-hai]], [[Goblin-men]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Hobgoblins]], [[Orcs of Mordor|Mordor Orcs]], [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains|Misty Mountain Orcs]]
| members=[[Othrod]], [[Azog]], [[Bolg]], [[Gorbag]], [[Great Goblin]], [[Grishnákh]]
| lifespan=Unknown
| distinctions=Evil footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Evil]]; preferred darkness
| height=Short<ref>{{FR|II5}} The "huge" orc-chieftain is described as "almost man high"</ref>
| hair=
| skin=Sallow, green, brown, grey, black, swarthy
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
'''Orcs''' (also called '''[[Orcs#Orcs and goblins|Goblins]]''') were the footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Dark Lords]] - [[Morgoth]] and [[Sauron]].

==History==
===Origins and early years===
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}
The Orcs were bred by [[Melkor]] in mockery of the [[Elves]], sometime during the [[The Darkness#The Great Darkness|Great Darkness]].<ref>{{S|3}}</ref><ref>{{TT|III4}}</ref> How this was done is unclear, as the Dark Lord did not possess the power to create life, only to corrupt it. It is unknown whether corrupted Elves, [[Men]] or other creatures were used to achieve this.

[[File:John Howe - Orc Swordsman.jpg|thumb|200px|right|''Orc Swordsman'' by [[John Howe]]]]

It is unclear exactly when Orcs were created, but it certainly happened before the [[Battle of the Powers]] in his stronghold of Utumno. Whether the Orcs were at this time a capable fighting force against the host of Valinor is not known. But at least some of them survived this war, probably hidden in the deep vaults of [[Angband]], and multiplied, waiting for their master.

They first came out of Angband in {{YT|1330}}, passing over the mountains to [[Beleriand]] with other dark creatures.<ref>{{GA|26-27}}</ref>

When Melkor (now known as [[Morgoth]]) returned to Middle-earth, he created new hordes of Orcs and invaded [[Beleriand]], where the [[First Battle of Beleriand]] took place. Orcs also fought in [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]].

===First Age===
Orcs appear in the [[First Age]] as the core force of [[Morgoth]]. Hundreds of thousands of Orcs were bred in [[Angband]] to participate in the [[Battles of Beleriand]], which lasted 587 years.

Orcs first appear in the [[First Age]] in the [[Battle of the Lammoth]], where they were defeated by [[Fingolfin]] and his [[Noldor]]. Orcs participated in battles such as the [[Dagor Aglareb]], [[Dagor Bragollach]], [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]], [[Fall of the Falas]], and finally in the [[War of Wrath]], where they were almost extinguished. Those that survived the defeat fled eastwards and hid probably in the Mountains of [[Angmar]] and the [[Ered Mithrin]].

===Second Age===
Around the year {{SA|1000}} Sauron reappeared, took the land of [[Mordor]] as his realm and started the construction of [[Barad-dûr]]. It is likely that most of his servants were Orcs at this time that he had gathered under his command. Still for a long time Sauron's foul servants did not play an important role, for the Dark Lord had chosen a more subtle way to overthrow the free people by creating the [[Rings of Power]].

During the [[War of the Elves and Sauron]], in {{SA|1700}}, Orcs formed the main power of Sauron's host. Despite the immeasurable number of Orcs, Sauron was defeated by the united hosts of Elves and [[Númenóreans]]. Still Sauron was powerful east of the [[Misty Mountains]] and the Orcs that inhabited the mountains and the eastern lands multiplied.

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]] started a war against the [[Dwarves]], resulting in the [[First Sack of Gundabad]] and its occupation by the Orcs. Finally, Orcs were the core force of [[Sauron]] during the [[War of the Last Alliance]], and fought in great battles such as the [[Battle of Dagorlad]] and the [[Siege of Barad-dûr]].

===Third Age===
[[File:Richard Sullivan - Orc.jpg|thumb|left|''Orc'' by [[:Category:Images by Richard Sullivan|Richard Sullivan]]]]
During the [[Third Age]], Orcs were the standard troops of [[Sauron]] (both in [[Mordor]] and in [[Dol Guldur]]), and his great servants - such as the [[Witch-king]] and [[Saruman]].

In [[Angmar]], Orcs fought for the Witch-king in the [[Angmar War]]. Years later, they invaded [[Eriador]] under the leadership of the [[Necromancer]].

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]], one of the few (more or less) independent Orcish societies, and their leader [[Azog]] started out the [[War of the Dwarves and Orcs]], and after their defeat they retreated in their caves. They appeared again in {{TA|2941}}, when the [[Battle of Five Armies]] took place, suffering yet another terrible loss.

In his efforts to hinder the people of [[Rohan]], Saruman began to gather Orcs from the Mountains for his army in [[Isengard]], experimenting on them to fashion himself greater soldiers such as [[Half-orcs]], [[Goblin-men]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

The [[Orcs of Mordor]] fought in major battles during the [[War of the Ring]], such as the [[Battle of the Pelennor Fields]], but the majority of [[Mordor]]'s forces were destroyed or scattered at the [[Battle of the Morannon]]. Sporadic fighting in the following weeks led to the Orcs finally being driven out of the western end of Mordor, though it is unclear how many Orcs Sauron had in his armies, and it is also unclear how many survived after his defeat.

The Orcs in [[Dol Guldur]] remained in [[Mirkwood]] until the [[Fall of Dol Guldur]], one of the last battles of the War of the Ring.

===Fourth Age and beyond===
The fate of the Orcs after the Third Age is unknown. Though many of Sauron's Orcs fought on and were slain in the weeks following the Battle of the Morannon, the true number of Sauron's hosts is unclear, as are the numbers of Orcs not within Mordor that may still inhabit the rest of Middle-earth. It is at least known that the Orcs of Moria either fled or were slain by the Fourth Age, as it is mentioned that the Dwarves managed to retake Moria and the mines within it.

==Characteristics==

===Culture===
It is certain all Orcs were dependent on the Dark Lords in various ways: after the War of Wrath, the Orcs were confused and dismayed without Morgoth, and were easily scattered by their enemies. In the millennia after his defeat and banishment from Arda, they were without a leader and degenerated into small, quarrelsome tribes hiding in wild places, such as the [[Misty Mountains]] and the [[Mountains of Angmar]]. Orcs remained a threat to travelers and isolated settlements, and when united could pose a great regional threat, but they could never amount to the force they were under Morgoth. Only when Sauron returned to power did they begin to reclaim their old power. The same happened after Sauron's defeat by the [[Last Alliance of Elves and Men]]: only under the Witch-King's command, and when Sauron returned as the Necromancer of [[Mirkwood]], did the Orcs become a real danger for all of Middle-earth again. Orcs were warlike and often cruel, fighting with reckless ferocity and delighting in the slaughter and torture of their foes; many had a cowardly nature however, and were often regarded as inferior, though far more expendable, than the soldiers of Men, Elves, and Dwarves. It is said that Sauron, at the height of his power, had greater control over the Orcs than Morgoth had, though this was because he had not yet spent himself in dominating others as well as due to a lesser threat posed by his adversaries than those of his predecessor. Orcs also proved themselves adept at taming and riding [[Wolves]] and even [[Wargs]], an abillity harnessed by the Dark Lords for their armies.

===Lifespan===
It is unknown if the Orcs were immortal like the Elves. There is, in any case, a hint for a long lifespan in the story of two of the most famous Orc-chieftains: [[Azog]] and [[Bolg]]. Bolg, being the son of Azog, was the chieftain of the Orcs who attacked Erebor in the Battle of Five Armies in {{TA|2941}}. Azog himself was killed in the Battle of Azanulbizar in {{TA|2799}}, so Bolg was at least 150 years old.

===Appearance===
Orcs were described as smaller in stature than Men on average, strong but crooked in frame and bow-legged. One "huge orc-chieftain" was described as "almost Man-high", but some must have been of a similar size to Hobbits (Frodo and Sam succeeded in disguising themselves as Orcs in Mordor). Their overall appearance varied: they had long arms and fanged mouths; Tolkien describes them as "swart" or "sallow", although one in Mordor is "black-skinned" and others are described generally as "black" (possibly not a reference to skin colour).

===Kinds of orcs===
The Fellowship usually encountered the large soldier-Orcs bred for war, and sometimes the "snaga" variety which were more geared towards being labourers. Another type is referred to as "snufflers", smaller, black-skinned Orcs with wide nostrils, who excelled in tracking. Despite the smaller size, one snuffler was able to skillfully kill a soldier-orc when they got into a disagreement.<ref name="Cirith">{{RK|VI1}}</ref>

*[[Snaga]]
*[[Snufflers]]
*[[Orcs of Mordor]]
*[[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]]
*[[Half-orcs]] (and [[Goblin-men]])
*[[Uruk-hai]]
*[[Hobgoblins]]

[[File:Darek Zabrocki - Goblins.jpg|thumb|250px|''Goblins'' by [[:Category:Images by Darek Zabrocki|Darek Zabrocki]]]]

===Orcs and goblins===
The term ''goblin'' was used primarily in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' but also in ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' where it is used synonymously with "Orc".<ref>{{TT|III1}}</ref><ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. 24</ref>

"Goblin" is an English word, whereas "Orc" is Old English, the language used by Tolkien to represent Rohirric.<ref>{{App|F1iv}}</ref> Thus, there is no difference between Orcs and Goblins.

==Etymology==
{{quote|The word as far as I am concerned actually derived from [[Old English]] ''orc'', demon, but only because of its phonetic suitability.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]] in [[Letter 144]]}}
===Orc===
The word '''''Orc''''' is said to be the "''form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the [[Rohirric|language of Rohan]]''".<ref name=App|F1iv/>

In his late, post-''Lord of the Rings'' writings, Tolkien preferred the spelling '''''Ork'''''.<ref>{{HM|PM}}</ref>

It also is "supposed to be the CS[Common Speech] name of these creatures at that time"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>.

The statement may be ambiguous due to Tolkien's use of the term Common Speech for both Westron and English. But Tolkien continued to say "It should therefore according to the system be translated into E[English]. or the LT[Langauge of Translation]. It was translated 'goblin' in The H.[Hobbit]"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>. This may suggest it is a genuine Westron word, which Tolkien kept untranslated because he liked the sound of it: "In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be retained."<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>

Fictionally, it is then possibly derived from 'orch', the [[Sindarin]] word for Orc. The original sense of the word seems to be "bogey", "bogeyman", that is, something that provokes fear, as seen in the Quenya cognate ''urko'', pl. ''urqui''.<ref>{{HM|WJ}} Quendi and Eldar</ref>

Tolkien derived the word ''orc'' from [[Old English]] believing it refers to a kind of evil spirits,<ref name=L144/> which in turn is thought to derive from Latin ''Orcus'' "Hades", although Tolkien doubted this etymology.<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Gene Wolfe]]" (letter)</ref> He also thought it survives in the modern language for sea-beasts,<ref>{{HM|N}}, p. 762</ref> such as the [[Wikipedia:Orca Whale|Orca Whale]].

''Orc'' is an [[Old English]] word that refers mainly to a kind of metal cup (from Latin ''Urceus'').<ref group="note">The word ''Orc'' occurs twice in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]''.</ref> However, in an 11th century glossary, this entry was conflated with another entry which refers to evil giants such as ''[[Wikipedia:Jötunn|þyrs]]'' and other monsters, also glossed in Latin as ''Orcus''. This merge of the two entries made many philologists of the previous centuries, like Tolkien, to believe that ''Orc'' was an actual Old English word that refers to any kind of evil creature from the underworld.<ref>Bosworth and Toller's ''An Anglo-Saxon Dictionary'' (1898), corrected in later editions</ref>

The word ''Orcnéas'' is once found only in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]'' (lines 112-113) and is cited as an example of the word "Orc" in Old English text. Actually its meaning is not clear, and it is thought to refer to corpses (''néas'') from the Underworld.

==="Orcs" in Tolkien's languages===
Tolkien said that one of the reason of choosing "Orc" over "Goblin" was the similarity with his fictional languages.<ref name=WJAC>{{WJ|AC}}, pp. 389-91</ref> Indeed most [[Elvish]], [[Mannish]] and other words for Orc, are similar to the English word.

The basic [[Primitive Quendian]] [[Sundocarme|root]], from which the words for Orc derive, is [[RUKU]] (said to refer to any "bogey" that scared the Elves)<ref name=WJAC/>:

*[[Quenya]] '''''orco'''''<ref name=PE17_47/> (pl. '''''Orkor'''''<ref>{{GA|27}}, p. 12</ref><ref>{{HM|MR}}, pp. 74, 194</ref>); [[Exilic Quenya]] '''''urko''''' (pl. '''''orkor''''' and '''''orqui''''')<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Sindarin]]: '''''orch'''''/'''''Orch''''' (pl. '''''yrch'''''/'''''Yrch''''', class pl. '''''Orchoth'''''/'''''orchoth'''''<ref group="note">''Orchoth'' is likely a compound of ''orch'' + ''[[hoth]]''.</ref>)<ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144/><ref name=PE17_52-4/><ref name=PE17_47/><ref name=App|F1iv/>; '''''[[glamhoth]]'''''
*[[Nandorin]]: '''''ūriʃ'''''<ref name=PE17_52-4>{{PE|17}}, pp. 52-4</ref>

*[[Adûnaic]]: '''''urku''''', '''''urkhu'''''<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Westron]]: '''''orka'''''<ref name=PE17_47>{{PE|17}}, p. 47</ref>, possibly '''orc''' <ref>"Nomenclature in the Lord of the Rings" in {{HM|RC}}</ref>
*[[Black Speech]]: '''''[[Uruk-hai#Etymology|uruk]]'''''<ref name=App|F1iv>{{App|F1iv}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144>{{L|144}}</ref><ref name=PE17_47/>
*[[Khuzdul]]: '''''Rukhs''''' (pl. '''''Rakhās'''''), possibly derived from an unknown [[Avarin]] word of the same meaning<ref name=WJAC/><ref group="note">''Rukhs'' appears to contain the radical R-Kh-S.</ref>
*[[Drúadan language]]: '''''gorgûn''''' ("orc-folk"; the form ''gorgûn'' is perhaps plural of an unknown singular form)<ref name=PE17_99>{{PE|17}}, p. 99</ref><ref>{{RK|V5}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/>

In the earliest versions of [[Qenya]], Tolkien had words such as "'''Ork (orq-)''' pl. '''Orqi''' and fem. "'''orqindi'''".{{fact}}

In [[Noldorin]], the earlier version of Sindarin, the word for Orc is the same: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'').<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref><ref>{{MR|P3I7}}, p. 195</ref><ref>{{MC|Secret}}, p. 217</ref> The [[Gnomish]] word for "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin" is said to be '''''Gong'''''.<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

*''See also: [[Entish]] ''[[burárum]]''

===Goblin===
''[[Wiktionary:goblin|Goblin]]'' is a folk word which according to ''The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Current English'' is probably derived from the Anglo-French ''[[Wiktionary:gobelin|gobelin]]'' a diminutive of ''gobel'' (cf. ''[[Wiktionary:kobold|kobold]]''). William D.B. Loos notes that ''goblin'' is a Romance-derived word, unlike other Germanic words preferred by [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]].<ref>William D.B. Loos, [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/EnemyMisc.html#Orcs Enemies and Miscellaneous: What was the relationship between Orcs and Goblins?] at [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/ The Tolkien Frequently Asked Questions List] (accessed 3 July 2011)</ref>

==="Goblin" in Tolkien's languages===
In the [[The Etymologies|''Etymologies'']], the Elvish names used to translate "goblin" derive from root [[RUKU#Other versions|ÓROK]] and are:<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref>

*[[Quenya]]: '''''orko''''' (pl. '''''orqi''''')
*[[Noldorin]]: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'', archaic ''yrchy''<ref>{{VT|46a}}, p. 7</ref>)
*[[Nandorin|Danian]]: '''''urc''''' (pl. '''''yrc''''')
*[[Doriathrin]]: '''''urch''''' (pl. '''''urchin''''')

In an early linguistic writing, Tolkien translated the [[Gnomish]] word ''Gong'' as "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin."<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}

==Controversy==
Tolkien's Orcs have been a subject of criticism of [[racism]]. Tolkien described Orcs as "squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types".<ref>{{L|210}}</ref>

==Other writings==
In ''[[The Father Christmas Letters]]'', goblins appear as the enemies of [[Father Christmas]] and the [[Red Elves]].

==Portrayal in adaptations==
===Orcs===
{{stub}}<gallery>File: The Lord of the Rings (1978 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (1978 film)]]
File:The Return of the King (1980 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Return of the King (1980 film)|''The Return of the King'' (1980 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings- The Treason of Isengard - Ork.jpg|Concept art of an orc in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Treason of Isengard]]''
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Orc3.jpg|An Orc in [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''.</gallery>

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Orc-kind is a genus that includes the species of Orcs, Goblins, [[Hobgoblins]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Boggarts]], [[Bugans]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

:Orcs are very common in Middle-earth. They are about the size of a man with a hunchback, though some of the sub-races are of larger or smaller stature.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Orcs are first seen in [[Fornost]], where they immediately attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] as they near the citadel.<ref name=Main>[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]], Chapter 1: Fornost, ''Main Gate''</ref> ''Orc warriors'' are stronger then normal Orcs. Some Orcs have been taught [[Magic|sorcery]] by [[Agandaûr]], these are known as ''Orc Sorcerers''.

===Goblins===
<gallery>File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1977 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Goblins1.jpg|Goblins in the pits of [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''
File:The Hobbit - An Unexpected Journey - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in ''[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]''</gallery>

'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War of the Ring]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2006: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-earth II]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Goblins are a separate race and can be found in [[Evendim]], [[the Shire]], [[Ered Luin]], [[Bree-land]], [[Lone-lands]], [[North Downs]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]] and [[Moria]]. They are small in stature; a little shorter than [[Hobbits]]. In contrast, Orcs are about the size of [[Men]]. Goblins are also weaker than the orcs.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Goblins first appear in [[Fornost Erain]], where they attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] immediately when they reach the city.<ref name=Main></ref> Goblins are weaker than Orcs.

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:Goblins are again made clearly distinct from Orcs in the film series. They are lesser relatives of Orcs; they are smaller (the very large Great Goblin notwithstanding), less powerful, and generally have pale, diseased skin, riddled with warts.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:A band of "Goblin mercenaries" appear on [[Ravenhill]] during the [[Battle of Five Armies]], but are taken care of by the Dwarves without much trouble.

==See also==
*[[Gongs]]
*[[:Category:Images of Goblins|Images of Goblins]]

{{references|note}}
[[Category:Orcs| ]]
[[Category:Races]]
[[Category:Servants of Melkor]]
[[Category:Servants of Saruman]]
[[Category:Servants of Sauron]]
[[de:Orks]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/orques/orques]]
[[fi:Örkit]]

Orcs

2021-04-22T02:48:40Z

Trahald: /* "Orcs" in Tolkien's languages */

{{rewrite}}{{sources}}
{{race infobox
| name=Orcs
| image=[[File:John Howe - In Mordor.jpg|250px]]
| caption="In Mordor" by [[John Howe]]
| pronun=
| othernames=Goblins, [[Glamhoth]], [[Yrch]]
| origin=Obscure, but apparently bred from [[Elves]] or [[Men]]
| location=[[Utumno]], [[Angband]], [[Mordor]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]], [[Mount Gundabad]], [[High Pass]], [[Dol Guldur]], [[Isengard]]
| affiliation=[[Morgoth]], [[Sauron]]
| rivalry=[[Elves]], [[Men]], [[Dwarves]]
| language=[[Black Speech]]; numerous [[Orkish]] languages; [[Westron]]
| people=[[Uruk-hai]], [[Goblin-men]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Hobgoblins]], [[Orcs of Mordor|Mordor Orcs]], [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains|Misty Mountain Orcs]]
| members=[[Othrod]], [[Azog]], [[Bolg]], [[Gorbag]], [[Great Goblin]], [[Grishnákh]]
| lifespan=Unknown
| distinctions=Evil footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Evil]]; preferred darkness
| height=Short<ref>{{FR|II5}} The "huge" orc-chieftain is described as "almost man high"</ref>
| hair=
| skin=Sallow, green, brown, grey, black, swarthy
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
'''Orcs''' (also called '''[[Orcs#Orcs and goblins|Goblins]]''') were the footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Dark Lords]] - [[Morgoth]] and [[Sauron]].

==History==
===Origins and early years===
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}
The Orcs were bred by [[Melkor]] in mockery of the [[Elves]], sometime during the [[The Darkness#The Great Darkness|Great Darkness]].<ref>{{S|3}}</ref><ref>{{TT|III4}}</ref> How this was done is unclear, as the Dark Lord did not possess the power to create life, only to corrupt it. It is unknown whether corrupted Elves, [[Men]] or other creatures were used to achieve this.

[[File:John Howe - Orc Swordsman.jpg|thumb|200px|right|''Orc Swordsman'' by [[John Howe]]]]

It is unclear exactly when Orcs were created, but it certainly happened before the [[Battle of the Powers]] in his stronghold of Utumno. Whether the Orcs were at this time a capable fighting force against the host of Valinor is not known. But at least some of them survived this war, probably hidden in the deep vaults of [[Angband]], and multiplied, waiting for their master.

They first came out of Angband in {{YT|1330}}, passing over the mountains to [[Beleriand]] with other dark creatures.<ref>{{GA|26-27}}</ref>

When Melkor (now known as [[Morgoth]]) returned to Middle-earth, he created new hordes of Orcs and invaded [[Beleriand]], where the [[First Battle of Beleriand]] took place. Orcs also fought in [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]].

===First Age===
Orcs appear in the [[First Age]] as the core force of [[Morgoth]]. Hundreds of thousands of Orcs were bred in [[Angband]] to participate in the [[Battles of Beleriand]], which lasted 587 years.

Orcs first appear in the [[First Age]] in the [[Battle of the Lammoth]], where they were defeated by [[Fingolfin]] and his [[Noldor]]. Orcs participated in battles such as the [[Dagor Aglareb]], [[Dagor Bragollach]], [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]], [[Fall of the Falas]], and finally in the [[War of Wrath]], where they were almost extinguished. Those that survived the defeat fled eastwards and hid probably in the Mountains of [[Angmar]] and the [[Ered Mithrin]].

===Second Age===
Around the year {{SA|1000}} Sauron reappeared, took the land of [[Mordor]] as his realm and started the construction of [[Barad-dûr]]. It is likely that most of his servants were Orcs at this time that he had gathered under his command. Still for a long time Sauron's foul servants did not play an important role, for the Dark Lord had chosen a more subtle way to overthrow the free people by creating the [[Rings of Power]].

During the [[War of the Elves and Sauron]], in {{SA|1700}}, Orcs formed the main power of Sauron's host. Despite the immeasurable number of Orcs, Sauron was defeated by the united hosts of Elves and [[Númenóreans]]. Still Sauron was powerful east of the [[Misty Mountains]] and the Orcs that inhabited the mountains and the eastern lands multiplied.

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]] started a war against the [[Dwarves]], resulting in the [[First Sack of Gundabad]] and its occupation by the Orcs. Finally, Orcs were the core force of [[Sauron]] during the [[War of the Last Alliance]], and fought in great battles such as the [[Battle of Dagorlad]] and the [[Siege of Barad-dûr]].

===Third Age===
[[File:Richard Sullivan - Orc.jpg|thumb|left|''Orc'' by [[:Category:Images by Richard Sullivan|Richard Sullivan]]]]
During the [[Third Age]], Orcs were the standard troops of [[Sauron]] (both in [[Mordor]] and in [[Dol Guldur]]), and his great servants - such as the [[Witch-king]] and [[Saruman]].

In [[Angmar]], Orcs fought for the Witch-king in the [[Angmar War]]. Years later, they invaded [[Eriador]] under the leadership of the [[Necromancer]].

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]], one of the few (more or less) independent Orcish societies, and their leader [[Azog]] started out the [[War of the Dwarves and Orcs]], and after their defeat they retreated in their caves. They appeared again in {{TA|2941}}, when the [[Battle of Five Armies]] took place, suffering yet another terrible loss.

In his efforts to hinder the people of [[Rohan]], Saruman began to gather Orcs from the Mountains for his army in [[Isengard]], experimenting on them to fashion himself greater soldiers such as [[Half-orcs]], [[Goblin-men]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

The [[Orcs of Mordor]] fought in major battles during the [[War of the Ring]], such as the [[Battle of the Pelennor Fields]], but the majority of [[Mordor]]'s forces were destroyed or scattered at the [[Battle of the Morannon]]. Sporadic fighting in the following weeks led to the Orcs finally being driven out of the western end of Mordor, though it is unclear how many Orcs Sauron had in his armies, and it is also unclear how many survived after his defeat.

The Orcs in [[Dol Guldur]] remained in [[Mirkwood]] until the [[Fall of Dol Guldur]], one of the last battles of the War of the Ring.

===Fourth Age and beyond===
The fate of the Orcs after the Third Age is unknown. Though many of Sauron's Orcs fought on and were slain in the weeks following the Battle of the Morannon, the true number of Sauron's hosts is unclear, as are the numbers of Orcs not within Mordor that may still inhabit the rest of Middle-earth. It is at least known that the Orcs of Moria either fled or were slain by the Fourth Age, as it is mentioned that the Dwarves managed to retake Moria and the mines within it.

==Characteristics==

===Culture===
It is certain all Orcs were dependent on the Dark Lords in various ways: after the War of Wrath, the Orcs were confused and dismayed without Morgoth, and were easily scattered by their enemies. In the millennia after his defeat and banishment from Arda, they were without a leader and degenerated into small, quarrelsome tribes hiding in wild places, such as the [[Misty Mountains]] and the [[Mountains of Angmar]]. Orcs remained a threat to travelers and isolated settlements, and when united could pose a great regional threat, but they could never amount to the force they were under Morgoth. Only when Sauron returned to power did they begin to reclaim their old power. The same happened after Sauron's defeat by the [[Last Alliance of Elves and Men]]: only under the Witch-King's command, and when Sauron returned as the Necromancer of [[Mirkwood]], did the Orcs become a real danger for all of Middle-earth again. Orcs were warlike and often cruel, fighting with reckless ferocity and delighting in the slaughter and torture of their foes; many had a cowardly nature however, and were often regarded as inferior, though far more expendable, than the soldiers of Men, Elves, and Dwarves. It is said that Sauron, at the height of his power, had greater control over the Orcs than Morgoth had, though this was because he had not yet spent himself in dominating others as well as due to a lesser threat posed by his adversaries than those of his predecessor. Orcs also proved themselves adept at taming and riding [[Wolves]] and even [[Wargs]], an abillity harnessed by the Dark Lords for their armies.

===Lifespan===
It is unknown if the Orcs were immortal like the Elves. There is, in any case, a hint for a long lifespan in the story of two of the most famous Orc-chieftains: [[Azog]] and [[Bolg]]. Bolg, being the son of Azog, was the chieftain of the Orcs who attacked Erebor in the Battle of Five Armies in {{TA|2941}}. Azog himself was killed in the Battle of Azanulbizar in {{TA|2799}}, so Bolg was at least 150 years old.

===Appearance===
Orcs were described as smaller in stature than Men on average, strong but crooked in frame and bow-legged. One "huge orc-chieftain" was described as "almost Man-high", but some must have been of a similar size to Hobbits (Frodo and Sam succeeded in disguising themselves as Orcs in Mordor). Their overall appearance varied: they had long arms and fanged mouths; Tolkien describes them as "swart" or "sallow", although one in Mordor is "black-skinned" and others are described generally as "black" (possibly not a reference to skin colour).

===Kinds of orcs===
The Fellowship usually encountered the large soldier-Orcs bred for war, and sometimes the "snaga" variety which were more geared towards being labourers. Another type is referred to as "snufflers", smaller, black-skinned Orcs with wide nostrils, who excelled in tracking. Despite the smaller size, one snuffler was able to skillfully kill a soldier-orc when they got into a disagreement.<ref name="Cirith">{{RK|VI1}}</ref>

*[[Snaga]]
*[[Snufflers]]
*[[Orcs of Mordor]]
*[[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]]
*[[Half-orcs]] (and [[Goblin-men]])
*[[Uruk-hai]]
*[[Hobgoblins]]

[[File:Darek Zabrocki - Goblins.jpg|thumb|250px|''Goblins'' by [[:Category:Images by Darek Zabrocki|Darek Zabrocki]]]]

===Orcs and goblins===
The term ''goblin'' was used primarily in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' but also in ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' where it is used synonymously with "Orc".<ref>{{TT|III1}}</ref><ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. 24</ref>

"Goblin" is an English word, whereas "Orc" is Old English, the language used by Tolkien to represent Rohirric.<ref>{{App|F1iv}}</ref> Thus, there is no difference between Orcs and Goblins.

==Etymology==
{{quote|The word as far as I am concerned actually derived from [[Old English]] ''orc'', demon, but only because of its phonetic suitability.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]] in [[Letter 144]]}}
===Orc===
The word '''''Orc''''' is said to be the "''form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the [[Rohirric|language of Rohan]]''".<ref name=App|F1iv/>

In his late, post-''Lord of the Rings'' writings, Tolkien preferred the spelling '''''Ork'''''.<ref>{{HM|PM}}</ref>

It also is "supposed to be the CS[Common Speech] name of these creatures at that time"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>.

The statement may be ambiguous due to Tolkien's use of the term Common Speech for both Westron and English. But Tolkien continued to say "It should therefore according to the system be translated into E[English]. or the LT[Langauge of Translation]. It was translated 'goblin' in The H.[Hobbit]"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>. This may suggest it is a genuine Westron word, which Tolkien kept untranslated because he liked the sound of it: "In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be retained."<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>

Fictionally, it is then possibly derived from 'orch', the [[Sindarin]] word for Orc. The original sense of the word seems to be "bogey", "bogeyman", that is, something that provokes fear, as seen in the Quenya cognate ''urko'', pl. ''urqui''.<ref>{{HM|WJ}} Quendi and Eldar</ref>

Tolkien derived the word ''orc'' from [[Old English]] believing it refers to a kind of evil spirits,<ref name=L144/> which in turn is thought to derive from Latin ''Orcus'' "Hades", although Tolkien doubted this etymology.<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Gene Wolfe]]" (letter)</ref> He also thought it survives in the modern language for sea-beasts,<ref>{{HM|N}}, p. 762</ref> such as the [[Wikipedia:Orca Whale|Orca Whale]].

''Orc'' is an [[Old English]] word that refers mainly to a kind of metal cup (from Latin ''Urceus'').<ref group="note">The word ''Orc'' occurs twice in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]''.</ref> However, in an 11th century glossary, this entry was conflated with another entry which refers to evil giants such as ''[[Wikipedia:Jötunn|þyrs]]'' and other monsters, also glossed in Latin as ''Orcus''. This merge of the two entries made many philologists of the previous centuries, like Tolkien, to believe that ''Orc'' was an actual Old English word that refers to any kind of evil creature from the underworld.<ref>Bosworth and Toller's ''An Anglo-Saxon Dictionary'' (1898), corrected in later editions</ref>

The word ''Orcnéas'' is once found only in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]'' (lines 112-113) and is cited as an example of the word "Orc" in Old English text. Actually its meaning is not clear, and it is thought to refer to corpses (''néas'') from the Underworld.

==="Orcs" in Tolkien's languages===
Tolkien said that one of the reason of choosing "Orc" over "Goblin" was the similarity with his fictional languages.<ref name=WJAC>{{WJ|AC}}, pp. 389-91</ref> Indeed most [[Elvish]], [[Mannish]] and other words for Orc, are similar to the English word.

The basic [[Primitive Quendian]] [[Sundocarme|root]], from which the words for Orc derive, is [[RUKU]] (said to refer to any "bogey" that scared the Elves)<ref name=WJAC/>:

*[[Quenya]] '''''orco'''''<ref name=PE17_47/> (pl. '''''Orkor'''''<ref>{{GA|27}}, p. 12</ref><ref>{{HM|MR}}, pp. 74, 194</ref>); [[Exilic Quenya]] '''''urko''''' (pl. '''''orkor''''' and '''''orqui''''')<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Sindarin]]: '''''orch'''''/'''''Orch''''' (pl. '''''yrch'''''/'''''Yrch''''', class pl. '''''Orchoth'''''/'''''orchoth'''''<ref group="note">''Orchoth'' is likely a compound of ''orch'' + ''[[hoth]]''.</ref>)<ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144/><ref name=PE17_52-4/><ref name=PE17_47/><ref name=App|F1iv/>; '''''[[glamhoth]]'''''
*[[Nandorin]]: '''''ūriʃ'''''<ref name=PE17_52-4>{{PE|17}}, pp. 52-4</ref>

*[[Adûnaic]]: '''''urku''''', '''''urkhu'''''<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Westron]]: '''''orka'''''<ref name=PE17_47>{{PE|17}}, p. 47</ref>, possibly '''orc''' <ref>"Nomenclature in the Lord of the Rings" in{{HM|RC}}</ref>
*[[Black Speech]]: '''''[[Uruk-hai#Etymology|uruk]]'''''<ref name=App|F1iv>{{App|F1iv}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144>{{L|144}}</ref><ref name=PE17_47/>
*[[Khuzdul]]: '''''Rukhs''''' (pl. '''''Rakhās'''''), possibly derived from an unknown [[Avarin]] word of the same meaning<ref name=WJAC/><ref group="note">''Rukhs'' appears to contain the radical R-Kh-S.</ref>
*[[Drúadan language]]: '''''gorgûn''''' ("orc-folk"; the form ''gorgûn'' is perhaps plural of an unknown singular form)<ref name=PE17_99>{{PE|17}}, p. 99</ref><ref>{{RK|V5}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/>

In the earliest versions of [[Qenya]], Tolkien had words such as "'''Ork (orq-)''' pl. '''Orqi''' and fem. "'''orqindi'''".{{fact}}

In [[Noldorin]], the earlier version of Sindarin, the word for Orc is the same: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'').<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref><ref>{{MR|P3I7}}, p. 195</ref><ref>{{MC|Secret}}, p. 217</ref> The [[Gnomish]] word for "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin" is said to be '''''Gong'''''.<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

*''See also: [[Entish]] ''[[burárum]]''

===Goblin===
''[[Wiktionary:goblin|Goblin]]'' is a folk word which according to ''The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Current English'' is probably derived from the Anglo-French ''[[Wiktionary:gobelin|gobelin]]'' a diminutive of ''gobel'' (cf. ''[[Wiktionary:kobold|kobold]]''). William D.B. Loos notes that ''goblin'' is a Romance-derived word, unlike other Germanic words preferred by [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]].<ref>William D.B. Loos, [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/EnemyMisc.html#Orcs Enemies and Miscellaneous: What was the relationship between Orcs and Goblins?] at [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/ The Tolkien Frequently Asked Questions List] (accessed 3 July 2011)</ref>

==="Goblin" in Tolkien's languages===
In the [[The Etymologies|''Etymologies'']], the Elvish names used to translate "goblin" derive from root [[RUKU#Other versions|ÓROK]] and are:<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref>

*[[Quenya]]: '''''orko''''' (pl. '''''orqi''''')
*[[Noldorin]]: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'', archaic ''yrchy''<ref>{{VT|46a}}, p. 7</ref>)
*[[Nandorin|Danian]]: '''''urc''''' (pl. '''''yrc''''')
*[[Doriathrin]]: '''''urch''''' (pl. '''''urchin''''')

In an early linguistic writing, Tolkien translated the [[Gnomish]] word ''Gong'' as "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin."<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}

==Controversy==
Tolkien's Orcs have been a subject of criticism of [[racism]]. Tolkien described Orcs as "squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types".<ref>{{L|210}}</ref>

==Other writings==
In ''[[The Father Christmas Letters]]'', goblins appear as the enemies of [[Father Christmas]] and the [[Red Elves]].

==Portrayal in adaptations==
===Orcs===
{{stub}}<gallery>File: The Lord of the Rings (1978 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (1978 film)]]
File:The Return of the King (1980 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Return of the King (1980 film)|''The Return of the King'' (1980 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings- The Treason of Isengard - Ork.jpg|Concept art of an orc in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Treason of Isengard]]''
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Orc3.jpg|An Orc in [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''.</gallery>

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Orc-kind is a genus that includes the species of Orcs, Goblins, [[Hobgoblins]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Boggarts]], [[Bugans]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

:Orcs are very common in Middle-earth. They are about the size of a man with a hunchback, though some of the sub-races are of larger or smaller stature.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Orcs are first seen in [[Fornost]], where they immediately attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] as they near the citadel.<ref name=Main>[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]], Chapter 1: Fornost, ''Main Gate''</ref> ''Orc warriors'' are stronger then normal Orcs. Some Orcs have been taught [[Magic|sorcery]] by [[Agandaûr]], these are known as ''Orc Sorcerers''.

===Goblins===
<gallery>File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1977 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Goblins1.jpg|Goblins in the pits of [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''
File:The Hobbit - An Unexpected Journey - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in ''[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]''</gallery>

'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War of the Ring]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2006: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-earth II]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Goblins are a separate race and can be found in [[Evendim]], [[the Shire]], [[Ered Luin]], [[Bree-land]], [[Lone-lands]], [[North Downs]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]] and [[Moria]]. They are small in stature; a little shorter than [[Hobbits]]. In contrast, Orcs are about the size of [[Men]]. Goblins are also weaker than the orcs.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Goblins first appear in [[Fornost Erain]], where they attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] immediately when they reach the city.<ref name=Main></ref> Goblins are weaker than Orcs.

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:Goblins are again made clearly distinct from Orcs in the film series. They are lesser relatives of Orcs; they are smaller (the very large Great Goblin notwithstanding), less powerful, and generally have pale, diseased skin, riddled with warts.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:A band of "Goblin mercenaries" appear on [[Ravenhill]] during the [[Battle of Five Armies]], but are taken care of by the Dwarves without much trouble.

==See also==
*[[Gongs]]
*[[:Category:Images of Goblins|Images of Goblins]]

{{references|note}}
[[Category:Orcs| ]]
[[Category:Races]]
[[Category:Servants of Melkor]]
[[Category:Servants of Saruman]]
[[Category:Servants of Sauron]]
[[de:Orks]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/orques/orques]]
[[fi:Örkit]]

Orcs

2021-04-22T02:44:22Z

Trahald: /* "Orcs" in Tolkien's languages */

{{rewrite}}{{sources}}
{{race infobox
| name=Orcs
| image=[[File:John Howe - In Mordor.jpg|250px]]
| caption="In Mordor" by [[John Howe]]
| pronun=
| othernames=Goblins, [[Glamhoth]], [[Yrch]]
| origin=Obscure, but apparently bred from [[Elves]] or [[Men]]
| location=[[Utumno]], [[Angband]], [[Mordor]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]], [[Mount Gundabad]], [[High Pass]], [[Dol Guldur]], [[Isengard]]
| affiliation=[[Morgoth]], [[Sauron]]
| rivalry=[[Elves]], [[Men]], [[Dwarves]]
| language=[[Black Speech]]; numerous [[Orkish]] languages; [[Westron]]
| people=[[Uruk-hai]], [[Goblin-men]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Hobgoblins]], [[Orcs of Mordor|Mordor Orcs]], [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains|Misty Mountain Orcs]]
| members=[[Othrod]], [[Azog]], [[Bolg]], [[Gorbag]], [[Great Goblin]], [[Grishnákh]]
| lifespan=Unknown
| distinctions=Evil footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Evil]]; preferred darkness
| height=Short<ref>{{FR|II5}} The "huge" orc-chieftain is described as "almost man high"</ref>
| hair=
| skin=Sallow, green, brown, grey, black, swarthy
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
'''Orcs''' (also called '''[[Orcs#Orcs and goblins|Goblins]]''') were the footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Dark Lords]] - [[Morgoth]] and [[Sauron]].

==History==
===Origins and early years===
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}
The Orcs were bred by [[Melkor]] in mockery of the [[Elves]], sometime during the [[The Darkness#The Great Darkness|Great Darkness]].<ref>{{S|3}}</ref><ref>{{TT|III4}}</ref> How this was done is unclear, as the Dark Lord did not possess the power to create life, only to corrupt it. It is unknown whether corrupted Elves, [[Men]] or other creatures were used to achieve this.

[[File:John Howe - Orc Swordsman.jpg|thumb|200px|right|''Orc Swordsman'' by [[John Howe]]]]

It is unclear exactly when Orcs were created, but it certainly happened before the [[Battle of the Powers]] in his stronghold of Utumno. Whether the Orcs were at this time a capable fighting force against the host of Valinor is not known. But at least some of them survived this war, probably hidden in the deep vaults of [[Angband]], and multiplied, waiting for their master.

They first came out of Angband in {{YT|1330}}, passing over the mountains to [[Beleriand]] with other dark creatures.<ref>{{GA|26-27}}</ref>

When Melkor (now known as [[Morgoth]]) returned to Middle-earth, he created new hordes of Orcs and invaded [[Beleriand]], where the [[First Battle of Beleriand]] took place. Orcs also fought in [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]].

===First Age===
Orcs appear in the [[First Age]] as the core force of [[Morgoth]]. Hundreds of thousands of Orcs were bred in [[Angband]] to participate in the [[Battles of Beleriand]], which lasted 587 years.

Orcs first appear in the [[First Age]] in the [[Battle of the Lammoth]], where they were defeated by [[Fingolfin]] and his [[Noldor]]. Orcs participated in battles such as the [[Dagor Aglareb]], [[Dagor Bragollach]], [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]], [[Fall of the Falas]], and finally in the [[War of Wrath]], where they were almost extinguished. Those that survived the defeat fled eastwards and hid probably in the Mountains of [[Angmar]] and the [[Ered Mithrin]].

===Second Age===
Around the year {{SA|1000}} Sauron reappeared, took the land of [[Mordor]] as his realm and started the construction of [[Barad-dûr]]. It is likely that most of his servants were Orcs at this time that he had gathered under his command. Still for a long time Sauron's foul servants did not play an important role, for the Dark Lord had chosen a more subtle way to overthrow the free people by creating the [[Rings of Power]].

During the [[War of the Elves and Sauron]], in {{SA|1700}}, Orcs formed the main power of Sauron's host. Despite the immeasurable number of Orcs, Sauron was defeated by the united hosts of Elves and [[Númenóreans]]. Still Sauron was powerful east of the [[Misty Mountains]] and the Orcs that inhabited the mountains and the eastern lands multiplied.

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]] started a war against the [[Dwarves]], resulting in the [[First Sack of Gundabad]] and its occupation by the Orcs. Finally, Orcs were the core force of [[Sauron]] during the [[War of the Last Alliance]], and fought in great battles such as the [[Battle of Dagorlad]] and the [[Siege of Barad-dûr]].

===Third Age===
[[File:Richard Sullivan - Orc.jpg|thumb|left|''Orc'' by [[:Category:Images by Richard Sullivan|Richard Sullivan]]]]
During the [[Third Age]], Orcs were the standard troops of [[Sauron]] (both in [[Mordor]] and in [[Dol Guldur]]), and his great servants - such as the [[Witch-king]] and [[Saruman]].

In [[Angmar]], Orcs fought for the Witch-king in the [[Angmar War]]. Years later, they invaded [[Eriador]] under the leadership of the [[Necromancer]].

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]], one of the few (more or less) independent Orcish societies, and their leader [[Azog]] started out the [[War of the Dwarves and Orcs]], and after their defeat they retreated in their caves. They appeared again in {{TA|2941}}, when the [[Battle of Five Armies]] took place, suffering yet another terrible loss.

In his efforts to hinder the people of [[Rohan]], Saruman began to gather Orcs from the Mountains for his army in [[Isengard]], experimenting on them to fashion himself greater soldiers such as [[Half-orcs]], [[Goblin-men]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

The [[Orcs of Mordor]] fought in major battles during the [[War of the Ring]], such as the [[Battle of the Pelennor Fields]], but the majority of [[Mordor]]'s forces were destroyed or scattered at the [[Battle of the Morannon]]. Sporadic fighting in the following weeks led to the Orcs finally being driven out of the western end of Mordor, though it is unclear how many Orcs Sauron had in his armies, and it is also unclear how many survived after his defeat.

The Orcs in [[Dol Guldur]] remained in [[Mirkwood]] until the [[Fall of Dol Guldur]], one of the last battles of the War of the Ring.

===Fourth Age and beyond===
The fate of the Orcs after the Third Age is unknown. Though many of Sauron's Orcs fought on and were slain in the weeks following the Battle of the Morannon, the true number of Sauron's hosts is unclear, as are the numbers of Orcs not within Mordor that may still inhabit the rest of Middle-earth. It is at least known that the Orcs of Moria either fled or were slain by the Fourth Age, as it is mentioned that the Dwarves managed to retake Moria and the mines within it.

==Characteristics==

===Culture===
It is certain all Orcs were dependent on the Dark Lords in various ways: after the War of Wrath, the Orcs were confused and dismayed without Morgoth, and were easily scattered by their enemies. In the millennia after his defeat and banishment from Arda, they were without a leader and degenerated into small, quarrelsome tribes hiding in wild places, such as the [[Misty Mountains]] and the [[Mountains of Angmar]]. Orcs remained a threat to travelers and isolated settlements, and when united could pose a great regional threat, but they could never amount to the force they were under Morgoth. Only when Sauron returned to power did they begin to reclaim their old power. The same happened after Sauron's defeat by the [[Last Alliance of Elves and Men]]: only under the Witch-King's command, and when Sauron returned as the Necromancer of [[Mirkwood]], did the Orcs become a real danger for all of Middle-earth again. Orcs were warlike and often cruel, fighting with reckless ferocity and delighting in the slaughter and torture of their foes; many had a cowardly nature however, and were often regarded as inferior, though far more expendable, than the soldiers of Men, Elves, and Dwarves. It is said that Sauron, at the height of his power, had greater control over the Orcs than Morgoth had, though this was because he had not yet spent himself in dominating others as well as due to a lesser threat posed by his adversaries than those of his predecessor. Orcs also proved themselves adept at taming and riding [[Wolves]] and even [[Wargs]], an abillity harnessed by the Dark Lords for their armies.

===Lifespan===
It is unknown if the Orcs were immortal like the Elves. There is, in any case, a hint for a long lifespan in the story of two of the most famous Orc-chieftains: [[Azog]] and [[Bolg]]. Bolg, being the son of Azog, was the chieftain of the Orcs who attacked Erebor in the Battle of Five Armies in {{TA|2941}}. Azog himself was killed in the Battle of Azanulbizar in {{TA|2799}}, so Bolg was at least 150 years old.

===Appearance===
Orcs were described as smaller in stature than Men on average, strong but crooked in frame and bow-legged. One "huge orc-chieftain" was described as "almost Man-high", but some must have been of a similar size to Hobbits (Frodo and Sam succeeded in disguising themselves as Orcs in Mordor). Their overall appearance varied: they had long arms and fanged mouths; Tolkien describes them as "swart" or "sallow", although one in Mordor is "black-skinned" and others are described generally as "black" (possibly not a reference to skin colour).

===Kinds of orcs===
The Fellowship usually encountered the large soldier-Orcs bred for war, and sometimes the "snaga" variety which were more geared towards being labourers. Another type is referred to as "snufflers", smaller, black-skinned Orcs with wide nostrils, who excelled in tracking. Despite the smaller size, one snuffler was able to skillfully kill a soldier-orc when they got into a disagreement.<ref name="Cirith">{{RK|VI1}}</ref>

*[[Snaga]]
*[[Snufflers]]
*[[Orcs of Mordor]]
*[[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]]
*[[Half-orcs]] (and [[Goblin-men]])
*[[Uruk-hai]]
*[[Hobgoblins]]

[[File:Darek Zabrocki - Goblins.jpg|thumb|250px|''Goblins'' by [[:Category:Images by Darek Zabrocki|Darek Zabrocki]]]]

===Orcs and goblins===
The term ''goblin'' was used primarily in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' but also in ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' where it is used synonymously with "Orc".<ref>{{TT|III1}}</ref><ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. 24</ref>

"Goblin" is an English word, whereas "Orc" is Old English, the language used by Tolkien to represent Rohirric.<ref>{{App|F1iv}}</ref> Thus, there is no difference between Orcs and Goblins.

==Etymology==
{{quote|The word as far as I am concerned actually derived from [[Old English]] ''orc'', demon, but only because of its phonetic suitability.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]] in [[Letter 144]]}}
===Orc===
The word '''''Orc''''' is said to be the "''form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the [[Rohirric|language of Rohan]]''".<ref name=App|F1iv/>

In his late, post-''Lord of the Rings'' writings, Tolkien preferred the spelling '''''Ork'''''.<ref>{{HM|PM}}</ref>

It also is "supposed to be the CS[Common Speech] name of these creatures at that time"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>.

The statement may be ambiguous due to Tolkien's use of the term Common Speech for both Westron and English. But Tolkien continued to say "It should therefore according to the system be translated into E[English]. or the LT[Langauge of Translation]. It was translated 'goblin' in The H.[Hobbit]"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>. This may suggest it is a genuine Westron word, which Tolkien kept untranslated because he liked the sound of it: "In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be retained."<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>

Fictionally, it is then possibly derived from 'orch', the [[Sindarin]] word for Orc. The original sense of the word seems to be "bogey", "bogeyman", that is, something that provokes fear, as seen in the Quenya cognate ''urko'', pl. ''urqui''.<ref>{{HM|WJ}} Quendi and Eldar</ref>

Tolkien derived the word ''orc'' from [[Old English]] believing it refers to a kind of evil spirits,<ref name=L144/> which in turn is thought to derive from Latin ''Orcus'' "Hades", although Tolkien doubted this etymology.<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Gene Wolfe]]" (letter)</ref> He also thought it survives in the modern language for sea-beasts,<ref>{{HM|N}}, p. 762</ref> such as the [[Wikipedia:Orca Whale|Orca Whale]].

''Orc'' is an [[Old English]] word that refers mainly to a kind of metal cup (from Latin ''Urceus'').<ref group="note">The word ''Orc'' occurs twice in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]''.</ref> However, in an 11th century glossary, this entry was conflated with another entry which refers to evil giants such as ''[[Wikipedia:Jötunn|þyrs]]'' and other monsters, also glossed in Latin as ''Orcus''. This merge of the two entries made many philologists of the previous centuries, like Tolkien, to believe that ''Orc'' was an actual Old English word that refers to any kind of evil creature from the underworld.<ref>Bosworth and Toller's ''An Anglo-Saxon Dictionary'' (1898), corrected in later editions</ref>

The word ''Orcnéas'' is once found only in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]'' (lines 112-113) and is cited as an example of the word "Orc" in Old English text. Actually its meaning is not clear, and it is thought to refer to corpses (''néas'') from the Underworld.

==="Orcs" in Tolkien's languages===
Tolkien said that one of the reason of choosing "Orc" over "Goblin" was the similarity with his fictional languages.<ref name=WJAC>{{WJ|AC}}, pp. 389-91</ref> Indeed most [[Elvish]], [[Mannish]] and other words for Orc, are similar to the English word.

The basic [[Primitive Quendian]] [[Sundocarme|root]], from which the words for Orc derive, is [[RUKU]] (said to refer to any "bogey" that scared the Elves)<ref name=WJAC/>:

*[[Quenya]] '''''orco'''''<ref name=PE17_47/> (pl. '''''Orkor'''''<ref>{{GA|27}}, p. 12</ref><ref>{{HM|MR}}, pp. 74, 194</ref>); [[Exilic Quenya]] '''''urko''''' (pl. '''''orkor''''' and '''''orqui''''')<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Sindarin]]: '''''orch'''''/'''''Orch''''' (pl. '''''yrch'''''/'''''Yrch''''', class pl. '''''Orchoth'''''/'''''orchoth'''''<ref group="note">''Orchoth'' is likely a compound of ''orch'' + ''[[hoth]]''.</ref>)<ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144/><ref name=PE17_52-4/><ref name=PE17_47/><ref name=App|F1iv/>; '''''[[glamhoth]]'''''
*[[Nandorin]]: '''''ūriʃ'''''<ref name=PE17_52-4>{{PE|17}}, pp. 52-4</ref>

*[[Adûnaic]]: '''''urku''''', '''''urkhu'''''<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Westron]]: '''''orka'''''<ref name=PE17_47>{{PE|17}}, p. 47</ref>, possibly '''orc''' <ref>{{HM|RC}} Guide to the Names</ref>
*[[Black Speech]]: '''''[[Uruk-hai#Etymology|uruk]]'''''<ref name=App|F1iv>{{App|F1iv}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144>{{L|144}}</ref><ref name=PE17_47/>
*[[Khuzdul]]: '''''Rukhs''''' (pl. '''''Rakhās'''''), possibly derived from an unknown [[Avarin]] word of the same meaning<ref name=WJAC/><ref group="note">''Rukhs'' appears to contain the radical R-Kh-S.</ref>
*[[Drúadan language]]: '''''gorgûn''''' ("orc-folk"; the form ''gorgûn'' is perhaps plural of an unknown singular form)<ref name=PE17_99>{{PE|17}}, p. 99</ref><ref>{{RK|V5}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/>

In the earliest versions of [[Qenya]], Tolkien had words such as "'''Ork (orq-)''' pl. '''Orqi''' and fem. "'''orqindi'''".{{fact}}

In [[Noldorin]], the earlier version of Sindarin, the word for Orc is the same: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'').<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref><ref>{{MR|P3I7}}, p. 195</ref><ref>{{MC|Secret}}, p. 217</ref> The [[Gnomish]] word for "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin" is said to be '''''Gong'''''.<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

*''See also: [[Entish]] ''[[burárum]]''

===Goblin===
''[[Wiktionary:goblin|Goblin]]'' is a folk word which according to ''The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Current English'' is probably derived from the Anglo-French ''[[Wiktionary:gobelin|gobelin]]'' a diminutive of ''gobel'' (cf. ''[[Wiktionary:kobold|kobold]]''). William D.B. Loos notes that ''goblin'' is a Romance-derived word, unlike other Germanic words preferred by [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]].<ref>William D.B. Loos, [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/EnemyMisc.html#Orcs Enemies and Miscellaneous: What was the relationship between Orcs and Goblins?] at [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/ The Tolkien Frequently Asked Questions List] (accessed 3 July 2011)</ref>

==="Goblin" in Tolkien's languages===
In the [[The Etymologies|''Etymologies'']], the Elvish names used to translate "goblin" derive from root [[RUKU#Other versions|ÓROK]] and are:<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref>

*[[Quenya]]: '''''orko''''' (pl. '''''orqi''''')
*[[Noldorin]]: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'', archaic ''yrchy''<ref>{{VT|46a}}, p. 7</ref>)
*[[Nandorin|Danian]]: '''''urc''''' (pl. '''''yrc''''')
*[[Doriathrin]]: '''''urch''''' (pl. '''''urchin''''')

In an early linguistic writing, Tolkien translated the [[Gnomish]] word ''Gong'' as "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin."<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}

==Controversy==
Tolkien's Orcs have been a subject of criticism of [[racism]]. Tolkien described Orcs as "squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types".<ref>{{L|210}}</ref>

==Other writings==
In ''[[The Father Christmas Letters]]'', goblins appear as the enemies of [[Father Christmas]] and the [[Red Elves]].

==Portrayal in adaptations==
===Orcs===
{{stub}}<gallery>File: The Lord of the Rings (1978 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (1978 film)]]
File:The Return of the King (1980 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Return of the King (1980 film)|''The Return of the King'' (1980 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings- The Treason of Isengard - Ork.jpg|Concept art of an orc in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Treason of Isengard]]''
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Orc3.jpg|An Orc in [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''.</gallery>

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Orc-kind is a genus that includes the species of Orcs, Goblins, [[Hobgoblins]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Boggarts]], [[Bugans]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

:Orcs are very common in Middle-earth. They are about the size of a man with a hunchback, though some of the sub-races are of larger or smaller stature.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Orcs are first seen in [[Fornost]], where they immediately attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] as they near the citadel.<ref name=Main>[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]], Chapter 1: Fornost, ''Main Gate''</ref> ''Orc warriors'' are stronger then normal Orcs. Some Orcs have been taught [[Magic|sorcery]] by [[Agandaûr]], these are known as ''Orc Sorcerers''.

===Goblins===
<gallery>File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1977 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Goblins1.jpg|Goblins in the pits of [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''
File:The Hobbit - An Unexpected Journey - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in ''[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]''</gallery>

'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War of the Ring]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2006: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-earth II]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Goblins are a separate race and can be found in [[Evendim]], [[the Shire]], [[Ered Luin]], [[Bree-land]], [[Lone-lands]], [[North Downs]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]] and [[Moria]]. They are small in stature; a little shorter than [[Hobbits]]. In contrast, Orcs are about the size of [[Men]]. Goblins are also weaker than the orcs.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Goblins first appear in [[Fornost Erain]], where they attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] immediately when they reach the city.<ref name=Main></ref> Goblins are weaker than Orcs.

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:Goblins are again made clearly distinct from Orcs in the film series. They are lesser relatives of Orcs; they are smaller (the very large Great Goblin notwithstanding), less powerful, and generally have pale, diseased skin, riddled with warts.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:A band of "Goblin mercenaries" appear on [[Ravenhill]] during the [[Battle of Five Armies]], but are taken care of by the Dwarves without much trouble.

==See also==
*[[Gongs]]
*[[:Category:Images of Goblins|Images of Goblins]]

{{references|note}}
[[Category:Orcs| ]]
[[Category:Races]]
[[Category:Servants of Melkor]]
[[Category:Servants of Saruman]]
[[Category:Servants of Sauron]]
[[de:Orks]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/orques/orques]]
[[fi:Örkit]]

Orcs

2021-04-22T02:41:19Z

Trahald: /* Orc */

{{rewrite}}{{sources}}
{{race infobox
| name=Orcs
| image=[[File:John Howe - In Mordor.jpg|250px]]
| caption="In Mordor" by [[John Howe]]
| pronun=
| othernames=Goblins, [[Glamhoth]], [[Yrch]]
| origin=Obscure, but apparently bred from [[Elves]] or [[Men]]
| location=[[Utumno]], [[Angband]], [[Mordor]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]], [[Mount Gundabad]], [[High Pass]], [[Dol Guldur]], [[Isengard]]
| affiliation=[[Morgoth]], [[Sauron]]
| rivalry=[[Elves]], [[Men]], [[Dwarves]]
| language=[[Black Speech]]; numerous [[Orkish]] languages; [[Westron]]
| people=[[Uruk-hai]], [[Goblin-men]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Hobgoblins]], [[Orcs of Mordor|Mordor Orcs]], [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains|Misty Mountain Orcs]]
| members=[[Othrod]], [[Azog]], [[Bolg]], [[Gorbag]], [[Great Goblin]], [[Grishnákh]]
| lifespan=Unknown
| distinctions=Evil footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Evil]]; preferred darkness
| height=Short<ref>{{FR|II5}} The "huge" orc-chieftain is described as "almost man high"</ref>
| hair=
| skin=Sallow, green, brown, grey, black, swarthy
| clothing=
| weapons=
}}
'''Orcs''' (also called '''[[Orcs#Orcs and goblins|Goblins]]''') were the footsoldiers of the [[Dark Lord|Dark Lords]] - [[Morgoth]] and [[Sauron]].

==History==
===Origins and early years===
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}
The Orcs were bred by [[Melkor]] in mockery of the [[Elves]], sometime during the [[The Darkness#The Great Darkness|Great Darkness]].<ref>{{S|3}}</ref><ref>{{TT|III4}}</ref> How this was done is unclear, as the Dark Lord did not possess the power to create life, only to corrupt it. It is unknown whether corrupted Elves, [[Men]] or other creatures were used to achieve this.

[[File:John Howe - Orc Swordsman.jpg|thumb|200px|right|''Orc Swordsman'' by [[John Howe]]]]

It is unclear exactly when Orcs were created, but it certainly happened before the [[Battle of the Powers]] in his stronghold of Utumno. Whether the Orcs were at this time a capable fighting force against the host of Valinor is not known. But at least some of them survived this war, probably hidden in the deep vaults of [[Angband]], and multiplied, waiting for their master.

They first came out of Angband in {{YT|1330}}, passing over the mountains to [[Beleriand]] with other dark creatures.<ref>{{GA|26-27}}</ref>

When Melkor (now known as [[Morgoth]]) returned to Middle-earth, he created new hordes of Orcs and invaded [[Beleriand]], where the [[First Battle of Beleriand]] took place. Orcs also fought in [[Dagor-nuin-Giliath]].

===First Age===
Orcs appear in the [[First Age]] as the core force of [[Morgoth]]. Hundreds of thousands of Orcs were bred in [[Angband]] to participate in the [[Battles of Beleriand]], which lasted 587 years.

Orcs first appear in the [[First Age]] in the [[Battle of the Lammoth]], where they were defeated by [[Fingolfin]] and his [[Noldor]]. Orcs participated in battles such as the [[Dagor Aglareb]], [[Dagor Bragollach]], [[Nirnaeth Arnoediad]], [[Fall of the Falas]], and finally in the [[War of Wrath]], where they were almost extinguished. Those that survived the defeat fled eastwards and hid probably in the Mountains of [[Angmar]] and the [[Ered Mithrin]].

===Second Age===
Around the year {{SA|1000}} Sauron reappeared, took the land of [[Mordor]] as his realm and started the construction of [[Barad-dûr]]. It is likely that most of his servants were Orcs at this time that he had gathered under his command. Still for a long time Sauron's foul servants did not play an important role, for the Dark Lord had chosen a more subtle way to overthrow the free people by creating the [[Rings of Power]].

During the [[War of the Elves and Sauron]], in {{SA|1700}}, Orcs formed the main power of Sauron's host. Despite the immeasurable number of Orcs, Sauron was defeated by the united hosts of Elves and [[Númenóreans]]. Still Sauron was powerful east of the [[Misty Mountains]] and the Orcs that inhabited the mountains and the eastern lands multiplied.

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]] started a war against the [[Dwarves]], resulting in the [[First Sack of Gundabad]] and its occupation by the Orcs. Finally, Orcs were the core force of [[Sauron]] during the [[War of the Last Alliance]], and fought in great battles such as the [[Battle of Dagorlad]] and the [[Siege of Barad-dûr]].

===Third Age===
[[File:Richard Sullivan - Orc.jpg|thumb|left|''Orc'' by [[:Category:Images by Richard Sullivan|Richard Sullivan]]]]
During the [[Third Age]], Orcs were the standard troops of [[Sauron]] (both in [[Mordor]] and in [[Dol Guldur]]), and his great servants - such as the [[Witch-king]] and [[Saruman]].

In [[Angmar]], Orcs fought for the Witch-king in the [[Angmar War]]. Years later, they invaded [[Eriador]] under the leadership of the [[Necromancer]].

The [[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]], one of the few (more or less) independent Orcish societies, and their leader [[Azog]] started out the [[War of the Dwarves and Orcs]], and after their defeat they retreated in their caves. They appeared again in {{TA|2941}}, when the [[Battle of Five Armies]] took place, suffering yet another terrible loss.

In his efforts to hinder the people of [[Rohan]], Saruman began to gather Orcs from the Mountains for his army in [[Isengard]], experimenting on them to fashion himself greater soldiers such as [[Half-orcs]], [[Goblin-men]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

The [[Orcs of Mordor]] fought in major battles during the [[War of the Ring]], such as the [[Battle of the Pelennor Fields]], but the majority of [[Mordor]]'s forces were destroyed or scattered at the [[Battle of the Morannon]]. Sporadic fighting in the following weeks led to the Orcs finally being driven out of the western end of Mordor, though it is unclear how many Orcs Sauron had in his armies, and it is also unclear how many survived after his defeat.

The Orcs in [[Dol Guldur]] remained in [[Mirkwood]] until the [[Fall of Dol Guldur]], one of the last battles of the War of the Ring.

===Fourth Age and beyond===
The fate of the Orcs after the Third Age is unknown. Though many of Sauron's Orcs fought on and were slain in the weeks following the Battle of the Morannon, the true number of Sauron's hosts is unclear, as are the numbers of Orcs not within Mordor that may still inhabit the rest of Middle-earth. It is at least known that the Orcs of Moria either fled or were slain by the Fourth Age, as it is mentioned that the Dwarves managed to retake Moria and the mines within it.

==Characteristics==

===Culture===
It is certain all Orcs were dependent on the Dark Lords in various ways: after the War of Wrath, the Orcs were confused and dismayed without Morgoth, and were easily scattered by their enemies. In the millennia after his defeat and banishment from Arda, they were without a leader and degenerated into small, quarrelsome tribes hiding in wild places, such as the [[Misty Mountains]] and the [[Mountains of Angmar]]. Orcs remained a threat to travelers and isolated settlements, and when united could pose a great regional threat, but they could never amount to the force they were under Morgoth. Only when Sauron returned to power did they begin to reclaim their old power. The same happened after Sauron's defeat by the [[Last Alliance of Elves and Men]]: only under the Witch-King's command, and when Sauron returned as the Necromancer of [[Mirkwood]], did the Orcs become a real danger for all of Middle-earth again. Orcs were warlike and often cruel, fighting with reckless ferocity and delighting in the slaughter and torture of their foes; many had a cowardly nature however, and were often regarded as inferior, though far more expendable, than the soldiers of Men, Elves, and Dwarves. It is said that Sauron, at the height of his power, had greater control over the Orcs than Morgoth had, though this was because he had not yet spent himself in dominating others as well as due to a lesser threat posed by his adversaries than those of his predecessor. Orcs also proved themselves adept at taming and riding [[Wolves]] and even [[Wargs]], an abillity harnessed by the Dark Lords for their armies.

===Lifespan===
It is unknown if the Orcs were immortal like the Elves. There is, in any case, a hint for a long lifespan in the story of two of the most famous Orc-chieftains: [[Azog]] and [[Bolg]]. Bolg, being the son of Azog, was the chieftain of the Orcs who attacked Erebor in the Battle of Five Armies in {{TA|2941}}. Azog himself was killed in the Battle of Azanulbizar in {{TA|2799}}, so Bolg was at least 150 years old.

===Appearance===
Orcs were described as smaller in stature than Men on average, strong but crooked in frame and bow-legged. One "huge orc-chieftain" was described as "almost Man-high", but some must have been of a similar size to Hobbits (Frodo and Sam succeeded in disguising themselves as Orcs in Mordor). Their overall appearance varied: they had long arms and fanged mouths; Tolkien describes them as "swart" or "sallow", although one in Mordor is "black-skinned" and others are described generally as "black" (possibly not a reference to skin colour).

===Kinds of orcs===
The Fellowship usually encountered the large soldier-Orcs bred for war, and sometimes the "snaga" variety which were more geared towards being labourers. Another type is referred to as "snufflers", smaller, black-skinned Orcs with wide nostrils, who excelled in tracking. Despite the smaller size, one snuffler was able to skillfully kill a soldier-orc when they got into a disagreement.<ref name="Cirith">{{RK|VI1}}</ref>

*[[Snaga]]
*[[Snufflers]]
*[[Orcs of Mordor]]
*[[Orcs of the Misty Mountains]]
*[[Half-orcs]] (and [[Goblin-men]])
*[[Uruk-hai]]
*[[Hobgoblins]]

[[File:Darek Zabrocki - Goblins.jpg|thumb|250px|''Goblins'' by [[:Category:Images by Darek Zabrocki|Darek Zabrocki]]]]

===Orcs and goblins===
The term ''goblin'' was used primarily in ''[[The Hobbit]]'' but also in ''[[The Lord of the Rings]]'' where it is used synonymously with "Orc".<ref>{{TT|III1}}</ref><ref>{{HM|RC}}, p. 24</ref>

"Goblin" is an English word, whereas "Orc" is Old English, the language used by Tolkien to represent Rohirric.<ref>{{App|F1iv}}</ref> Thus, there is no difference between Orcs and Goblins.

==Etymology==
{{quote|The word as far as I am concerned actually derived from [[Old English]] ''orc'', demon, but only because of its phonetic suitability.|[[J.R.R. Tolkien]] in [[Letter 144]]}}
===Orc===
The word '''''Orc''''' is said to be the "''form of the name that other races had for this foul people as it was in the [[Rohirric|language of Rohan]]''".<ref name=App|F1iv/>

In his late, post-''Lord of the Rings'' writings, Tolkien preferred the spelling '''''Ork'''''.<ref>{{HM|PM}}</ref>

It also is "supposed to be the CS[Common Speech] name of these creatures at that time"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>.

The statement may be ambiguous due to Tolkien's use of the term Common Speech for both Westron and English. But Tolkien continued to say "It should therefore according to the system be translated into E[English]. or the LT[Langauge of Translation]. It was translated 'goblin' in The H.[Hobbit]"<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>. This may suggest it is a genuine Westron word, which Tolkien kept untranslated because he liked the sound of it: "In any case orc seemed to me, and seems, in sound a good name for these creatures. It should be retained."<ref>{{HM|RC}}</ref>

Fictionally, it is then possibly derived from 'orch', the [[Sindarin]] word for Orc. The original sense of the word seems to be "bogey", "bogeyman", that is, something that provokes fear, as seen in the Quenya cognate ''urko'', pl. ''urqui''.<ref>{{HM|WJ}} Quendi and Eldar</ref>

Tolkien derived the word ''orc'' from [[Old English]] believing it refers to a kind of evil spirits,<ref name=L144/> which in turn is thought to derive from Latin ''Orcus'' "Hades", although Tolkien doubted this etymology.<ref>[[J.R.R. Tolkien]], "[[Letter to Gene Wolfe]]" (letter)</ref> He also thought it survives in the modern language for sea-beasts,<ref>{{HM|N}}, p. 762</ref> such as the [[Wikipedia:Orca Whale|Orca Whale]].

''Orc'' is an [[Old English]] word that refers mainly to a kind of metal cup (from Latin ''Urceus'').<ref group="note">The word ''Orc'' occurs twice in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]''.</ref> However, in an 11th century glossary, this entry was conflated with another entry which refers to evil giants such as ''[[Wikipedia:Jötunn|þyrs]]'' and other monsters, also glossed in Latin as ''Orcus''. This merge of the two entries made many philologists of the previous centuries, like Tolkien, to believe that ''Orc'' was an actual Old English word that refers to any kind of evil creature from the underworld.<ref>Bosworth and Toller's ''An Anglo-Saxon Dictionary'' (1898), corrected in later editions</ref>

The word ''Orcnéas'' is once found only in ''[[Beowulf (poem)|Beowulf]]'' (lines 112-113) and is cited as an example of the word "Orc" in Old English text. Actually its meaning is not clear, and it is thought to refer to corpses (''néas'') from the Underworld.

==="Orcs" in Tolkien's languages===
Tolkien said that one of the reason of choosing "Orc" over "Goblin" was the similarity with his fictional languages.<ref name=WJAC>{{WJ|AC}}, pp. 389-91</ref> Indeed most [[Elvish]], [[Mannish]] and other words for Orc, are similar to the English word.

The basic [[Primitive Quendian]] [[Sundocarme|root]], from which the words for Orc derive, is [[RUKU]] (said to refer to any "bogey" that scared the Elves)<ref name=WJAC/>:

*[[Quenya]] '''''orco'''''<ref name=PE17_47/> (pl. '''''Orkor'''''<ref>{{GA|27}}, p. 12</ref><ref>{{HM|MR}}, pp. 74, 194</ref>); [[Exilic Quenya]] '''''urko''''' (pl. '''''orkor''''' and '''''orqui''''')<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Sindarin]]: '''''orch'''''/'''''Orch''''' (pl. '''''yrch'''''/'''''Yrch''''', class pl. '''''Orchoth'''''/'''''orchoth'''''<ref group="note">''Orchoth'' is likely a compound of ''orch'' + ''[[hoth]]''.</ref>)<ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144/><ref name=PE17_52-4/><ref name=PE17_47/><ref name=App|F1iv/>; '''''[[glamhoth]]'''''
*[[Nandorin]]: '''''ūriʃ'''''<ref name=PE17_52-4>{{PE|17}}, pp. 52-4</ref>

*[[Adûnaic]]: '''''urku''''', '''''urkhu'''''<ref name=WJAC/>
*[[Westron]]: '''''orka'''''<ref name=PE17_47>{{PE|17}}, p. 47</ref>
*[[Black Speech]]: '''''[[Uruk-hai#Etymology|uruk]]'''''<ref name=App|F1iv>{{App|F1iv}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/><ref name=L144>{{L|144}}</ref><ref name=PE17_47/>
*[[Khuzdul]]: '''''Rukhs''''' (pl. '''''Rakhās'''''), possibly derived from an unknown [[Avarin]] word of the same meaning<ref name=WJAC/><ref group="note">''Rukhs'' appears to contain the radical R-Kh-S.</ref>
*[[Drúadan language]]: '''''gorgûn''''' ("orc-folk"; the form ''gorgûn'' is perhaps plural of an unknown singular form)<ref name=PE17_99>{{PE|17}}, p. 99</ref><ref>{{RK|V5}}</ref><ref name=WJAC/>

In the earliest versions of [[Qenya]], Tolkien had words such as "'''Ork (orq-)''' pl. '''Orqi''' and fem. "'''orqindi'''".{{fact}}

In [[Noldorin]], the earlier version of Sindarin, the word for Orc is the same: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'').<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref><ref>{{MR|P3I7}}, p. 195</ref><ref>{{MC|Secret}}, p. 217</ref> The [[Gnomish]] word for "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin" is said to be '''''Gong'''''.<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

*''See also: [[Entish]] ''[[burárum]]''
===Goblin===
''[[Wiktionary:goblin|Goblin]]'' is a folk word which according to ''The Concise Oxford Dictionary of Current English'' is probably derived from the Anglo-French ''[[Wiktionary:gobelin|gobelin]]'' a diminutive of ''gobel'' (cf. ''[[Wiktionary:kobold|kobold]]''). William D.B. Loos notes that ''goblin'' is a Romance-derived word, unlike other Germanic words preferred by [[J.R.R. Tolkien|Tolkien]].<ref>William D.B. Loos, [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/EnemyMisc.html#Orcs Enemies and Miscellaneous: What was the relationship between Orcs and Goblins?] at [http://tolkien.slimy.com/tfaq/ The Tolkien Frequently Asked Questions List] (accessed 3 July 2011)</ref>

==="Goblin" in Tolkien's languages===
In the [[The Etymologies|''Etymologies'']], the Elvish names used to translate "goblin" derive from root [[RUKU#Other versions|ÓROK]] and are:<ref name=LR379>{{LR|Etymologies}}, p. 379 (entry for ÓROK)</ref>

*[[Quenya]]: '''''orko''''' (pl. '''''orqi''''')
*[[Noldorin]]: ''orch'' (pl ''yrch'', archaic ''yrchy''<ref>{{VT|46a}}, p. 7</ref>)
*[[Nandorin|Danian]]: '''''urc''''' (pl. '''''yrc''''')
*[[Doriathrin]]: '''''urch''''' (pl. '''''urchin''''')

In an early linguistic writing, Tolkien translated the [[Gnomish]] word ''Gong'' as "one of a tribe of the orcs. a goblin."<ref>{{PE|11}}, p. 41</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
{{Main|Orcs/Origin}}

==Controversy==
Tolkien's Orcs have been a subject of criticism of [[racism]]. Tolkien described Orcs as "squat, broad, flat-nosed, sallow-skinned, with wide mouths and slant eyes: in fact degraded and repulsive versions of the (to Europeans) least lovely Mongol-types".<ref>{{L|210}}</ref>

==Other writings==
In ''[[The Father Christmas Letters]]'', goblins appear as the enemies of [[Father Christmas]] and the [[Red Elves]].

==Portrayal in adaptations==
===Orcs===
{{stub}}<gallery>File: The Lord of the Rings (1978 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Lord of the Rings (1978 film)|''The Lord of the Rings'' (1978 film)]]
File:The Return of the King (1980 film) - Orcs.jpg|Orcs in [[The Return of the King (1980 film)|''The Return of the King'' (1980 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings- The Treason of Isengard - Ork.jpg|Concept art of an orc in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Treason of Isengard]]''
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Orc3.jpg|An Orc in [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''.</gallery>

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Orc-kind is a genus that includes the species of Orcs, Goblins, [[Hobgoblins]], [[Half-orcs]], [[Boggarts]], [[Bugans]] and [[Uruk-hai]].

:Orcs are very common in Middle-earth. They are about the size of a man with a hunchback, though some of the sub-races are of larger or smaller stature.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Orcs are first seen in [[Fornost]], where they immediately attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] as they near the citadel.<ref name=Main>[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]], Chapter 1: Fornost, ''Main Gate''</ref> ''Orc warriors'' are stronger then normal Orcs. Some Orcs have been taught [[Magic|sorcery]] by [[Agandaûr]], these are known as ''Orc Sorcerers''.

===Goblins===
<gallery>File:The Hobbit (1977 film) - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in [[The Hobbit (1977 film)|''The Hobbit'' (1977 film)]]
File:The Lord of the Rings War in the North - Goblins1.jpg|Goblins in the pits of [[Fornost]] in ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]''
File:The Hobbit - An Unexpected Journey - Goblins.jpg|Goblins in ''[[The Hobbit (film series)|''The Hobbit'' (film series)]]''</gallery>

'''2003: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War of the Ring]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2006: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: The Battle for Middle-earth II]]'':'''
:Goblins have been made clearly distinct from Orcs.

'''2007: ''[[The Lord of the Rings Online]]'':'''
:Goblins are a separate race and can be found in [[Evendim]], [[the Shire]], [[Ered Luin]], [[Bree-land]], [[Lone-lands]], [[North Downs]], [[Misty Mountains]], [[Angmar]] and [[Moria]]. They are small in stature; a little shorter than [[Hobbits]]. In contrast, Orcs are about the size of [[Men]]. Goblins are also weaker than the orcs.

'''2011: ''[[The Lord of the Rings: War in the North]]'':'''
:Goblins first appear in [[Fornost Erain]], where they attack [[Eradan (video game character)|Eradan]], [[Andriel]] and [[Farin (video game character)|Farin]] immediately when they reach the city.<ref name=Main></ref> Goblins are weaker than Orcs.

'''2012: ''[[The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey]]'':'''
:Goblins are again made clearly distinct from Orcs in the film series. They are lesser relatives of Orcs; they are smaller (the very large Great Goblin notwithstanding), less powerful, and generally have pale, diseased skin, riddled with warts.

'''2014: ''[[The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies]]'':'''
:A band of "Goblin mercenaries" appear on [[Ravenhill]] during the [[Battle of Five Armies]], but are taken care of by the Dwarves without much trouble.

==See also==
*[[Gongs]]
*[[:Category:Images of Goblins|Images of Goblins]]

{{references|note}}
[[Category:Orcs| ]]
[[Category:Races]]
[[Category:Servants of Melkor]]
[[Category:Servants of Saruman]]
[[Category:Servants of Sauron]]
[[de:Orks]]
[[fr:encyclo/peuples/orques/orques]]
[[fi:Örkit]]

Reunited Kingdom

2021-01-13T07:52:41Z

Trahald: /* Later History */

{{Sources}}
{{kingdom
| image=[[File:Sage - Reunited Kingdom.png|250px]]
| name=Reunited Kingdom
| pronun=
| othernames=
| location=[[Arnor]] and [[Gondor]]<ref name="Appendix A">{{App|Mark}}, Third Line</ref>
| capital=[[Annúminas]] ([[Arnor]]) [[Minas Tirith]] ([[Gondor]])<ref name="Elendil">{{PM|Elendil}}</ref>
| towns='''Arnor''' [[Bree]], [[Bywater]], [[Fornost Erain]], [[Hobbiton]], [[Michel Delving]], [[Tuckborough]] '''Gondor''' [[Calembel]], [[Dol Amroth]], [[Erech]], [[Linhir]], [[Pelargir]], [[Umbar]]
| regions='''Arnor''' [[Arthedain]], [[Cardolan]], [[Rhudaur]] '''Gondor''' [[Anfalas]], [[Anórien]], [[Belfalas]], [[Dorwinion]], [[Enedwaith]] (shared with [[Arnor]]), [[Ithilien]], [[Lamedon]], [[Lebennin]], [[Lossarnach]], [[South Gondor]]
| population=Primarily [[Men]] (many [[Hobbits]] in [[the Shire]] and [[Bree-land]])
| language=[[Westron]], [[Númenórean Sindarin]], [[Quenya]], [[Hobbitish]]
| govern1=[[High King (Dúnedain)|High King]]
| govern2=[[Council of Gondor]]<ref name="politics"/>
| govern3=
| currency=[[tharni]], [[castar]]<ref>{{PM|Languages}}</ref>
| holiday=[[Cormarë]]
| precededby=[[Arnor]], [[Gondor]]
| event1=Established
| event1date=[[1 May]], {{TA|3019}}
| event2=
| event2date=
| event3=
| event3date=
| event4=
| event4date=
| event5=
| event5date=
| followedby=
}}

{{quote|Thus peace came again, and a new Spring opened on earth; and the Heir of Isildur was crowned King of Gondor and Arnor, and the might of the Dúnedain was lifted up and their glory renewed.|''[[The Silmarillion]]'', "[[Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age]]"}}

The '''Reunited Kingdom''' was the restored kingdom of [[Arnor]] and [[Gondor]], the twin kingdoms founded at the end of the [[Second Age]] by [[Elendil]] and his sons [[Isildur]] and [[Anárion]]. In the beginning, Elendil was [[High King of the Dúnedain|High King]] of both realms, but the two were divided after the deaths of his sons. Over 3,000 years later [[Aragorn|Aragorn Elessar]] reunited the kingdoms and ruled as [[High King of the Dúnedain|High King]] of the newly-founded Reunited Kingdom.
==Geography==
During Aragorn's reign, the Reunited Kingdom was comprised of the old realms of [[Arnor]] and [[Gondor]], excluding only [[Rohan]] (the [[Oath of Eorl|grant]] of which he renewed); and [[the Shire]], the [[Drúadan Forest]], and the [[Treegarth of Orthanc]] (which became protectorates).<ref name="Appendix A"/>

The Reunited Kingdom included all the lands of [[Arnor]]; all of [[Eriador]], except the [[Lindon|regions]] beyond the [[Lune]], and the lands east of [[Greyflood]] and [[Loudwater]], in which lay [[Rivendell]] and [[Eregion]].<ref name="Eriador">{{App|Eriador}}</ref>

In [[Gondor]], the realm extended:<ref name="AppGondor">{{App|Gondor}}</ref>

* North to the [[Field of Celebrant]] and the southern eaves of [[Mirkwood]]<ref name="AppGondor"/>
* West to the [[Greyflood]]<ref name="AppGondor"/>
* East to the inland [[Sea of Rhûn]]<ref name="AppGondor"/>
* South to the [[River Harnen]], and also along the coast to the peninsula and haven of [[Umbar]]<ref name="AppGondor"/>

==Politics==
The [[Númenórean]] [[High King (Dúnedain)|High King]] governed the realm with the frame of ancient law, of which he was administrator (and interpreter) but not the maker.<ref name="politics">{{L|244}}</ref>

In all debatable matters of importance domestic, or external, however, even [[Denethor II|Denethor]] had a [[Council of Gondor|Council]], and at least listened to what the Lords of the Fiefs and the Captains of the Forces had to say.<ref name="politics"/> [[Aragorn]] re-established the [[Council of Gondor|Great Council of Gondor]], and in that [[Faramir]], who remained by inheritance the [[Steward]] (or representative of the King during his absence abroad, or sickness, or between his death and the accession of his heir) was his chief counsellor.<ref name="politics"/>

After his accession, [[Aragorn]] established a council in [[Arnor]], because in {{FoA|13}}, he chose three [[Counsellor of the North-kingdom|Counsellors of the North-kingdom]] from the people of [[the Shire]] and [[Buckland]].<ref name="AppBLater">{{App|B5}}</ref> These Counsellors were those appointed to the positions of the [[Thain]] and [[Mayor of the Shire]], and the [[Master of Buckland]].<ref name="AppBLater"/>

==History==
===Background===
{{main|Realms in Exile}}
At the end of the [[Second Age]], [[Elendil]] and his sons established two great kingdoms in [[Middle-earth]]: [[Arnor]] in the north and [[Gondor]] in the south. These [[Kingdoms of the Dúnedain]] were united under a single [[High King of the Dúnedain|High King]], [[Elendil]] himself, who ruled the [[Arnor|North-kingdom]] while his sons reigned jointly over the South-kingdom of [[Gondor]].<ref name=rings>{{s|Rings}}</ref>

In the first years of the [[Third Age]], this union failed. After the loss of [[Isildur]] at the [[Disaster of the Gladden Fields]], his nephew [[Meneldil]] took up the [[Kings of Gondor|kingship of Gondor]], and that country remained independent from the [[North-kingdom]] through most of the [[Third Age]].<ref name=rings/>

In the north, the realm of Arnor fell into troubled times. It broke into three separate kingdoms, and in time these too were lost, so that the Dúnedain of the North-kingdom of Elendil were reduced to a wandering people led by a [[Chieftains of the Dúnedain|Chieftain]]. Nonetheless, they were able to maintain Isildur's line in unbroken descent.<ref name=rings/>

There were two attempts to reunite the kingdoms, but only the second of these was successful. The first of these occurred in {{TA|1944}} when [[Arvedui]], [[King of Arthedain]], claimed the [[High King (Dúnedain)|High Kingship]] of the [[Two Kingdoms]].<ref name="AppGondor"/> His claim was rejected by Steward [[Pelendur]] and the [[Council of Gondor]], who elected to maintain their independence.<ref name="AppGondor"/>

Soon enough, the line of [[King of Gondor|Kings]] failed in [[Gondor]] too; [[Eärnur]] was lost without heirs. Its rule was taken up by the [[Stewards]] of the [[House of Húrin]].<ref name=rings/>

===Reunification===
====Reign of Elessar====
More than a thousand years later, after the [[War of the Ring]], Arvedui's direct descendant, [[Aragorn]], came forward to make the same claim. This time, the people of Gondor accepted a [[High King of the Dúnedain|High King]], and the Two Kingdoms were restored and reunited at last.

[[Aragorn]] restored [[Gondor]] and repeopled it, but retained [[Minas Tirith]] as the chief city.<ref name="Elendil"/> He rebuilt [[Annúminas]] and when he went north, would rule from there.<ref name="Eriador"/> He also had the ruins of [[Fornost Erain]] rebuilt and made it a great city where [[Men]] dwelt once again.<ref name="Bound">{{RK|VI7}}</ref> [[The Shire]] was an exception to this, and though it lay within the Reunited Kingdom, Aragorn made a law that Men should not enter it, a law that he observed himself.<ref name="Eriador"/>

During his reign, he, alongside [[King of Rohan|King]] [[Éomer]], led military campaigns beyond the [[Sea of Rhûn]] and on the far fields of the [[South]].<ref name="Appendix A">{{App|Mark}}</ref> The threat of the [[Corsairs of Umbar|Corsairs]] was finally completely subdued during his reign.<ref name="AppGondor"/> He also made peace with the [[Haradrim]] after his coronation.<ref name="RK-StewardKing">{{RK|VI5}}</ref>

====Later History====
After Aragorn's death in {{FoA|120}},<ref name="Tale">{{App|Tale}}</ref> his son [[Eldarion]] took up the High Kingship.<ref name="Tale"/> It is said that Eldarion's reign would have lasted for about 100 years after the death of Aragorn.<ref name="L338">{{L|338}}</ref>
Of [[Eldarion]], it was foretold that he should rule a great realm, and that it should endure for a hundred generations of [[Men]] after him, that is until a new age brought in again new things; and from him should come the kings of many realms in long days after. But if this foretelling spoke truly, none now can say, for [[Gondor]] and [[Arnor]] are no more; and even the chronicles of the [[House of Telcontar|House of Elessar]] and all their deeds and glory are lost.<ref name="Third">{{PM|Third}}</ref>

==Other versions of the legendarium==
In an unfinished story set some 220 years after the fall of Sauron, the Reunited Kingdom encountered a renewal of [[Morgoth]]-worship known as the [[Dark Tree]].<ref>{{PM|Shadow}}</ref> However, J.R.R. Tolkien did not finish this story, because he "discovered that the King's Peace would contain no tales worth recounting".<ref name="L338"/>

{{references}}
[[category:Gondor]]
[[category:Arnor]]
[[Category:Mannish realms]]

[[de:Wiedervereinigtes Königreich]]
[[fr:encyclo/geographie/royaumes/royaume_reunifie]]
[[fi:Jällen yhdistetty Valtakunta]]

House of Telcontar

2021-01-13T07:50:33Z

Trahald: /* History */

{{sources}}
{{Noble House infobox
| name=House of Telcontar
| image=[[File:Rondador - House of Telcontar.png|250px]]
| caption=
| othernames=
| founder=[[Aragorn II]]
| location=[[Reunited Kingdom]]
| affiliation=
| rivalry=
| destroyed=
| language=[[Westron]]
| members=
| race=[[Dúnedain]]
| distinctions=
| height=
| hair=
| skin=
| clothing=
| weapons=[[Andúril]]
| heirlooms=[[Crown of Gondor]], [[Elfstone]]
| gallery=the House of Telcontar
}}
The '''House of Telcontar''' was the Royal House of the [[Reunited Kingdom]] of [[Arnor]] and [[Gondor]] in the [[Fourth Age]]. The House was founded by [[Aragorn|Aragorn II]] after the [[War of the Ring]], who was the Heir of Elendil, and took the throne under the name Elessar.

The name ''Telcontar'' ([[Quenya|Q]], pron. {{IPA|[telˈkontar]}}) was a translation into [[Quenya]] of Aragorn's common nickname in the north, "[[Strider (Aragorn)|Strider]]".<ref>{{RK|Houses}}</ref>

==History==
During the War of the Ring, [[Peregrin Took]], a companion of Aragorn's in the [[Fellowship of the Ring]], became a member of the elite Citadel Guard at [[Minas Tirith]], capital of Gondor. When Aragorn entered the city, Peregrin persisted in crudely referring to Aragorn by the nickname he had garnered as a Ranger of the North: "Strider", even in front of foreign dignitaries such as King [[Éomer]] of [[Rohan]]. Aragorn was amused and decided that the name of the lineage he founded would be "Telcontar", which means "Strider" in Quenya. Aragorn then took the royal name "Elessar".

With Queen [[Arwen]], King Elessar reigned for 120 years, before finally surrendering his life. This long reign is attributed to Elessar's descent from the Men of [[Númenor]], who are blessed with long life (he was 87 when he took the throne). He rebuilt the old capital [[Annúminas]] in Arnor and later ruled from this northern capital, although the old capital Minas Tirith was still of great political importance. Elessar had one known son, [[Eldarion]], and an unspecified number of daughters.

After Aragorn's death in {{FoA|120}},<ref name="Tale">{{App|Tale}}</ref> his son [[Eldarion]] took up the High Kingship.<ref name="Tale"/> One hundred years into his reign, he encountered a renewal of [[Morgoth]]-worship known as the "[[Dark Tree]]".<ref>{{PM|Shadow}}</ref> In a 1972 letter concerning ''[[The New Shadow]]'', Tolkien mentioned that Eldarion's reign would have lasted for about 100 years after the death of Aragorn.<ref name="L338">{{L|338}}</ref>

Of Eldarion, it was foretold that he should rule a great realm, and that it should endure for a hundred generations of [[Men]] after him, that is until a new age brought in again new things; and from him should come the kings of many realms in long days after.<ref name="Elendil">{{PM|Elendil}}</ref> But if this foretelling spoke truly, none now can say, for [[Gondor]] and [[Arnor]] are no more; and even the chronicles of the House of Telcontar and all their deeds and glory are lost.<ref name="Third">{{PM|Third}}</ref>

==Genealogy==
The House of Telcontar:<ref>{{HM|AA}}</ref><ref>{{HM|AB}}</ref>
{{familytree/start}}
{{familytree | ARA |y| ARW |ARA='''[[Aragorn|Elessar]]''' ''{{TA|2931}} - {{FoA|120}}''|ARW=[[Arwen]] ''{{TA|241}} - {{FoA|121}}''}}
{{familytree | |,|-|^|-|.| |}}
{{familytree | ELD | | SDS | ELD='''[[Eldarion]]''' ''b. early {{FoA}} - c. {{FoA|220}}''|SDS=''several daughters''}}
{{familytree/end}}

{{references}}
[[Category:Quenya names]]
[[Category:House of Telcontar| ]]
[[Category:Mannish Noble Houses|Telcontar]]

Talk:Emyn Arnen

2020-07-29T03:12:13Z

Trahald:

The hills of Emyn Arnen were claimed to be "in fact, an eastern spur of the White Mountains" in some non-canon sources (The Tolkien Companion, The Council of Elrond), but no reference is given.
And I remember reading that they were (or looked to be) cut off from Ered Nimrais by Anduin, something like that, indicating Emyn Arnen could have been part of Ered Nimrais ages ago.But ... I'm not sure. I can't find it anywhere in the books.
I may have misremembered, but can someone confirm what I think I remember and provide a reference? I think this is worth noting. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 03:10, 29 July 2020 (UTC)

Talk:Emyn Arnen

2020-07-29T03:10:35Z

Trahald: Created page with "The hills of Emyn Arnen were claimed to be "in fact, an eastern spur of the White Mountains" in some non-canon sources (The Tolkien Companion, The Council of Elrond), but no refe..."

The hills of Emyn Arnen were claimed to be "in fact, an eastern spur of the White Mountains" in some non-canon sources (The Tolkien Companion, The Council of Elrond), but no reference is given.
And I remember reading about the hills of Emyn Arnen were (or looked to be) cut off from Ered Nimrais by Anduin, something like that, indicating Emyn Arnen could have been part of Ered Nimrais ages ago.But ... I'm not sure. I can't find it anywhere in the books.
I may have misremembered, but can someone confirm what I think I remember and provide a reference? I think this is worth noting. [[User:Trahald|Trahald]] 03:10, 29 July 2020 (UTC)