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Talk:Cracks of Doom

Discussion page of Cracks of Doom
Revision as of 13:19, 5 January 2024 by Quentandil (talk | contribs) (Reply)
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Latest comment: 5 January by LorenzoCB
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Which should be the main article, Sammath Naur or Cracks of Doom (I don't think we need two articles on this, so perhaps go for Sammath Naur)? --Morgan 00:00, 27 July 2011 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Cracks of Doom is probably the best known name of the two. -- Ederchil (Talk/Contribs/Edits) 07:01, 27 July 2011 (UTC)Reply[reply]
True, Cracks of Down is a more popular page than Sammath.--Morgan 08:42, 27 July 2011 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I favour Cracks of Doom, because it is probally the best known name. --Amroth 13:55, 27 July 2011 (UTC)Reply[reply]

On the other hand I would suggest a split of the articles. Cracks of Doom is a fissure in the volcano where lava flows. The Sammath Naur means "Chamber of Fire" and is a chamber where a person can walk and it gives access to the Cracks of Doom. The present state of the article suggests that they are the same, and/or that the Chamber is part of the Cracks. Sage 10:42, 4 June 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]

Good point.--Morgan 22:45, 5 June 2013 (UTC)Reply[reply]
I propose to move the page to a page called Sammath Naur and to have this page cover both the Sammath Naur and the Cracks of Doom that is located in the Sammath Naur. Sammath Naur meeans "Chambers of Fire" (not Chamber of Fire as Sage claims, Tolkien uses the plural in his English translation and ath is a plural in Sindarin). From the point of view that the Cracks of Doom is just a feature (i.e. a fissure) within the Sammath Naur (a cave or complex of caves) this would be the logical choice. The content for the Sammath Naur and the content for the Cracks of Doom, especially the History would almost completely overlap, so combining them in one page makes sense. From a purely quantitative point of view, the name Sammath Naur is mentioned six times in LOTR, five times in the narrative and once in Appendix B, the name Chambers of Fire is mentioned once in the narrative of LOTR as the translation of Sammath Naur, the name Cracks of Doom is mentioned six times in LOTR, five times in the narrative and once in Appendix B and the name Crack of Doom is mentioned three times in the narrative of LOTR. Whether a name that is mentioned more often makes it best known is a matter of debate. In my case I remember the name Sammath Naur better than Cracks of Doom, but this is probably because I tend to remember Elvish names better than English names. The Thain's Book has an entry for Chambers of Fire (Sammath Naur) and does not have an entry for Cracks of Doom. The Encyclopedia of Arda as entries for both. The One Wiki to Rule Them All only has an entry for Cracks of Doom and erroneously claims that the Cracks of Doom were also reffered to as Sammath Naur. The german language Ardapedia has entries for Sammath Naur and for Schicksalsklüfte (= Cracks of Doom). I tend to go with the choice of The Thain's Book (a high quality encyclopedia) and to only have a page called Sammath Naur. The page still contains lots of speculative or incorrect content after the edits of Aragorn II and still lacks page numbers or more detailed references. I would be willing to correct the page, because I already did some work on the Sauron's Road page and have already read most the source material. --Akhôrahil (talk) 11:07, 5 January 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]
Disagree. The Cracks are way more remembered and what users will look for. I'm good with having them more differenciated. LorenzoCB (talk) 13:19, 5 January 2024 (UTC)Reply[reply]