I know Tolkien states that there must be some mystery in any mythology, and the origin of Tom Bombadil is one of them, but I would still like to know the opinions of everyone on this matter. As for me, it seems probable that he is one of the Maia, for he does say that he remembers when the elves travelled west. —Unsigned comment by Aragorn47 (talk • contribs).
- He also says that he "knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless — before the Dark Lord came from Outside.". So he was in Arda before even the Ainur. This means he simply can't be categorised. I think, "cosmologically" speaking Tom is a fundamental part of Arda and the Music of the Ainur.--Aule the Smith 10:28, 10 February 2008 (EST)
- I agree with Aüle on this. Tolkien knew his own world so well that he just had to have some mystery. It seems clear to me that he is not of the Maiar because he remembers Melkor's coming. I believe he (along with Goldberry) is some kind of nature spirit. Ingwe 12:06, 10 February 2008 (EST)
- I agree with the final part of the theories which want Tom to be some kind of soul-less sprite, of different nature than the divine forces of Good and Evil and I wanted to expand it if there wasn't that in-use tag. Can we edit yet? Sage 08:39, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
- I planned to write something on the whole enigma part, but if you want to do it, go ahead. The "claimed" template was originally devised so that when someone is making large edits to an article, they don't get an edit conflict because someone else wanted to correct a typo. -- Ederchil 09:07, 31 July 2008 (EDT)
- My preferred solution to the enigma of Tom is that he is the author incarnate, the creator of the legendarium who has taken bodily form to enter and live inside his own creation. In other words, he is Tolkien himself. This interpretation is consistent with most of the textual references, and flows naturally from Tolkien's strong Christian beliefs. As the creator he is of course older than anything in his created world, and because he actually has an existence outside his creation in a wholly different dimension the powerful evils of Middle Earth do not hold sway over him. Finally, the author of a story generally tries to let his characters run their own lives and make their own decisions, rather then forcing them to act according to his own wishes. This explains why Bombadil chooses to live an isolated life, away from and unconcerned with all the important persons and events of Middle-earth, and can not be relied upon as the solution to the problem of the One Ring.—Unsigned comment by Faded Glory (talk • contribs).
- I have heard a similar explanation that says that Tom is "the reader of the book himself". I don't really understand these theories, however they are not actually an "in-universe" solution to the enigma but rather "behind the scenes" literary analyses. So even if we suppose that Tom is actually the author/the reader/Tolkien's son's toy doll, the in-universe enigma remains... Sage 06:14, 17 November 2008 (UTC)
- My preferred solution to the enigma of Tom is that he is the author incarnate, the creator of the legendarium who has taken bodily form to enter and live inside his own creation. In other words, he is Tolkien himself. This interpretation is consistent with most of the textual references, and flows naturally from Tolkien's strong Christian beliefs. As the creator he is of course older than anything in his created world, and because he actually has an existence outside his creation in a wholly different dimension the powerful evils of Middle Earth do not hold sway over him. Finally, the author of a story generally tries to let his characters run their own lives and make their own decisions, rather then forcing them to act according to his own wishes. This explains why Bombadil chooses to live an isolated life, away from and unconcerned with all the important persons and events of Middle-earth, and can not be relied upon as the solution to the problem of the One Ring.—Unsigned comment by Faded Glory (talk • contribs).
Forn is not Khuzdul
Wanted to get some agreement in this before editing.
The info box for the article suggests that Forn is the name of Tom Bombadil in Khuzdul. As far as I am aware (and it is of course hard to rule out all possible references) this is nowhere attested; rather, it is stated that this is his name among the dwarves. It also seems unlikely to be Khuzdul, as the name is an old Norse word, meaning ancient.
As we know, Tolkien translates mannish languages into English and associated Germanic tongues. Languages like Quenya, Sindarin and Khuzdul go untranslated. There is very little attested in any of the original mannish tongues due to this translation convention, with only some proper names and the snippets from the Notion Club Papers to go on for Adunaic, for instance.
Much as Westron is translated into modern English, and the related but ancient language of the Rohirrim into Old English, so the languages of the men of the North such as Dale are translated into other Germanic languages such as old Norse and this is taken to be the explanation for the Norse names of the dwarfs, these being not their unrevealed Khuzdul names, but rather their outer names in mannish tongues for conversation with men and elves. For that reason, I think we can be confident that Forn is a translation of an unknown Kuzdul element, meaning ancient into a northern mannish tongue. The element Gamil is a candidate, as it is conjectured to mean Old, though this is probably an adjectival form.
I suppose one could go further and state that Orald is not his Rohirric name for the same reason, but within the translation convention, it is. The point is that even within the translation convention, I believe that Forn is Bombadil's 'outer' name among the dwarves, rather than his Khuzdul name. Cmsg77 (talk) 18:29, 30 August 2025 (UTC)
- I disagree with the decision by a recent editor to give Forn as Old Norse, when Orald is given as Rohanese. Either Forn is Dalish (with an understanding that Dalish is translated to Old Norse, much as Rohanese is translated to Old Mercian), or Orald is Old Mercian. Either they should both be described by their translated languages, or neither should.
- My position is that it is nonsensical to claim that Tom has a name in ON our OE, because he does not exist in primary reality. Cmsg77 (talk) 11:49, 31 August 2025 (UTC)
- I agree that positively attesting the name as Khuzdul is an overreach. As for what language it *should* be, I don't think we have a firm basis for making a positive statement. General handling of Dalish and Rohanese should be consistent however it's done. --Mord 06:34, 1 September 2025 (UTC)